To be jealous my nursery teacher friend is on more than me

[Nurseryh]

I'm a nursery manager on £23,000; have a been in the job a couple of years. My friend is a nursery teacher and comparing wages, I'm shocked. After having a chat, we literally do the similar things. I feel a bit put off by it but I suppose I'm the stupid one for not qualifying.

What is it with the UK government and loving to have staff on the cheap? Why am I on so much less for literally the same job apart from the different name??

I am currently a Reception teacher but was previously teaching Nursery at the same school. The role is very different to a Nursery manager although many of the day to day responsibilities are the same. For example, I ran a 52 place Nursery (separate groups of am children and pm children) and was the only teacher. Although some of the support staff were nominally key workers, I effectively operated as key worker for all the children, including being responsible for all planning based on next steps, monitoring and sending out all observations, and writing all of the (52!) reports. It is very different to being responsible for those jobs for eight children!
In addition the role of a school teacher is much wider in scope - I am the subject leader for two significant subject areas across the whole school, plus there are extra curricular clubs etc as others have mentioned.
I also think there is more scrutiny of the curriculum in a school based Nursery when Ofsted come knocking - I was and am expected to know how the ELGs and the Development Matters map to the National Curriculum objectives right up to Year 6. In fact, I know a Nursery teacher and EYFS leader whose EYFS unit was downgraded from outstanding to good solely because she couldn't explain how the EYFS curriculum she designed progressed sequentially to a specific Year 3 history objective.
So yeah, not the same, although equally important. And I do agree that Nursery practitioners are underpaid.

Oh dear, there were definitely paragraphs in there when I wrote the post!

They really don't require it. They want to know that as Practitioners, you know where your child started, where you want them to finish and how you will get them to that point.

They want to know your child well enough and you know the eyfs well enough that you can identify any gaps in learning and close them and know how to learn them.

I just can't believe an FS1 'teacher' holds the same status as an A Level Maths teacher. There is no way they are equally qualified or academic.

Oh, and you can sod off with this comment. I went to Cambridge for both my initial degree and my PGCE and also have a Masters. And I've always taught Early Years.

Teachers in school nurseries are required to do it and have to record assessments on the school system.

It comes down to the qualification. She has a higher one, hence will be paid more

As others have said, your lack of a degree is what is reducing your job opportunities and salary. You and your friend may be performing similar tasks, have similar skills etc but she has the degree that opens doors to actual teaching posts. Have you considered finding a way to get a teaching qualification? You have many working years ahead of you and an investment now would pay dividends.

You and your friend may be performing similar tasks, have similar skills etc but she has the degree that opens doors to actual teaching posts.

She already has an ‘actual teaching post’.
I’m a KS2 teacher - my DS was up until yesterday in a nursery that is attached to a school and was taught by a teacher. Not for a second have I thought that her job and mine are not on an equal footing. She plans, she organises learning, she teaches - she doesn’t mark like I do but she is monitoring and recording progress. And sharing that with me on an app, which is not something I have to do for my class. The day to day inns and outs may differ but the effort required to execute them is I’m sure the same.
Teaching a nursery class won’t differ that greatly from teaching in reception. And I’ve done reception, it’s no walk in the park!

You’re a manager on 23000. That’s very low wage

Stop getting your knickers in a twist, I'm AGREEING that EYPs should be paid way more! I'm not implying you're unqualified - I did NOT say this. My sister worked in EY and then trained EYPs - she left as for what she did the pay was awful.

Until it's recognised as important enough to be paid well it won't attract enough quality employees: too often she saw very young school.leavers go into EY with few qualifications as they had limited choices elsewhere. As a result, there are hundreds of nurseries with disenfranchised very young workers looking after children/ making experienced EYPs' lives difficult as, ultimately, they're not invested as the pay is low/ they see no real progression. THESE EYPs are not qualified enough.

The job is not the same as a teacher. Different, equally as valid, but not the same. I'm responsible for 30 kids in a class at A level: my marking is insane and I work long hours. That's my choice. I, too, don't work for the money, but for the love if what I do. If I wanted to earn more money I'd change profession. My friend went straight from school to an office job, 30 years later she earns way more than I do. It's not always about qualifications, it's the way of the world.

@Nurseryh - where are you based? As a manager that is a very low wage. I have two friends who own nurseries. One in midlands pays her manager £30k one in London pays £36k. All their other staff are on £22k or more.

@Nurseryh go qualify then? 🙄

All other staff in a private nursery are on 22k or more? Every early years practitioner that works in either of those nurseries? How many hours are these practitioners expected to work per week out of curiosity? Could you name the nurseries or one of them?

In my experience almost all nursery work is minimum wage.

If she's a teacher shes probably got a 13 to 1 ratio while you presumably have 8? It's a big difference.

@Kanaloa I would rather not name as they are not my nurseries. The London one definitely on more than £22k. They work 40 hours weeks and my friend said they increased all salaries above national wage as it is not fair to have a level 2 on national wage for example and then level three or room leaders on just a fraction more. The work varies quite a bit. Also it is very hard to find good staff that stay committed so a decent salary is needed.

40 hours a week? So it’s just over NMW, which is still a small amount in London! But realistically those two nurseries are outliers rather than representative of the business as a whole. Almost all nursery work will me NMW or a pathetically tiny bit above NMW.

Because she spent 4 years getting a degree and qualified teacher status. And presumably you didn't?

Qualifications, and the investment in them (both money and time) have to count for something, or no one would bother.

"Because she spent 4 years getting a degree and qualified teacher status. And presumably you didn't?"

As mentioned, she may have done a degree in education in three years. OP also has a degree so the difference is the qualified teacher status and NOT (or not necessarily) the number of years.

I can't go and get a history degree and then complain that my nurse friend gets paid more than me..

"I can't go and get a history degree and then complain that my nurse friend gets paid more than me.."

Sure. It's because she has a certain qualification that you don't, but it's not because of the number of years of studying, which is what the person was arguing.

Please don’t do this course because you will never be paid the same as someone with QTS/PGCE. I say this as a former manager of both courses. It’s terribly unfair but it’s the rules.
I feel for you but you are working for a private business that is making a profit out of your work. As I said earlier you’ll be snapped up with all your experience and skills. Would working in EYFS in a school for the deaf be of interest to you?