Creepy neighbour 2

[Mooshamoo]

I posted here a couple of weeks ago. I bought a house six months ago in a medium town in Ireland. Two middle aged men live next to me.

I posted here that I was on holiday last week, and these men got my estate agent to ring me to see where I was. They are friends with my local estate agent.

They said they were worried about me. This creeped me out as I instantly got the feeling that they werent worried about me, they just wanted to know where I was. I felt it was very intrusive and over the top.

If there was a young woman living alone next to me and I hadn't seen her for a week,I wouldn't dream of getting an estate agent to ring her. It is totally creepy.

Now I am back in my house, my neighbours are creeping me out more. Many times that I go into my front garden, the men come out and stare at me.

For example I went out to cut my front lawn.
I was cutting my front lawn, and the man next door came out into his front garden, and just stared at me the whole time.

Then this morning I went out to pick up a delivery. Next door , he was walking out of his front garden. But when he saw me come into my garden, he stopped walking, just stood there and stayed in his garden and stared at me until I went back in. They never say a word. Just stare.

What do I do. I'm starting to feel really upset in this house. I wanted to have a nice private house. Now I'm starting to feel uncomfortable every time I go out.

Agreed

OP, if you’ve not read back through your posts I’d really encourage you to do so; because I’m genuinely quite concerned by the elevation in your distress related directly to how your perception of events seems to be altering.

The neighbours getting people, plural, to ring you when you go away [for a few days] is very different from their getting the estate agent to do so when you were away for a week. It was of course inappropriate for the estate agent to use your contact details like that & complaining would be entirely correct; but I would assume there was indeed genuine concern motivating it & they went that route rather than having the Gardaí smash your door in on a wellness check.

So I fully understand - & I am not being facetious - is it a genetic creepiness or a cultural creepiness you believe to be at play here? Because the Creepy Old Men of your mummy & aunt’s youth will be [long?] gone now; and presumably the neighbour who went following you about in his car at the very least won’t be doing that to anyone anymore even if he’s on this Earth yet. Are the men next door to you not [at least?] of an age with your parents? Not that men can’t be creepy at any age, but while you’ve posted in AIBU, you’ll not hear any suggestion your neighbours are not a pair of creepy old men.

As PPs have said, telling them not to stare at you matters. Crucially, doing it before you become more stressed &/or they can make it an absolute habit. It also leaves no room for “but you/she never said anything”.

What they’ve done/are doing wouldn’t be considered harassment; but if you feel intimidated by your neighbours’ behaviour, you should seek assistance from the Gardaí.

I'm not sure that when people say 'be friendly' that they're talking about making friends.

More, it's keeping a pleasant demeanour while challenging their behaviour.

Something like, walking over and saying 'hi, is something the matter?'.

Just kindly say ‘hi, are you ok?’

and see what reaction you get? Incase they’re not atypical?

Ah yes, OP, be kind to the creepy men who come out to stare at you and call your estate agent about you.

FFS can we stop telling women to be kind to men!

I don’t want her to be ‘kind to men’ but she needs to know what she’s dealing with. It’s hard to grasp that without her asking the question and seeing how they respond to it.

FFS can we stop telling women to be kind to men!

Well I can't speak for everyone else but my advice to remain pleasant was more about protecting the OP's safety by reducing the chance of things escalating. She already has the heebie jeebies about these men so I'm going to trust her instincts and suggest she doesn't follow some of the advice on here to aggressively challenge them.

Money no object it would be advisable to see a solicitor.

Exactly this. I have the same with my new neighbours.

Did you meet the previous occupier and are you in contact with them at all. If you are you could call and ask them if they had ever had any problems with the neighbours. Maybe they are just waiting for you to strike up a neighbourly friendship, comment on weather, local issues etc. they probably think it odd that you haven’t tried to chat with them, lastly you could chat with estate agent just to let them know how you are doing and ask if they thought it odd that neighbours contacted them when you were away.

put up photos of the queen and the union jack outside your house
and put rule Britannia on loudly each morning singing along with it.

thats what i would do. that would get a reaction. when they ask you why you're doing this, say wtf is it your business and fk off

then they wont stare or come near you.

Nah - rural area. More likely to be two unmarried brothers still living "at home".

I think they're probably just interested more than anything (you know the way cattle come to a fence and watch people, just because there's nothing else to do except eat buttercups). However I wouldn't like it either - it's very intimidating for a woman living alone.

I'd definitely try the "It's rude to stare" 0r "Can I help you?' or even "Will you please not stare at me all of the time - it's very rude". and see what happens. And DEFINITELY report the estate agent to whatever professional body is involved.

And as others have said - Get some male relatives/ friends round (not too many in can they decide you're a scarlet woman). Don't get a dog unless you actually like/want a dog - they are wonderful animals and loads of company, but very tying and they deserve to be loved for themselves not just used as a shield.

Goodness it's outrageous really, Fizzywat posted at around 19:10 and Sandra1884 had the absolute TEMERITY to post 20 minutes later without first checking if the thread had been updated by the time she stopped typing. 🤣🤣

I would ring Estate Agent, tell him you are disturbed by neighbours and thinking of alerting police about harassment/intimidation. It will definitely get back to them! Also tell him it’s unprofessional to give out private info and you don’t want that happening again.

Then build a big fence!

If I was in your position op, I wouldn’t be confrontational, you’re a woman living on your own, they are two adult men so you’re outnumbered for a start. But that doesn’t mean letting them intimidate you, whether they do it intentionally or not.

