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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why men hate women so much?

782 replies

YouAreNotBatman · 07/08/2022 11:09

Violence againt women, sexual harrasment.

Controlling women bodies.

Women’s sexuality: frigid prude if you don’t want sex, slut if you.

Porn, sex ”work”.

All the MRA’s, mgtow, incels etc.

Even historically speaking they have no reason to be angry at women, women never had any power, mostly tried to accommodate to men’s demand/ wants, I think it still goes on.

Many women still tip toe the line to placate men.

What reason do they have to be so angry at women?

OP posts:
DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 18:58

Suetodo88 · 07/08/2022 18:57

@DandyLandy

Her children are members of society. The two who are the most important to her. What she’s doing is beautiful and I don’t care if someone wants to rip on me but her post shouldn’t be attacked.
She’s a beautiful person and she deserves all the appreciation in the world. Society is better because she’s in it and she should never doubt it.

Members of society isn't 'society'

Society hasn't benefitted from her being at home

It's very silly to pretend otherwise

brookstar · 07/08/2022 18:58

I’m very much a modern thinker.

You really aren't.
You're coming across as very naive and old fashioned.
Sex segregation in the work place isn't t an example of modern thinking.
Prioritising mens feelings over equality isn't modern thinking.

Topgub · 07/08/2022 18:59

@perfectstorm

Do your kids not have a dad who could care for them?

I would also argue there's a difference between being a carer and a sahm

There's also an argument that caring responsibilities are the individual families and not the states.

Childcare should not be seen as women's work

Most children have 2 parents available to care for them

Women choosing to take that role and keep it all to themselves doesn't benefit society at all.

gnilliwdog · 07/08/2022 19:00

'And not to be rude but you're not the only person who could care for them effectively
You entering the workforce and giving your children to a lower paid professional would be far more beneficial to society'

No, I don't agree. Paying low wages for responsible and skilled jobs is not good for society, see nursing, care etc.

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 19:00

Society hasn't benefitted from her being at home

How do you know? How do you know that her providing a safe, understanding and secure environment for her children hasn't benefited society / or won't be a benefit to society in the future?

Suetodo88 · 07/08/2022 19:01

@perfectstorm

Your worth a million CEO’s. Don’t doubt it beautiful soul.😸

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:01

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 19:00

Society hasn't benefitted from her being at home

How do you know? How do you know that her providing a safe, understanding and secure environment for her children hasn't benefited society / or won't be a benefit to society in the future?

Because it hasn't

That's factual

I haven't benefitted nor has anyone on this thread benefitted from this person staying at home pretending they're the only person who can care for their child.

Topgub · 07/08/2022 19:02

@gnilliwdog

Its not the system I, or anyone I know works with

The vast majority have both parents working

perfectstorm · 07/08/2022 19:04

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 18:54

That's subjective

And not to be rude but you're not the only person who could care for them effectively

You entering the workforce and giving your children to a lower paid professional would be far more beneficial to society

As nicely as possible: I removed my son from school at 8. He has been diagnosed with complex PTSD as a direct result of school attendance. Various assessments have concurred that nobody could care for my son without being extremely highly qualified in their own right - and nobody else can provide him with the rock solid security that his mother can.

You're fully entitled to believe that you know better about a situation on which you are entirely ignorant, absolutely. I'm entitled to smile at your naivety and ignorance, too.

Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits · 07/08/2022 19:05

It's amazing how quickly a thread discussing the failings of some men has turned into a thread where a misogynist repeatedly tells us all the failings of women with no actual data or facts to back it up.

Better distract from the shortcoming of the menfolk by telling women they are shit, lest we hurt men's feelings. (Kinda sounds like something a man would do but I will give the benefit of the double because some women do have internalised misogyny)

gnilliwdog · 07/08/2022 19:05

Topgub · 07/08/2022 19:02

@gnilliwdog

Its not the system I, or anyone I know works with

The vast majority have both parents working

Really? I know so many women who are the sole provider. I suppose we move in different circles.

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:05

@perfectstorm

You caring for your child isn't a benefit to society

It doesn't matter what you tell yourself

That is a basic fact

ldontWanna · 07/08/2022 19:06

Suetodo88 · 07/08/2022 18:48

@Idontwanna

Did they really stop them though? How much did they really risk to try it? There is little evidence it was ever even though if until after the industrial revolution made it desirable to try.

Its silly to pretend that every male invention was stolen from women, that’s just a Hollywood fantasy.

Of course men should make their own spaces if they want them rather than co opt womens and force them to change until women no longer want to use them - that’s my whole point.

Well let's see..

Women weren't allowed out without a chaperone.
Women weren't allowed to vote.
Women weren't allowed to vote.
Women weren't allowed to go to school.
When they went to school,the subjects were limited.
Women weren't allowed to have a job.
When they were allowed jobs,they were barred from certain jobs.
Women couldn't be teachers,doctors,police officers, soldiers etc.
Women weren't allowed bank accounts.
Women weren't allowed to own property.

Heck,women weren't even allowed to say no to their husbands, and marital rape didn't become a crime until the 90's.

