To think there is little incentive to work hard in the UK

[BeachTree]

Context. 30's, no kids, single, work full time.

Just a bit disheartened. I have never claimed benefits, or any type of support, I work hard to make sure I can support myself (Not disputing those who genuinely require benefits/support) I have always paid all my taxes, and national insurance. I expect by the time I reach retirement age, the 'state pension' may look very different to what it does now and may not be available despite having paid in my whole life.

I feel sometimes that I pay so much into the 'system' and get very little return and don't 'take' from it, whereas there are many people claiming every benefit possible, and constantly 'taking' from the system they don't pay into. There are so many ways to extract money from the system but only for those who don't work full time. I know someone who worked for about 1 or 2 year in late teens in the UK, then worked abroad for a number of years, during this time did not keep up with national insurance payments and obviously not paying UK tax as no in the country, also didn't pay tax in the country they resided in. Returned to England to have a baby on the NHS, now residing back in England, claiming benefits as a single parent for 2+ years, gets assistance with rent council tax etc despite having paid next to nothing in to the system. I cannot compute how this is fair.

For example the cost of living payment, people who claim benefits will get £650, where as those who work and do not claim benefits will get £400. The cost of living crisis affects all of us - perhaps more so the people who work their socks off and aren't 'entitled' to 'support' The system is backwards and not in favour of people who work full time to support our ridiculous benefit system. So many examples - ie. people get help with rent, council tax, working tax credits etc etc etc - however those who work get zero, zilch.

AIBU?

I think you're blaming the wrong group of people. It isn't the people at the bottom taking your money off you, it's the richie riches at the top who are hugely underpaying you and not sharing fairly across the economy to make the whole country better off.

Sorry - total wrong quote!!!

You talk about the state pension but presumably as a working person you are also paying into a private pension? Something those out of work obviously don’t benefit from.
I’m struggling to see what you are jealous off, having been a single parent working part time it wasn’t a situation I relished or wished to stay in.

So many examples - ie. people get help with rent, council tax, working tax credits etc etc etc - however those who work get zero, zilch.

Um, you do realise that to get working tax credits you have to actually work, and unfortunately even working your socks off full time doesn't mean you don't need them.
We need people in low paid and poorly respected jobs, we're seeing the results of less people going for those jobs now in shortage of care workers for example, I read today how district nursing teams are delivering care packages because there aren't enough carers to deliver what's needed, so they've just loaded the shortfall onto an already overstretched NHS instead of looking at ways of improving the shortfall by oh, I don't know, paying a decent wage.

In order to pay them a wage that can be lived on without support, either employers need to be forced to pay more and take less profit (highly unlikely) or we pay more for services like social care and it's ring fenced for workers wages (again, unlikely) or the low wages are subsidised by in work benefits - like working tax credits, as happens now.

As frustrating as it might be to feel you're working your socks off and paying in to get little in return, it's also frustrating to work your socks off in a job that benefits society, for a wage you can't live on and therefore need benefits assistance to do so, and then get slagged off for it. There's more contributions to society than financial, unfortunately those contributions aren't valued at all, although they're certainly relied upon plenty.

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Actually it's not the "benefits cheats" drinking cider in the park who are screwing you over op. It's the 93 billion that we spend on corporate welfare (yes you read correctly 93 billion subsiding often multinational multi million pound organisations... www.york.ac.uk/spsw/research/research-corporate-welfare/
You won't read the academic reports as you are too fixed in your beliefs, but more fool you as you'll be continuously led by the nose to vote for crap that screws you over due to a dogmatic belief and a diet of 'news' fed by an algorithm no dobt maintained by one of the very corporations we are subsiding

@ChateauxNeufDePoop I didn't agree with the OP. I agreed with @NameChangeLifeChange 's post about the social contract being broken and how drastically our society has changed for workers.

@ChateauxNeufDePoop whoops - didn't see your next post until too late. Sorry!

Even better if they are able to convince the DWP that they or their child has some form of ‘disability’. Why do you think diagnosis of Autism /ADHD are so high?

I don’t have a child with a disability, but I know from speaking to friends who do, and from reading MN threads, that getting a diagnosis of autism/ADHD for a child can be incredibly difficult and take years.

