Do beautiful women realize that ugly women are treated very differently?

[UglyNameChange]

My friend (who is very beautiful) got into a relationship not so long ago and said how she hopes I’ll be soon in one too - she knows I’d like a relationship also.
Well, few days ago she was telling me to just go to a bar and get chatted up with men, it won’t be long etc. and I’d just had to laugh, and asked her does she remember any man to ever have done that before and why would is sudenly have changed.
I think I accidentally made things akward because she went really quiet.
She pretty much can go anywhere and men will start up conversation or get asked out.

And this made me think if she genuinely thought we all have the same opportunities?

He's just a negger. It's back in fashion. And you did exactly the right thing.

There was a thread a while ago about beauty which was interesting. A couple of women shared experiences they or their daughters had for being beautiful, but got very annoyed and accused us of denying their experiences when a few of us plain Janes said the same had happened to us. One woman said she had been insulted and shoved at a bar by another woman for being beautiful but it sounded as if she'd jumped the queue...the bartender had noticed her first, even though the other woman had been there longer, but Beauty didn't correct him when he went to serve her.

I also think beautiful gets conflated with slimness or shape & youth. I think a beautiful face is a beautiful face even if your not a size 8 or shaped like the Kardashian's.

NC for this but I do post here quite often.

I’ve just reached 50 and have always been what others call very pretty but lately I get lots of attention from much younger men. A friend told me that I come across as very sexy, confident and comfortable in my own skin. Men of all ages smile at me in the street, young men check me out, I get served quickly in restaurants. I am enjoying the attention, to be frank. I feel sexy and look after myself (don’t drink alcohol, walk miles every day), have a fulfilling life. I think that “pretty privilege” is certainly a thing. Definitely entering my middle years with a spring in my step and feeling not at all invisible.

It's frustrating to have your own lived experience denied though, isn't it? By people who've never experienced it. It's no different to men telling women they're imagining sexism, or a white person telling someone of colour that they themselves 'don't see colour' so society doesn't discriminate.

If someone tells you they are treated differently, why not believe them?

There is a big difference between average looking women and ugly women.

I am not beautiful by any standards really, and when I was out and single, I've never had an issue with getting chatted up (other than I would prefer men never did it!). Never had an issue with not having the relationships I wanted. It's quality over quantity. Getting chatted up and asked out by every weirdo is not really something to aspire to. Yes, being very typically 'attractive' can open doors in life, but in terms of relationships, it's not what all men would be interested in. Just like I am not attracted to guys who look like they are on TOWIE or spend all their time at the gym, not all men want someone who fits a certain physical stereotype. In fact, thinking of the happiest and most successful relationships I know, my own included, none of us are 'beautiful' in that way. Dh thinks I'm hot, but he said he wouldn't have been attracted to me if I wasn't confident and ambitious and funny. I wouldn't want a relationship with someone who didn't find those things attractive anyway.

I'm thinking of every place I've ever worked, every woman in a senior role I've ever met and, as nice as they all looked, I truly cannot sat that most of them were significantly better looking than average.

@mindutopia I am assuming you are average looking.

There is a big difference between average looking women and ugly women.

true, but I can't say i've seen many ugly people of either sex.

It's not just women, I see it with my sons. They get chosen for things far more often than average.

Ds1-13 was out with friends last week and there was a stand giving away free samples, his friends got one each, the same woman gave him 5 samples and a big goodie bag.

Little things like this repeatedly happen to both my boys, I probably notice because as a child I was very unnoticed and overlooked. They are mixed race and look very different to me.

So, you might get fewer, way fewer, approaches or offers from men if you’re less attractive, but there’s also a good chance you’ll get better quality offers too imho.

As a not-beautiful woman I have also been targeted by narcissists and wankers. I've been raped, stalked, sexually abused, sexually harassed, catcalled, verbally abused etc. Being average-looking has not protected me from sleazy behaviour by men. I have no idea whether I would experience more of this kind of thing if I was beautiful, but I'm sure I would have had less verbal abuse, and sure I would have had a lot more men falling over themselves to be nice to me and do stuff for me. I also expect I would have got more of the jobs I wanted, had more attention and opportunities, etc. So on the whole, I'd rather be beautiful! Maybe the really nice men wouldn't approach me, but if I was beautiful I could approach them without fear of rejection. So yes, I'll take it!

I think some of the 'but it's awful to be beautiful' comments are peoplejust trying to reassure themselves that it's not actually just fucking great good luck to be gorgeous.

As a general rule I would, but when they tell me xyz happened to them and it's also happened to me, why can't I say so? I'm average looking but I've had an absolute shit ton of street harassment and objectification, as well as more positive experiences.

Totally agree with this.
I’ve noticed that some men seem to feel a sort of righteous anger towards a woman they perceive as ugly. I’ve had men shout insults at me as I’ve walked down the street, “woofing” etc. There’s a strange contempt there, like you don’t have a right to exist because you are ugly.

I was gorgeous in my early 20s and never went out with a narcissist or anyone that bad really. I don't think it follows that beautiful women only attract narcissists! Surely it depends on the confidence and judge of character of the individual woman as to who they choose to go out with, and if you are pretty you have a wider not smaller pool to choose from and have more chance of getting it right, and are more likely to tell them to get lost if they turn out to be a twat.

It got separated by posts in between but that post was in response to this:

I actually think it's quite endearing that she has no perception of things being different for you both.

