What’s the most batshit belief you’ve ever known someone to hold

[Ifyouwannabe1]

just met up with a long time friend (lovely, but utterly away with the fairies) who honestly believes the earth is flat as well as a whole host of other similarly crazy things. It got me thinking what’s the most batshit thing you’ve ever known anyone to think?

I haven't got to the end of this thread so maybe this has already been said but biological sex is not that easy to define. It's not just a penis or a vagina (or testicle or ovaries). Chromosomes and hormones also play a part. Often people are born not having their genitals, hormones or chromosomes allign. So is someone with a vagina but xy chromosones a man or a woman? Can hormone therapies not adjust the appearance of someone's body? What about the brain and whether this has developed in a more typically male or female way?

Also www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/magazine-34290981.amp

Those using this as a platform to bang on about trans people do come across as bigoted. Give it a rest.

I've highlighted quite an important bit of that article for you. These are males with a DSD. And how do they know they are males? They have developed anatomies for producing small gametes.

You seem to have missed that actually the conversation has not been about hatred or fear of trans people but about thinking it's batshit that some people think humans can actually change sex.

You are absolutely and unequivocally wrong. Sex is determined by which gametes we develop to support.

Large gametes means female, small means male.

Secondary characteristics of course nearly always follow from actual sex (which is nearly always defined by chromosomes) but even in cases of DSDs, where genitals can be ambiguous nearly every person affected is unequivocally male or female.

XXY for example is a condition that affects males. Caster Semenya is an XY male with a condition that limited androgen sensitivity before puberty, so he developed ambiguous external génitals, but has functional testes and went through a male puberty.

And FYI @OldLadyInPolyester people with DSDs have repeatedly asked not to be used by TRAs, or anyone else, as 'gotchas' in debates about trans issues.

They are not inanimate props to be used in an effort to score points, it's offensive.

Functional testes and 2/3 children @StillHappy 😁

Yes, who, I have read, he fathered, rather than giving birth to.

I’ve the old fashioned view that if you father children it’s fair to say that you are male.

Similarly, if you have given birth to any then you are female.

Here you've just shown your lack in critical reading skills. No one here is anti trans just anti batshit thinking like mole people live at the centre of the earth or that human beings can somehow magically change sex i.e their genetics.

This is one of the reasons the other thread should been left to stand, helping people learn properly upheld scientific facts over misinformation they've picked up from dodgy sources.

I am not a bigot, thank you very much. Quite offensive really given what I've actually said, not that you care to take time to read, just instantly spout hateful names at people that challenge your viewpoint. Well your viewpoint if you believe humans can change sex that is.

Sex is to do with gametes not penises and vaginas. Not a lot of vaginas on a female cannebis plant but your local grower will definitely know the sex of the plant. No penises or vaginas on male and female jellyfish either but the same definition of sex applies to jellyfish, plants (including different parts of the same plant) and humans.

None of this changes the fact that there are 2 sexes. Every single person on this planet has come into existence because a male sex cell fertilised a female one. That some people may have sex development disorders doesn’t change the fact that you can’t change sex.

Not a lot of vaginas on a female cannebis plant

I know you said not a lot but that’s given me a very odd mental image…

New batshit theory: some cannabis plants have vaginas 🤣🤣🤣

People on this thread seriously think the most batshit crazy thing they've ever heard that someone can change their sex? My point was that defining sex isn't as straight forward as people seem to think. There are many people who don't biologically fit into neat little boxes. There are people whose genitalia change spontaneously. So really, whether you reduce biological sex to gametes or not, it is not that mind blowing that people think sex can change.

Thinking a hippo is a mythical creature or that the Queen is a lizard - that's batshit crazy and, I suspect, the kind of funny answers the OP was looking for. But no, the thread has been used to bash trans people in the guise of scientific objectivity.

