To think the able bodied / mind/ non carer/ non low wage s worker on benefits, benefit population that claim benefits should contribute somehow to the community/ get the money for WORK .

[Crikeymaccrikey]

Yes this may be costly to set up such as enhanced dbs checks etc.

I feel that this would both give a purpose and a contribution. And lead to jobs possibly/ develop cv / show work ethic.

In addition , it may stop the resentment and the benefit bashing if the claimants are seen to be contributing to society.

This is not necessarily a tory notion.
Karl Marxs idea about each to ones own ability... encompasses this idea of people working together for the whole of society accordi ng to ability. A quick google implies this is actually a socilaist idea of all doing what they can . This is what i am suggesting.

And before anyone says they would be pushed into things.. maybe there could be a choice of ways to contribute ,like on a data base.

Also, I am a cleaner myself. I literally clean poo off loos. I do not feel less worthy than others . I do the job because I can no longer work in my profession , as I get older, ( burnt out nhs) and see nothing but value in my ( ? Seen as some,lowly work). It gives me structure, a decent wage, and I contribute. All good. No shame in doing a good job , whatever that job if it is in my ability.

How can this idea, properly managed be other than reasonable. ?

I remember the work programme.

Many employers stopped hiring or giving appropriate payrises to their existing staff because they made money from having people sent by the jobcentre to do it instead - and they got to work fulltime for the employer but not receive a fulltime wage.

It also put a stop to a lot of volunteer opportunities for people who wanted to get experience in different areas - because a self motivated, interested volunteer didn't come with funding attached. And for those who did make the effort to volunteer began to find their volunteering was no longer looked upon as a good thing by prospective employers because it was assumed they only did it because the job centre said they had to.

In short, it didn't exactly help anybody except the companies who made money from it.

Beautifully put, @WhatdoImean .

There've been a few threads like this this week. I was beginning to think it was National Benefit-bashing Week or something.

Most people on benefits work.

Even a lot of disabled benefits-claimants work.

Able-bodied benefits claimants who don't work have to spend a certain number of hours a week job-hunting and have to attend regular appointments at the job centre.

The idea that there are millions of fit healthy people lolling in front of the telly all day and living it large off benefits is a myth created and pushed by the right wing tabloids working on government orders in order to demonise and scapegoat poor people so that the general public won't blame those who are actually responsible for austerity and cost of living crisis, and cuts to services: corrupt wealthy Tories who give £££££££ deals to their mates and let huge companies get away with paying no tax.

It's exactly the same weaponised hatred they've aimed at immigrants, that they've aimed at disabled people. The people in power want you to hate those who are poorer and more vulnerable so you won't look at their own fuck ups and utter lies and corruption.

Its not even started lakie - I genuinely worry about the winter and what is coming.

Honestly I didn't care about benefits and claimants. The pension bill is normally significantly larger, MPs don't need their massive salary and such generous expenses + subsidies, tax avoidance bill is towering.

I was always proud to live in a country that supported those in need, although the system is far from adequate now.

Very few people want to live off so little and it's rare that happy, we'll adjusted people do long term anyway.

Why waste your time worrying about those living hand to mouth on benefits, I promise you they're not the reason the economy is in the mess it is in, or why many are feeling the pinch.

No, I don’t think people getting £75 a week should have to work full time for it. Great way for companies to employee less staff and save on wages though.

who is paying half of their salary to prop up the benefits system? The answer is no one, high rate tax payers pay 40% of part of their salary, so no one is paying more than 40% total.

Yes. These are the tax bands:

Personal Allowance Up to £12,570 0%
Basic rate £12,571 to £50,270 20%
Higher rate £50,271 to £150,000 40%
Additional rate over £150,000 45%

So only once you are earning over £50k a year do you start paying 40% tax and then only on that part of your salary. No-one pays 50% tax on their salary in the UK.

I work for the council and people are employed at These jobs. They actually work quite hard mainly for the real living wage of 9.90 an hour as the council subcontracts out to an agency. You need to be trained and equipped. For example a street sweeper does 3 days of training, mainly health and safety everything from how to move in order to protect your spine to sharps disposal. Then it costs a further 600 quid to give them safety clothing as per the councils risk assessment. You can’t just send people out the insurance will go nuts.

I do wonder given that pensioners are also such a big drain if we shouldn’t be sending them off to do park maintenance. Ffs

@womaninatightspot

I don’t resonate with this. My husband applied for a bin man job “on paper” with an agency but then when he turned up they got him street cleaning. There was definitely no 3 days worth of training that’s for sure. He was straight out picking up litter and god knows what else.