It shows that she has no sense that you are in any way less attractive.

I agree. Looks aren't everything. Being friendly, chatty, open, approachable, fun and confident are actually much more attractive traits that just beauty on its own.

Surely it depends on the confidence and judge of character of the individual woman as to who they choose to go out with, and if you are pretty you have a wider not smaller pool to choose from and have more chance of getting it right, and are more likely to tell them to get lost if they turn out to be a twat.

Yes, exactly.

@lunar1

Agreed. I have two sons. One is exceptionally handsome, fuck knows how but he seems to have got the whole families best features all rolled into one. It’s actually annoying when people make comparisons with my other son but i am waffling now.

Anyhow he had a girlfriend who he was with and he really liked her but then lots of people in his year group started asking him why on Earth he was going out with her because she was fat. Well I’ve brought my son up to respect girls and certainly not to be horrible based on appearances etc so he ignored the comments entirely.

Anyway in the end she dumped him because she too was sick of the grief she was getting by others who said she was punching. How disappointing is this? She was a lovely girl and my son was gutted. He’s since been asked out by conventionally prettier girls but he’s said no as he said they can be mean.

its a minefield out there! You see it on here sometimes a wife who feels a bit insecure if her husband is better looking than what she is.

Of course beautiful people benefit from their looks. I know there's a lot of 'oh but they get harrassed by so many men' but beauty goes beyond people being sexually attracted to you. Beautiful people are shown preferential treatment in all aspects of life. From little things like receiving quicker service at the bar to bigger things like sailing through interviews. As humans we respond favourably to good looks. Countless studies show this.

i think it's a bit off to tell the OP she's lacking in self-esteem because she can see that beauty gives a person a head start when it comes to looking for romantic attachments.

I always feel sorry for ugly men as women will get a man no matter what she looks like.

You mean ugly men who are unsuccessful. Lot of successful ugly men have their pick of women - Bernie Ecclestone, Rupert Murdoch, Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates, Elon Musk, Harvey Weinstein (previously)

Beautiful looking women most definitely get the most attention.
After that most important thing seems to be just laughing whatever the man is saying/doing.

OP, I know exactly what you mean here! Your posts have made me think hard about this whole subject and I've realised that (being pretty average myself) I've never actually resented another woman, especially a friend, for being prettier than me...but oh boy, I really get pissed offwith the sort of women who giggle hysterically at anything some idiotic bloke does or says. Yes - this brought back many annoying memories.
( I know that's not a good reaction, but if we're not being honest here, what's the point??)

I met a girl during the freshers' week at university (we were clinging together for warmth - we had little in common really) who was prettier than me but not stunning. She had clearly picked up the habit of giggling all the time with men, and they loved it. She didn't really say anything...except 'Oh my God!' or similar, but she didn't need to. The flattery of finding all these guys so hilarious worked its
magic very effectively. Proper conversation they certainly did NOT want - a bit depressing.

A PP was critical of the view that attractive people tend to have less developed or less interesting personalities, and I agree that this is a tired cliche and not always the case. I'm sure there are lots of intelligent, attractive people who don't conform to this cliche but the fact remains that (at least while they're young) really beautiful people can get away with doing very little - a smile, giggle or simper will get them attention and popularity. Other people do have to work a bit harder.

It's often the case that the most successful comedians of both sexes are not necessarily the most physically attractive.

The idea that beautiful people don't have personalities is ridiculous, as is the idea that there are no plain and boring people.

But what might be true is that if you're insecure about how you look and bothered by that, you might work on developing traits.

I'm sure being very good looking changes things. Makes you more likely to be a film star or trophy wife, for a start, if only by bringing the opportunity. But I do remember that other thread with beauties putting various things down to being above averagely attractive, and me thinking "that happens to me too, so there must be other ways it comes about". Being female, young and a healthy weight was probably a bigger factor...didn't need to look like Marilyn Monroe.

I was considered beautiful as a teenager and into my early 30's. One man told me that I was the most beautiful woman in the city. I look back and I can see it - I couldn't at the time. I did a little modeling but loathed it.

Now? My big boobs make me look bigger than I am, my 'prettiest eyes I've ever seen' (another stranger compliment) are tired-looking, I'm a little heavier, my hair that people once asked to touch is usually scraped in a band. In short, my beauty was very youth-based, I think.

I don't wear make-up really, I'm absolutely not interested in being attractive to anyone except my DH. I dress to conceal my figure, rather than show it off. I could look good and turn the odd head if I pulled out the stops, but I know that I pretty much blend into the background now, and that's fine.

So yes, I've been beautiful and now I'm not. I prefer being not. I hated the constant male attention: several times as a teenager, men stopped their cars and tried to actually touch me - just absolutely awful.

I know two women who I consider beautiful - they don't have to do a thing, the world almost stops around them just to gaze. They are both intelligent, wonderful, kind Latina women. They know the effect they have, but it's natural and not because they seek it out. One of them overcompensates with female friends, and is excessively smiley and self-depracting to redress some kind of unspoken balance.

I’d never thought of it like this before. Blimey, I wish someone had explained this to teenage me - took me until about 32 to come to terms with not being attractive!

@Dalaidramailama, it can definitely be a poison chalice for them can't it.

Ds1 lost a lovely female friend as she was bullied horribly for their friendship. They were in the same dance group so I would pick them up together.

Schools can be an awful place and in the end she distanced herself from him completely.