I've just checked in my pj bottoms and thankfully my genitalia hasn't changed spontaneously overnight. Nor has it over the last 51 years. Are there any warnings that spontaneous change might happen? Might it have spontaneously changed and then spontaneously changed back again? 🤔

Look at my link above. It does happen to some people at puberty 🤷🏻‍♀️

Flat Earthers hold that belief because it gives them a sense of intelligence. Generally speaking they feel a sense of inferiority and want to bridge that gap by convincing themselves they hold knowledge that nobody else does and trying to rationalise it by seeking evidence that they are correct.

You can’t usually get someone like that to change their mind because even if you provide evidence that makes them question their belief, they will dismiss it so as not to have to admit they’re an idiot.

It’s the same reason why a lot of conspiracy theories come about. Covid conspiracies were more understandable as in part they were started due to fear as well as inferiority.

“Biological sex is not that easy to define” - you’re having a laugh. How many midwives do you think there are with careers of, say, 40 years behind them can count up the number of times they’ve struggled to determine the sex of any of the thousands of babies they’ve delivered? Seriously - how many?

If there are any midwives reading this, I would love to know how often this is an issue. My “woman on the street” guess is that this happens so rarely that your assertion quoted above is absolutely risible.

About 1 in 2000 babies are born 'intersex'. It's fairly common.

Please can we have a link to a science based article that states a case of someone spontaneously changing genitalia that didn't involve late forming genitalia or medical intervention to correct genitalia malformed by a genetic disorder.

I think you are talking about intersex or DSD here? In which case scientifically speaking they are still one or the other sex category, male or female.

Sex is very clearly defined, you can google the scientific definition or look in any basic biology book all the way up to the most in depth scientific journals and you will find zero evidence that anyone can change sex, but you'll find loads that state definitively what sex is.

I also would like to extend a challenge to you, who think I am bigoted for stating a scientific fact, to find one single post where I have actually been transphobic or bigoted in any way.

I fully believe in Trans peoples existence and right to an existence. I believe they deserve their rights and to live their lives free from prejudice, discrimination or violence.

I also believe in science. I believe that sex is definable by science and is immutable.

Nothing in the last sentence makes me a bigot.

What you have been saying is provably wrong.

Did you read this, @OldLadyInPolyester ?

In which case scientifically * and biologically speaking they are still one or the other sex category, male or female.

missed a couple of words there.

I cant, my eyes have spontaneously rolled so hard and so far that I can no longer see.

And once again I'd also like to point out that not one post has "bashed trans people" just the batshit ideology of the fringe extreme.

Otherwise as has been pointed out a lot already, a number of Trans people are also guilty of Transphobic Trans bashing, which is some impressive mental gymnastics to have twisted yourself into really if you take a moment to stand back and think about it.

It’s a disorder of sexual development.

There are many more common disorders that people are born with or develop (than 1 in 2000). 1 in 100 babies in the UK have a congenital heart defect. 1 in 700 are born with cleft lip or palette. Yet no one is trying to argue that these conditions are anything other than deviations with health effects that need to be addressed. But somehow, some people are born with DSDs seems to mean we’re supposed to stop thinking of humans are sexed as male or female.

Edge cases and developmental issues are just that.

I do think it’s a shame that this thread has gone this way (although sadly not surprising in the current online context). Because there was a lot of potential in people’s batshit beliefs. We’ve all had some batshit beliefs in our lives (or practices that, when we thought about them, were clearly based in some ridiculous logic). Some of them are pretty funny in general.

Look at my link above. It does happen to some people at puberty

Try reading the replies to you, your link makes clear that they are male. It's not possible to actually change sex. You can use sophistry based on disorders of sex development to claim that sex is a "construct" but it doesn't mean that you can change sex. We are not clownfish. The human species needs two gametes to reproduce, male and female. That's just biological reality.

Jack and Gill were two spirit measures. A jack was half a Gill. The king reduced the size of a jack - and Jill came tumbling after.