Do you really think that for centuries women would've been allowed to dedicate time and resources to research,development and businesses and they just didn't do it because they didn't want to? The sad thing is, that even with all those things against them there are many ,many successful female historical figures that had a great impact on the tech and luxuries we have today. Very few people acknowledge them or have even heard about them.

Do you know who Ada lovelace is? Grace Hopper? Hedy Lamarr? Annie Easley? Radia pearlman? Gertrude Elion? Elizabeth Blackwell? Virginia Apgar? Rosalind Franklin?

I could go on.

perfectstorm · 07/08/2022 19:07

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:01

Because it hasn't

That's factual

I haven't benefitted nor has anyone on this thread benefitted from this person staying at home pretending they're the only person who can care for their child.

Consultant child psychiatrists, social workers and clinical psychologists disagree with you - having assessed my child, and met me.

What are your own clinical qualifications, and do you customarily pronounce on patients you have never met, and families with which you are unfamiliar?

ldontWanna · 07/08/2022 19:09

Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits · 07/08/2022 19:05

It's amazing how quickly a thread discussing the failings of some men has turned into a thread where a misogynist repeatedly tells us all the failings of women with no actual data or facts to back it up.

Better distract from the shortcoming of the menfolk by telling women they are shit, lest we hurt men's feelings. (Kinda sounds like something a man would do but I will give the benefit of the double because some women do have internalised misogyny)

It's fear that fuels it. Sometimes subtle, but always there in the comments and arguments. Men will stop protecting us/upholding the law, men will get angry, men will get frustrated, men will leave, men will...

Maybe subtle,but it's there. The fear of how men will react.

Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits · 07/08/2022 19:10

ldontWanna · 07/08/2022 19:09

It's fear that fuels it. Sometimes subtle, but always there in the comments and arguments. Men will stop protecting us/upholding the law, men will get angry, men will get frustrated, men will leave, men will...

Maybe subtle,but it's there. The fear of how men will react.

Very true

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 19:10

Its factual

Its a basic fact

Just because you keep saying those words doesn't make what you are saying true. What you are saying is your opinion.

gnilliwdog · 07/08/2022 19:11

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:05

@perfectstorm

You caring for your child isn't a benefit to society

It doesn't matter what you tell yourself

That is a basic fact

Children are the society of the future. The quality of their upbringing determines the society of the future. You suggest they should all be cared for by low paid strangers, rather than motivated and interested parents. I think any psychologist will tell you, that is not the way to produce healthy functioning members of society.

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:12

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 19:10

Its factual

Its a basic fact

Just because you keep saying those words doesn't make what you are saying true. What you are saying is your opinion.

It's an objective and basic fact

That poster chose to remove her child from school

That's her big 'I'm helping society by teaching my child' he didn't need to be taught at home

Caring for your own child isn't benefitting society

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:13

@gnilliwdog

You think teachers are low paid and uninterested?

This poster removed her 8 year old from school and is using her saving a school place as a benefit to society. It doesn't work like that.

Topgub · 07/08/2022 19:14

@gnilliwdog

Lone parents make up only 14% of uk families

Its not really about what circles anyone moves in

Topgub · 07/08/2022 19:15

@gnilliwdog

You can care for children and work.

The 2 are not mutually exclusive.

And disinterested stranger abd involved parent aren't the only options either

JudgeJ · 07/08/2022 19:15

YouAreNotBatman · 07/08/2022 11:09

Violence againt women, sexual harrasment.

Controlling women bodies.

Women’s sexuality: frigid prude if you don’t want sex, slut if you.

Porn, sex ”work”.

All the MRA’s, mgtow, incels etc.

Even historically speaking they have no reason to be angry at women, women never had any power, mostly tried to accommodate to men’s demand/ wants, I think it still goes on.

Many women still tip toe the line to placate men.

What reason do they have to be so angry at women?

Not sure MN is the place to ask, the home of men haters!

perfectstorm · 07/08/2022 19:16

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:12

It's an objective and basic fact

That poster chose to remove her child from school

That's her big 'I'm helping society by teaching my child' he didn't need to be taught at home

Caring for your own child isn't benefitting society

Have you any idea how many kids are out of school, whose parents don't want them to be?

The law is clear that the state doesn't have to pay for a child to be home educated if there is any school, anywhere, that can meet the child's needs.

Our local authority could find no school able to meet my son's. Right now, there are thousands of children who have no school placement at all, because there is a dearth of specialist placements. These parents are not home educating. There. is. no. school.

If you are genuinely concerned about women and our rights, then perhaps this is a cause you could start dedicating some time and energy to? Because I'm only unusual in having forced our LA to fund my child's education from home. Most parents have no school and no support nor funding. That's the norm.

There's a crisis in this country in SEN provision. Your adopting the third person to refer to me so you can feel more comfortable in pretending that you know more than I do about that doesn't change facts. Beliefs don't, you see.

DandyLandy · 07/08/2022 19:16

@perfectstorm

Even if you're the only person on the planet to make your child happy

That still doesn't benefit society

You removing your child from school and saying you're saving society paying for their education is really not how it works.

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