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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

It’s my ILs…. Again. Serious advice needed

159 replies

Lillonely · 12/09/2022 20:20

So you may remember me from my previous threads and my almost farcical situation with my IL. Feel free to search my UN to pull them up, can’t work out how to link them…

but we’ve got another one now…

brief overview DH is British Pakistani, I’m the ‘wrong kind’ of Asian. 3 kids. FIL has 2 ‘wives’ islamically, in legal terms one wife (mil) and one mistress/ side chick or whatever SMIL. Long and short is, never wanted to marry MIL, married her, knocked her up, and dumped her here. Paid her pitance to live on, and made DH when he was 16 financially provide for her and the household. She speaks no English and has made no effort to. There’s a lot of backstory but she’s not as innocent as my synopsis makes her seem and has been very very cruel to me for years. FIL has now refused to pay for MIL, DH can’t as it’s an extra £700 pcm. She now signs on, that in itself was a battle. She has all her faculties. The house was bought cheap at auction (15k in the 90s) is in quite a bad state of repair but is habitable, (for now) I’m sorry there’s probably more detail but it’s in the other threads.

so the issue now is, dh goes around, we had covid so he’s not visited for 2 weeks and she’s just let the house go in to a state of ruin apparently. Bathroom full of black mould. I pressed dh on this as all that can’t happen in 2 weeks from what he’d said he’d not used the loo there for a while, probably months. Christ knows what happened. He said he could smell damp, and went in the front room and the plaster is crumbling away from the wall by the window, damp and he said the floor boards under foot were very creaky, I’m worried that they’ve rotted due to damp. The damp in the front room has been an issue for a while, dh managed to get FIL to send builders around to fix it and she sent them away as she didn’t want FIL to spend on it but wanted DH too, he couldn’t afford it.

but now FIL is saying he can’t afford to keep her anymore, hence the signing on, there’s no chance he’ll pay for any of the work and we can’t afford to, realistically 10k minimum probably more.

ive looked at the La to see if they have grants for this and they do for insulation but not for damp repair.

we can’t afford to keep her, for my mental health I can’t have her move in here, we also don’t have the space and she’s deeply traumatised one of my children in a past incident.

how on earth can we get around this? As mean as she is at points, and as abusive as she’s been to myself and DH, it’s no way to live.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

OP posts:
Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:01

As always, you guys have really come through with the suggestions and advice!

i’ll get DH to explore 100% ownership of the house and having her as a tenant so dh can either remortgage and pay thr RM payments with the housing UC or use the housing UC to slowly do it up and bring it up to scratch.

OP posts:
Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:03

alphons · 12/09/2022 22:01

Can your FIL give your DH the money to pay for builders? So the builders technically come from DH?

Or are these cowboy builders who are doing this for FIL as a favour? If so, perhaps your DH can get on the phone to these builders, and basically beg them to come back and then tell his mum he’s organised them?

It was years ago now and now FIL won’t pay for her at all, we’d never get him to pay a penny for house repairs now

OP posts:
alphons · 12/09/2022 22:03

Gotta say OP, from this and your previous thread I’ve read, I really feel for you. I feel such a sense of claustrophobia for you. I’m familiar with the cultural imperatives and ways of doing things. It’s just stifling. The theory is good, but it just doesn’t hold water with people who pick and choose what but they’ll uphold and what they’ll conveniently ignore…

cherrysthename · 12/09/2022 22:10

Surely she isn't entitled to the housing element of UC as a home owner? I thought it was meant for rent payments.
And that if your DH takes on the ownership and pockets the UC money himself, it would be fraud as he is related to her. Honestly if she's happy in the condition she's in, just leave it. Why do you need to be enmeshed in her life when she's abusive to your kids? Your children need to learn that abuse is unacceptable.

StClare101 · 12/09/2022 22:12

Yeah I would also just leave it. If she wants to live in filth so be it.

Beancounter1 · 12/09/2022 22:17

Can you find the resolve to just leave her to it? More importantly, will your DH be able to just leave her to it? Or is he too burdened with guilt to ignore her living conditions and demands?
If she is just left to her own filth, and the house becomes quite literally unfit for human habitation, then he will take a financial hit in that the value of his share will decrease, but it would be worth it for the peace of mind... if he can find it in him to just ignore her situation.

Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:22

cherrysthename · 12/09/2022 22:10

Surely she isn't entitled to the housing element of UC as a home owner? I thought it was meant for rent payments.
And that if your DH takes on the ownership and pockets the UC money himself, it would be fraud as he is related to her. Honestly if she's happy in the condition she's in, just leave it. Why do you need to be enmeshed in her life when she's abusive to your kids? Your children need to learn that abuse is unacceptable.

No it wouldn’t be fraudulent it would be that she would pay from the housing element rent as DH would be her landlord, he’d never pocket the money for us it would be used for repairs

OP posts:
Dixiechickonhols · 12/09/2022 22:22

If I remember previous thread there was a concern DH dad was in poor health and disposing of assets. Did anything come of that?

cherrysthename · 12/09/2022 22:25

Yeah, that's what I was meaning. It's not allowed because they are related. It doesn't matter what your DH would be spending the money on. If anything, it's even worse if it's spent on ameliorating the property as, as the owner, it would be benefitting him long term. I'm not meaning to piss on your chips regarding the idea, sorry!

Iwonder08 · 12/09/2022 22:25

I remember you previous posts!
Based on them and this post there are only 2 options. Your DH gets a grip and threatens your FIL with divorce and financial claim on his entire estate. It requires balls, I am not sure if your DH has it. The second option is for you to disengage completely. Don't participate in the conversations re MIL with your DH, don't listen to financial troubles and completely separate finances.
This woman is too set in her ways to improve her behaviour in any way. There is nothing you can do with her.

Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:26

Beancounter1 · 12/09/2022 22:17

Can you find the resolve to just leave her to it? More importantly, will your DH be able to just leave her to it? Or is he too burdened with guilt to ignore her living conditions and demands?
If she is just left to her own filth, and the house becomes quite literally unfit for human habitation, then he will take a financial hit in that the value of his share will decrease, but it would be worth it for the peace of mind... if he can find it in him to just ignore her situation.

That’s the thing, he can’t and he won’t, for as messed up as it is, it’s his mother at the end of the day. Then there’s the cultural stuff and abuse he would get, it just won’t happen. He has to an extent left it and she’s let the house fall apart more, she’s got no house proudness at all

OP posts:
Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:27

cherrysthename · 12/09/2022 22:25

Yeah, that's what I was meaning. It's not allowed because they are related. It doesn't matter what your DH would be spending the money on. If anything, it's even worse if it's spent on ameliorating the property as, as the owner, it would be benefitting him long term. I'm not meaning to piss on your chips regarding the idea, sorry!

ive briefly googled and it says you can still claim the housing cost if it’s from a close relative as long as they don’t live with you? Which he doesn’t… gosh it’s so hard

OP posts:
Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:28

Dixiechickonhols · 12/09/2022 22:22

If I remember previous thread there was a concern DH dad was in poor health and disposing of assets. Did anything come of that?

He has a chronic condition but not one that would claim your life, it’s more of a quality of life thing but he’s using that as a scape goat

OP posts:
cherrysthename · 12/09/2022 22:33

Wow I stand corrected, then. The system must have changed with the roll-out of UC. When it was housing benefit, your MIL wouldn't even have qualified for it. It's a bit like packing in work, claiming, but taking out a mortgage and having the system pay for it. Then obviously having the assets that being a homeowner brings. If you see what I mean- everyone would've been at it. It's extremely hard to get on the property ladder, after all.

Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:36

cherrysthename · 12/09/2022 22:33

Wow I stand corrected, then. The system must have changed with the roll-out of UC. When it was housing benefit, your MIL wouldn't even have qualified for it. It's a bit like packing in work, claiming, but taking out a mortgage and having the system pay for it. Then obviously having the assets that being a homeowner brings. If you see what I mean- everyone would've been at it. It's extremely hard to get on the property ladder, after all.

Yeah I do get what you mean, I’m very unfamiliar with the system myself, never claimed anything in my life so this is all new to me

OP posts:
inappropriateraspberry · 12/09/2022 22:42

It seems like she's using her culture as an excuse to not do anything and try to keep her son close at hand.
She won't help herself, so why should you help her? Unfortunately I think you need to leave her to it and wash your hands of her. I know it will be hard, but whatever you do will just encourage her to carry on as she has done.

Whataretheodds · 12/09/2022 22:49

I remember your last thread - a difficult situation.

Lots of posters suggested getting FIL's Imam involved to remind him of his responsibilties.

If the community isn't going to provide support then their disapproval is irrelevant.

Hopeandlove · 12/09/2022 22:50

She hasn’t learnt the language and doesn’t want to. Has she family in Pakistan? In which case sell the house and buy a flat out there near family. Else sell the house and give her the money. She needs to be empowered but to do that she needs to want to be. No excuse for not keeping your house clean etc adult social care but you must step back totally if you have done this

Dreamstosell · 12/09/2022 22:52

You are, I believe, able to rent from a family member as long as it is a genuine rental situation. I think it would not be accepted in your situation as she owns the house presently. To buy it from her and then charge her rent would be seen as a contrived situation in order to get the housing element of UC which she isn’t currently able to claim.

RaininSummer · 12/09/2022 22:56

As above it definitely isn't guaranteed and would go to a decision maker. As it has never been commercially let before that will also raise concern. She would only be entitled to the local housing rate for a 1 bedroom place which may not be enough.

Tierne · 12/09/2022 22:57

She hasn't even bothered to learn English? Why not?

I think you should leave her to it.

You talk about the "social stigma" DH would face if he sent her home but listen, at some point something in this situation is going to have to give. So what's it to be?

Brigante9 · 12/09/2022 22:58

Seriously, send her on a permanent holiday back to Pakistan. She’s abusive, has refused to engage with anything you’ve done/offered. I read your other thread and she won’t change or suddenly start co-operating.

Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 22:59

RaininSummer · 12/09/2022 22:56

As above it definitely isn't guaranteed and would go to a decision maker. As it has never been commercially let before that will also raise concern. She would only be entitled to the local housing rate for a 1 bedroom place which may not be enough.

The property apparently was let a few years ago according to DH, FIL used to do it, obviously he pocketed the money. It goes from bad to worse.

without the income we definitely couldn’t afford to pay an additional mortgage even a small one

OP posts:
Original poster
Lillonely · 12/09/2022 23:01

Whataretheodds · 12/09/2022 22:49

I remember your last thread - a difficult situation.

Lots of posters suggested getting FIL's Imam involved to remind him of his responsibilties.

If the community isn't going to provide support then their disapproval is irrelevant.

The community care enough to wag their finger at DH but there is this ‘respect’ for elders meaning they can be as abusive they want and get away with it basically; it’s toxic. The community know and have known for years, even when dh was a child and basically neglected, everyone was silent including ‘religious’ leaders (that’s sarcastic air quotes)

OP posts:
Pixiedust1234 · 12/09/2022 23:02

Speak to citizens advice, shelter or local council. I was going to suggest her faith "church" to see if anybody there could talk to her.

Once you have the options (hopefully more than one), present them to mil to choose. She HAS to choose one. If she absolutely refuses then its time to walk away and get your dh into counselling. Make sure she understands that this is it.

What a crap situation for you all.