You're not working class!

[Womeninthesequel]

Ridiculous conversation with an NCT acquaintance - we as a group were discussing the cost of living crisis and it was mentioned that working class families are really going to struggle. He scoffed and said "not all working class families, we're going to be fine." To which I goggled, and said "you're not working class!" He looked cross and said "of course I am, I grew up on a council estate, my dad was a binman."

This is true, he definitely is from a working class background, but he went to university, then med school, is now a senior surgeon doing mainly private practice, he makes six figures (which he'll tell anyone who walks past him) and his house is currently on the market for £1.2mil! He's not working class! This was pointed out to him (not by me) and he was vastly offended. He seems to genuinely believe that his upbringing means he'll always be working class, but that's not right, right? Class isn't innate, is it?

He's a bit of a dick in general, but this has raised a wider conversation at home. DH is from a working class background and is now uni educated and a professional and feels he's now middle class, so is confused by the idea that he's not.

Just to add ( for a couple of pps) that 'middle class is not one homogeneous mass there are many subsections - your lower middles, upper lower middles, lower upper middles and so on.

You might think you've moved up into the middle classes because you went to university, or now have a better job, shop at Waitrose, etc, but if your accent and background is deemed 'wrong' by some it doesn't matter what you call yourself.

Some people were saying, on the other class threads, that it takes a couple of generations to be able to call yourself middles, so more like your grandchildren than your children.

@Paigeycakey
MC people do not all have RP accents. Do you think that there are no lawyers / doctors etc who come from Birmingham / Basildon / Bolton??
The person in the OP was MC as soon as he qualified to be a doctor, not once he made consultant.
And you really don't have to have rich grandparents to be MC. If that were true then there'd be no social mobility at all.

You like some others are basing your definitions of class on stereotypes. Which is quite sad really. But, I'm certainly not going to change your mind so crack on.

Why on earth would I?

Not just about money though is it.

Because otherwise how do you know that the person you’ve assessed as middle class is actually middle class?

No not all but some MC people certainly do.

I'm basing my opinion on the people who I have met and my OWN job. Read my posts why are you telling me what I mean when I have stated and I work along side medical people from various levels. Your the one replying and getting uppity that I don't agree with you.

You've proved your own point. How silly... no I have lawyers in my own family and we are WC!!! My point exactly.

Your posts are full of contradictions. Let's agree to disagree.

@Paigeycakey there are no contradictions in my posts though.

The lawyers in your family - are MC, doesn't matter what you are.

The doctors you work with are MC, whatever accent they have.

This thread really sheds light on the fact that even in 2022 people are still judged by their accent or background.

Keir Starmer would be pleased though. He always gets slammed for being out of touch with the working classes. But on here, he'd still be working class as his parents very much were. Despite being a lawyer and the Director of Public Prosecutions.

There you go.

No I know my own family members I don't need you telling me or about my collegues. I thought you would be back to have the last word Miss know it all.....

I am astonished that you have got to adulthood without realising people are judged on their background and accent (alongside many other things). Did you really think that wasn’t the case? That I do find surprising.

This thread really sheds light on the fact that even in 2022 people are still judged by their accent or background.

Definitely

@Eastangular2000 of course I know people are judged by their accent and background. But that doesn't change their social class however many times you say it does.

Life is not a sociology project no matter how much you might want it to be. What happens in real life is far more nuanced than your sociological categories can cater for.

@Eastangular2000 I also know that too. Maybe you should let the ONS know?

What are you rambling about? Literally no one has contested that there are a variety of narrow definitions of economic class that are used to collect quantitative data. But this thread was started based on an interpersonal interaction not a Doctoral thesis or a government survey.

@Eastangular2000 maybe. But your assertion that your class is based on your parents class, no matter what, and that people will know what social class to put you in is based on...nothing.
I don't know why so many people on here are adamant that a person remains the same class as the household they were brought up in. No one has been able to give an explanation as to why that must be so.
It has been a fascinating read though.

I suggest you reread the thread because it seems you have mischaracterised quite a lot of what people are saying. maybe reflect on the fact that if ‘so many’ people are disagreeing with you perhaps the position is more nuanced and less black and white than you think it is.

Laughable. You’re the one that’s painting it as black and white. “You’re born into a class, and you die in that class. You can never change class.” That’s as black and white as it gets.

@fiftytontheresa is the person who is adding nuance to the situation. Explaining social mobility (which can be intragenerational!). Oh, and she’s qualified in the subject… shock horror. Just fyi @Eastangular2000 Sociologists don’t just sit around making theories up, they do so based on research! 🙄I’d listen if I were you, you might learn a thing or two!

Qualified in the subject 😂😂😂. Oh yes an ‘ology’ no less. I am not remotely interested in academic framing of the British class system, if anything it’s more of an anthropological phenomenon. I don’t need your approval for my views, nor am I interested in it. Interestingly though you seem determined to try and make me agree with you. I actually feel a bit sorry for you because believe me, if you do send your little one to public school, you will undoubtedly come across those who will judge you and you can produce every payslip and university transcript you want and it will make not a jot of difference. You won’t know you are being judged or it seems by what standards. I have friends in this position and it is awful to see. Nobody judges those who are true to who they are, as I said before be proud of who you are because despite your protestations you really don’t seem to be.

OMG I love you, your comment, & wish you were my friend. You sound like you are so down to earth despite how well you’ve done for yourselves.
Money doesn’t make people classy their attitude & behaviours do.
I always just assumed that anyone who works is working class & anyone who is affluent enough to not have to work is upper class.

Thank you for you psychoanalysis 🤣 hubby and I just had a good laugh. Oh you poor spiteful soul.

Not sure you understand what psychoanalysis is. I can only presume that I touched a nerve as you felt the need to share with your husband. Like I said, I hope you can be happy with who you are.

And it’s not spite, it’s pity.

@AviatorMama Maybe you should consider what has set your teeth on edge.

Pp is not wrong.

Most of my friends growing up have good jobs in nice areas, they're not middle class.

The few that think they've class climbed make me cringe the way they speak about working class people and certain areas without ever seeing a positive.

I have a friend who lives social housing, she works 30 hours weekly on minimum wage, she volunteers for the charity alone x 3 nights, saves abandoned animals, would never look down on anyone who hasn't had a decent education or start in life.

She has more class in her baby finger.

Does she feel absolutely shit after our yearly night out, yes every year.

This thread really sheds light on the fact that even in 2022 people are still judged by their accent or background.
Only by a certain group.
The hybrid MC.