Take steps to protect yourself, do as other posters suggest, get cctv, a ring doorbell,

Next time you see them out at the same time as you, staring at you or watching you stop whatever it you’re doing and say “Can I help you”? Or “ is there a problem?, You appear to have lost something”. It gives you an advantage, it lets them know you’ve clocked them and puts them on the back foot. It defuses the situation, if it’s innocent, they’ll realise they’ve been a bit intrusive and if they are perving at you, they will know you’re aware and back off.
Shouting out things like “Who are you looking at? You old perv” gives them an advantage, it gives them an excuse to slag you off to anyone who will listen. And then the whole village will be staring at you.
They may be father and son, older brother, younger brother, cousins or friends in a house share situation, they may be gay, who knows.

I have lived in small town Ireland, though going back a few years now, and people will stare if you are new. I would hear things like 'my aunt's friend's brother said that you were in the bookshop last week'. It was invasive but kind of funny. The postman would walk into my house (nobody locked their doors if they were out) and leave the post on the side. I moved there from London so that was a culture shock!
I get that it makes you uncomfortable but I would just introduce yourself and how you came to choose that area. You could even say 'I moved to the country to get away from people, I'm a bit of a hermit' to drop the hint. I expect in their minds you've just blown into the town/village and they are dying of curiosity wondering who you are, what your name is, why the hell you would want to live there.....and they probably have 10 other people asking them about you in the pub. You are probably a minor celebrity to them, the new woman who moved to a town where everybody knows everyone but yet doesn't talk to anyone.

About going away - it's invasive yes (small towns are) but would you have rather been laying dead and they didn't call anyone to see where you were when they hadn't seen you?

Of course, none of us have seen these men. They may be downright odd, or even have a developmental delay or a la long social skills. But the point is that they could just be curious locals and you won't know which it is unless you speak to them.

If it was me I would go over and introduce myself and find out about them. And if I detected any creepiness I could lay down a certain tone or no nonsense attitude in that conversation that will politely say 'do not mess with me' without needing to say it.

And then call the estate agent and ask him about the men next door who always stare....it will get back to them that you don't like it, job done. But try introducing yourself to them first.

When I lived rurally I had an elderly neighbour who lived with his sisters next door. He would pop out of his house every time I left the house and stand and stare at me. Ten minutes to hang the washing or all day renovating the garden there he’d be. He would also drone on repeating the same things over and over. I planted a hedge and he walked through it. I had a tall fence put round the back to make a haven and he walked round and presented himself all pleased at the table where I was having breakfast. I was furious. I went round to their house and informed his sisters that if their brother ever came into my garden again I would be calling the police. He was intellectually challenged but he knew what he was doing because he stopped staring from then on.
Your neighbours may well be a bit simple but I would be telling them they need to stop being such rude eijits. Or get a big male friend to tell them.

@Mooshamoo I would just say hello next time and then something like “can we talk about why you asked the Estate Agent to call me when you haven’t even introduced yourselves as it feels like we got off on the wrong foot. I’ve noticed you staring at me, which I find uncomfortable, but maybe you just don’t know how to introduce yourselves. So perhaps we should do that now”. Gauge from there whether it’s going to stop them or not. Then call the Agent and say while you know they didn’t disclose your number, it’s all a bit creepy and what else did they tell them and to not do it again and if anyone is concerned for you to contact the police. Once you have made contact you might feel more in control and they may stop.

Please do this 😂😂😂

If you’re going to stay you have got to confront this, do it in a friendly way, you should stop what you are doing and chat to them, introduce yourself, ask about them, they are probably lonely unmarried brothers that havn’t a clue about how women react.
Ask the other neighbours about them, in a friendly way again.

Next time you see them stopping and staring say loudly and clearly "Can I help you?"
If they say no, then just ignore them from now on.
If they ignore you, you repeat "I've noticed that you stop and stare as soon as I enter my garden, can I help you? If you don't stop intimidating me, I'll have to report you to the gardai" and move on with whatever you were doing.

I’d get a male to have a word with them.

Women living on their own do attract attention for some reason!

This is awful for you.

how I would deal with it (and I live in Ireland) is a wave, and yell of hello there and then an ignore. Repeat.

dint engage beyond the fake friendly hello. They may want you to move so their second cousin can buy it, they may be surprised that a woman can afford a house alone, they may simply be a bit odd.

but you need to enjoy your home. You need to be able to enjoy the garden and come and go without feeling scrutinised.

hopefully they will soon here bored.

don’t escalate it! Don’t engage beyond vague greetings. Don’t complain about them.

I don’t know laws in Ireland but in uk this would be breach of data protection act.
your estate agent is only allowed to keep your details for legitimate reasons. After sale/ purchase was completed he should have removed and deleted your details from his data base . Even if he forgot to do that he should never have used them for reason not relating to your sale or purchase. He cannot by law use them to ring you for random other things without your express permission

if in uk I would be filing a compliant to the relevant body. In uk that is ICO. They have power to issue largish fines to business who breach the law.

doesn’t do anything about you neighbours, but I assume word would get back to them that they’ve resulted in their friend being fined.

in meantime keep a diary of everything the neighbours do. Add the historic incidents to it. Record everything in it .

I worked with company in Sligo over a period of several years. I was always gob smacked how much people knew about each other’s business. The taxi driver who’d pick me up from airport would be waving and beeping at virtually everyone he saw on 30 min transfer drive and telling me their names and business. He knew more about visiting company VIPs to the site than I did. Lovely bloke but it sure did alarm me . When I went out in evening with my site colleagues they’d greet everyone like their best buddy….that and the sheep keeping - everyone seemed to keep a sheep or 2 in their garden 🤷🏼‍♀️🤣🤣🤣