If you thought you would be better off on benefits , give it a go

Perhaps look a bit closer at a system where people who work full time need to claim benefits to pay basic bills. Salaries on jobs like office admin, accounts, customer service haven't risen since before the 2008 crash. Rents, house prices, council tax, energy, food - all increased significantly. Why are government benefits subsidising big business paying crap wages?

Wonder if the OP is coming back to post, or just sitting there munching popcorn with a smirk on her face 🙄

I get where you’re coming from, completely, OP.
It must feel hard in your position.
We don’t receive any ‘benefits’ as a family but my DC’s primary education was paid for and if they need to go the doctor’s, I don’t have to pay so I know I’m getting something back.
In your position, if you’re in good health and hardly use the NHS, I can see where you’re coming from.
Yanbu OP for feeling the way you do.

Jack it all in then, go on benefits and see what a piece of piss it is living off peanuts. You could do it, not sure you would like it.
or you could appreciate having a job, having money, feel proud that you support yourself…
it’s a bizarre suggestion that it’s a waste of time to work ‘hard’
if you’re that resentful, perhaps it’s time to change your work/life balance to something more manageable and rewarding.
you’re pissed off at the wrong people - you should be angry at the top tier, not the poorest

This. Goats and big screen TVs all round.

Funny how people always know someone with a disability who is raking it in, yet as pp said if you look at the PIP threads you will see what a disgrace the PIP assessments are and how abusive this government have been to those with disabilities (including me).

And btw, just because you receive PIP doesn't mean that you get free prescriptions either. All you pontificating about the "scroungers" (I know the word hasn't been used but the implication is clear) better pray that you don't end up on the employment scrapheap due to health and disability issues. You would have a bloody rude awakening if you think it's a land of milk and honey.

The children who’s free education you contribute to will one day pay into the system that you may need to use - for your health, or kids, or because you can’t work…

It was the mass of unskilled eastern european labour, flooding into this country that was depressing wages. You are now seeing wages rise as employers, who had binged for years on cheap low-skilled EU workers, realise that ppl are not going to work minimum wage, zero-hour contracts. That ship has sailed. And don't give me that old chestnut about EU workers in the NHS. I work in the NHS and the number of EU staff I have worked with over the years is minimal, one of our registrars is from Hungary, that's it. The overwhelming number of overseas medical staff are from India, Pakistan, Africa, the Caribbean and the Philipines. And the few EU staff working in other areas are all still there.

But the system isn’t designed to help those who do need it - not properly.

Very few jobs work round school hours, hundreds of woman could benefit greatly for having a finger in that pie - those without children at school - me included!

Benefits that are all or nothing need to be looked at, get a job and lose all your rent? Doesn’t make working seem worth it.

Then there’s the non paying fathers - why do we allow that?

Then to top it off we have a crap minimum wage system that sees people who have years experience being paid the same as a new employee, whilst all of them claim working tax credits. Where’s the incentive to earn more to lose benefits?

The employers need to restructure and pay people a living wage where the benefit system helps them by withdrawing the benefits on a sliding scale.

Nurses and teachers have found themselves at the mercy of foodbanks. Where is your energy for billionaires? For landlords? Do you have any idea how hard it is to claim benefits? Do you know how hard it is to live on those benefits? I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt as the current discourse encourages people to point fingers at those equally in need and not those actually hoarding wealth but are you not embarrassed that you've become so sucked in by it?

😂 not heard of goats for awhile.

Whilst I agree that working doesn't necessarily give a good quality of life here because of high costs, high tax & low wages blaming those on benefits is a red herring

One of the current people running for PM didn't know how to put petrol in 'his' car, he's a billionaire. He could afford to eat scrambled diamonds on toast as a snack. How do you think someone in his position should firstly exist and secondly be promising to make the country better. A lot of his ilk went to school whose fees are more than the national average wage. That's where your ire should be directed. Not someone on benefits counting out their pennies at the counter in Asda.

I mentioned about knowing someone with no disability that is getting full PIP when they absolutely don't need it, but I absolutely agree with you on this.

I've seen programmes before where people are absolutely entitled to it yet have to jump through hoops and still don't get it straight away if ever. The whole thing is a sham. I don't claim disability so I don't know first hand. But I feel for anyone who genuinely needs it and has to fight for it. Wrong on so many levels.

Interesting geographical comparison- Africa is lumped together when the other countries are all separated.