To think the able bodied / mind/ non carer/ non low wage s worker on benefits, benefit population that claim benefits should contribute somehow to the community/ get the money for WORK .

[Crikeymaccrikey]

Yes this may be costly to set up such as enhanced dbs checks etc.

I feel that this would both give a purpose and a contribution. And lead to jobs possibly/ develop cv / show work ethic.

In addition , it may stop the resentment and the benefit bashing if the claimants are seen to be contributing to society.

This is not necessarily a tory notion.
Karl Marxs idea about each to ones own ability... encompasses this idea of people working together for the whole of society accordi ng to ability. A quick google implies this is actually a socilaist idea of all doing what they can . This is what i am suggesting.

And before anyone says they would be pushed into things.. maybe there could be a choice of ways to contribute ,like on a data base.

Also, I am a cleaner myself. I literally clean poo off loos. I do not feel less worthy than others . I do the job because I can no longer work in my profession , as I get older, ( burnt out nhs) and see nothing but value in my ( ? Seen as some,lowly work). It gives me structure, a decent wage, and I contribute. All good. No shame in doing a good job , whatever that job if it is in my ability.

How can this idea, properly managed be other than reasonable. ?

This

And this

They are already expected to "work". If you are on UC with no health issues or caring responsibilities, you are expected to be job searching full-time.

If they were doing other "work" when would they be job searching?

If they were doing the traditionally low paid jobs, you'll be taking work away from someone that could be earning National Minimum Wage.

Are you aware that a single person under 25 with no children or health conditions receives £265 PER MONTH to live on. If they are over 25 they get £334. It's below subsistence level but you want them to do presumably menial tasks for it, taking a job away from someone else, and stopping them focusing on looking for an actual job?

Litter picking
planting municipal flowers
park maintenance
graffiti removal
grass stemming and cutting
and a whole host at f community work should also be available
This would ensure tax payers would see a benefit and prosperity in return for their financial support. The bad feeling would end over night.

And this

Most of those are carried out by people who paid an actual wage to do it... or people on Community Service or whatever it is called now. The latter have committed a crime, so do it for nothing.
People on benefits have not committed a crime, and should not be expected to work for free.

Some people are already paying half of their salary to prop up the benefits. You would see a mass exodus if it was increased. We are already considering a move to a more affluent tax friendly option. I am not here to sustain the bloated welfare system!

Also, I have worked in the past and been a tax payer. I never looked at someone on benefits and wondered what they could be doing to pay me back or whatever. That is weird.

What happens to the people currently employed to do all that?

Working actually improves mental health. Having purpose, support, direction, autonomy and a future with achievement is incredibly beneficial to well being.

That’s not what I see, having had to advise DD to take her employer to the Employment Tribunal several times for disability discrimination - ie not tackling bullying, harassment, and belittling (and that’s just her manager) several times!

You need to start with a flexible, gentle employer and start slowly and build up. I worked afternoons only at the start, as I found I could manage better

I love the idea that you can tell your work coach 'Well actually, I'm going to need a flexible, gentle employer and I'm only going to work afternoons'. You'd be sanctioned before you'd finished speaking.

It's ridiculous comments like this that show how out of touch some people are. I take it you weren't on UC when you found your lovely gentle employer, @Festoonlights ?

And I bet, too, that you were paid a fair wage for the work you did. Unlike the free labour you're advocating here.

If they are not working but could, and they are fit and able, what benefits are they eligible for?

Everyone I know who doesn't work full time is not working due to mental health problems/disability so not exactly able bodied.I don't actually know a healthy person who doesn't work full time. Other than mothers with young kids (but those fall under people with caring responsibilities). Also know a young person who was not working after graduation and hence claiming but she has gone abroad now (and is working).

They lose their jobs, go on UC, then are forced to do their old jobs for £77pw.

It's genius, when you think about it. Think how the wage bills will be slashed and how profits will shoot up. I can totally see why employers would go for it.

Agree. Lots of people with depression, anxiety, phobias who could get help to return to work. I’ve never known as many people not working due to MH issues as there are now. Clearly something to be focused on.

I'm disabled. On the days I have to stay in bed because the pain is so bad, I'm dosed up with morphine so wouldn't be capable of doing any work. I struggle to even work the remote for the tv. Should i work during my more lucid moments?

There are quite a few fit and well people not working I see them every day in my job. They often do have other barriers to work though such as transport, housing issues, education, experience and sometimes the fact that when young benefits seem enough money if living with family.

I don't think it's the worst idea in the world but not for benefit money. It would need to be paid properly. For example maybe a coach could pick people up at the job centre and take them to pick fruit or veg each day in season. Would take a lot of organising though and probably doesn't make economic sense.

It isn't good for young people to lounge about on benefits for years so maybe something more organised for them would help build confidence and experience as well as improving society in some way.

Some people are paying tax.

Tax goes in to a huge pot.
The same pot that vat, inheritance, property, bed etc tax all do.

Then it's paid out to various places.
Education, defense, pensions, MPs wage, health care. So on and so on.

The unemployed get less than 2% of the total welfare bill.

If you're going to talk nonsense, at least look up your nonsense to make it as least nonsensical as you can.

@Festoonlights who is paying half of their salary to prop up the benefits system? The answer is no one, high rate tax payers pay 40% of part of their salary, so no one is paying more than 40% total. And the wealthy use tax breaks to pay far less as a percentage of their total income than the working class or middle class. And are you also one of those people who don’t use roads, schools, or the NHS? And do you plan on refusing your pension when the time comes? I hope so, otherwise you would be a massive, massive hypocrite.

And what happens to the people currently doing those jobs?

@Livelovebehappy

They usually can’t be helped. I used to work as an IPS employment specialist within secondary mental health and despite having quite a large caseload to help back into work, they never wanted to return due to their MH.

If you don’t want to help yourself the likelihood is no one else can help you. I lost count of the amount of times I helped people with their CVs, arranged interviews for work that would be meaningful for them etc and they simply didn’t want to turn up.
Most just applied for PIP instead essentially using their MH diagnosis to not ever work.

I am unable to work due to MH issues. The only help I have had is to keep me out of hospital/A&E/police cells.
Being able to cope at home and stay out of the above environments does not mean I can walk into a full time job.
My job now is making sure I stay well.

If you mean MH provision needs urgent reform and investment, then yes.

The waiting list for CBT and other therapies where I am is two years. Imagine how people deteriorate in two years.

Also, it's worth remembering that you don't get sickness benefits simply for being a bit depressed. Only those who are profoundly mentally unwell will be getting any form of sickness benefit.

@Mousemat25

There is a job for that and they’re called IPS employment specialists for people with MH conditions. It’s a terribly tough job as you often don’t hit your targets as you can lead the horse to water and all that jazz but you can’t make it drink?

That is despite a LOT of one to one help ans liaising with employers to find meaningful work for the individual and not just any old work programme.

One of the Karl Marx, quoted with context is as follows,

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" (German: Jeder nach seinen Fähigkeiten, jedem nach seinen Bedürfnissen) is a slogan popularised by Karl Marx in his 1875 Critique of the Gotha Programme.[1][2] The principle refers to free access to and distribution of goods, capital and services.[3] In the Marxist view, such an arrangement will be made possible by the abundance of goods and services that a developed communist system will be capable to produce; the idea is that, with the full development of socialism and unfettered productive forces, there will be enough to satisfy everyone's needs"

Source Wikipedia