Sharpen up all four legs of their walking frames and they can litter pick 4 times faster than a man with just one spike.. 👍

I would love to see more barriers reduced.

Get rid of zero hour contracts. They benefit employers, not those who need to provide for their family. Contracts should be clear on working hours and days. Overtime is optional. A person can plan childcare then. How does one plan childcare when expected to be free 7 days a week but may only get 6 hours work?

As a carer of a disabled child who is slowly falling into my own MH trap because I hate that I had to give up work and resent the system that makes it so difficult. Make it easier for carers to work. Ensure disabled children can actually access childcare. Ensure they aren't charged quadruple non-disabled children. Ensure the childcare can meet the child's needs.

If you want to push employers to employ more disabled people through wild initiatives, make sure they are properly funded, resourced and maintained. Some of the projects in theory sound brilliant, but aren't in anyway actually set up to succeed for employers or employees.

The numbers of people just idley on benefits whilst able to work, especially long-term, are shockingly low yet seem to represent publically the face of all claimants. Its abhorrent how grossly misrepresented it all is. The vast majority are disabled or caring for the disabled.

Most just applied for PIP instead essentially using their MH diagnosis to not ever work.

PIP isn’t an out of work benefit.

Its also not something you can claim simply on the basis of a diagnosis. It’s also notoriously difficult to claim for mental health issues.

There are people who do these jobs funded out of council tax. Are you suggesting that these people are made unemployed because the council can hire people at £77pw instead of NMW?

Is English your second language, OP?

Ugh, PIP is SO hard to claim. You need a shit ton of evidence. No one, ever, has just said they are a bit sad so they never have to work again.

FFS, exactly where is it that people are getting this shit from?

The numbers of people just idley on benefits whilst able to work, especially long-term, are shockingly low yet seem to represent publically the face of all claimants. Its abhorrent how grossly misrepresented it all is. The vast majority are disabled or caring for the disabled.

The myth of the idle is how they’re going to slash benefits more and more.

Its exactly what happened to disability benefits. The myth of people with fake bad backs raking in £65822973 a month meant it was politically acceptable to attack them.

Same with the decimation of Widowed parents allowance. The whole “we want to make it easier for them to move in with new partners” giving them illusions that there was a fucktonne of widows and widowers pretending to stay single because of the dosh they were raking in meant (along with the over confidence that it would never happen to them) people said absolutely nothing about it.

Its always “Oh but we don’t mean genuine people” with absolutely not a single care for the genuine people who will absolutely bear the brunt of the cuts when they come.

@JustLyra

Yes but some people will not work if they do manage to get PIP. It is difficult but not impossible. My sisters a MH nurse and regularly gives out the full amount for those with MH problems. With more income coming in there’s not an incentive to work when in actual fact work can be an integral factor in recovery enhancing self worth and social cohesion etc, even for those with severe and enduring MH diagnosis.

It is not the right thing for all people with MH problems mind but many people do fall into the helplessness trap.

Well she’s a MH nurse by trade but works on the side too as a pip assessor I.e devil incarnate according to some.

Political rhetoric…

It’s crazy how people still think it’s so easy.
ny DD’s friend is going through appeal again for her uncontrolled narcolepsy. Apparently hitting the deck 20/30 times a day is “predictably unpredictable” 🙄
DD is fully expecting to have the same battle when her award is renewed (and she relies on the PIP to access transport to Uni).

Right wing tabloids doing the Tories' dirty work for them.

Straight out of 1984 "the daily hate."

Tax credit is the costliest benefit which is paid to those that work, closely followed by housing benefit, so perhaps private landlords who are raking it in should be working instead of just collecting tax payers money and employers should pay a decent wage instead of being subsided by the tax payer.
I’m disabled and I’m working, I don’t claim any benefits, even for my disability, I haven’t even applied for a blue badge.

Pip assessors don’t decide if someone gets the money or at what rate.

That’s a DWP decision maker (who often ignore both their own assessors and medical evidence)

Of course people should work if they can. There's just one thing...

A relative of mine has just been offered a job, and it has taken him 18 months to find work. EIGHTEEN MONTHS. I've lost count of the number he applied for in that time.

How many people like that do you think there are? Because you're describing people who are completely fit and well and don't have caring responsibilities who are on benefits, and there are very, very few.