Just privatise the NHS

[user1237865]

Totally prepared to be told IABU but I've just got to the point where I think the NHS is so far gone it should be privatised.

Totally outing so I've Name changed. In NI we have 2 private hospitals but they don't do emergency's, they don't do ante natal care. Really they only provide you with an appointment with a consultant who will then decide in treatment which in most cases will happen on the NHS. If it's something like cataracts they'll do it but the private hospitals here don't do anything major. Perhaps the rest of the UK is the same. I'm not sure.

Today DSis was sent to A&E by the GP. DM and her have now been waiting 7 hours to be seen. While waiting another man collapsed and died in front of them. I think this is beyond ridiculous how can they let this happen?! If people were seen in a decent time frame this would be less likely.

FIL has terminal cancer again nowhere to treat him when he gets recurring sepsis so most times he sits on a chair (around ever 2 months) for 36 hours getting an IV in A&E before he's finally gets moved to a ward.

I paid for private ante natal care each time I was pregnant. It did give me appointments every 3 weeks and scans with a consultant but when it came to giving birth it was a time when the consultant was working a shift for the NHS thus using their resources and beds. Yes the care was probably therefore cheaper than had I been paying for my stay in hospital too but it isn't an option here.

The whole things a complete joke. Those willing to pay/ have insurance are still stuck blocking the NHS which in my opinion should be there for those that can't afford their own treatment or can't get insurance through their job.

Surely if a lot of it was private, pay would be better, meaning more people choosing it as a career (and not leaving) meaning people actually get proper care! Though so much of what I think could be wrong as I don't understand it all fully.

The Tories are in the pockets of health insurance companies so are deliberately starving the NHS of funds so that it fails. They know that destroying the NHS is the only way to get public sentiment to agree to privatisation (which would then boost many an MPs private investment portfolio). It’s all there in black and white in the MP financial disclosures. It’s just that the public doesn’t actually look that information up or connect the dots.

I follow a nurse on TikTok and they post about people in their gp surgery and what they want to see a dr for.

Sunburn
Athletes foot that hasn't gone after a week
Thrush
Cystitis
Ingrown toenails

I have type 1 diabetes, I would need to see the GP or the diabetes nurse for all of those.

You should come and work a shift and see how many people are sitting down behind a desk..

Me too. Having private healthcare with universal healthcare is a form of corruption because in practice it just means that those with money can pay to jump the queue for healthcare. That means people die unnecessarily while waiting because doctors and resources are prioritised towards those who pay more (pay to go private) instead of prioritised towards those most in clinical need.

This is the ONS on health spending 2021. This is, of course affected by Covid. Might be worth looking at pre-Covid spends.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/healthcaresystem/bulletins/healthcareexpenditureukhealthaccountsprovisionalestimates/2021

Government healthcare expenditure in 2021 was higher than in any other year

Our initial estimates suggest that government healthcare spending in 2021 was in the region of £229 billion, accounting for over four-fifths (83%) of total healthcare expenditure. This was higher than spending in any other year, including 2020. In 2021, healthcare spending represented around 45% of overall government spending on goods and services in the UK (General Government final consumption expenditure). This figure, using the definitions of the System of Health Accounts 2011, includes many long-term care services typically considered as social care in the UK.

It’s not underfunded at all. It wastes money everywhere. It doubled the number of bureaucrats in the last couple of years and last week was advertising a £108k job for director of diversity and inclusion. It doesn’t need money it needs to be completely reformed.

@HuffleWoof Some people abuse the system, yes. But I've been to the doctor numerous times for thrush because it is recurrent and treatment resistant. I've also been for thrush when I was pregnant because any decent pharmacist won't sell a pessary to you without a prescription when you're visibly pregnant.

Cystitis can be a massive issue resulting in sepsis if not treated with antibiotics for a bad case.

Some sort of partly privatised system would be a good idea

This is exactly what the tories want you to think.

You've played in to their hands.

Privatisation would be the worst route for the NHS. It would become profit driven. The NHS wastes so much money. Why in 2022, do they insist on posting appt and follow up letters? When most patients have access to email and could add appts with their online calendars. Health tourism is also something that the NHS needs to get tough on. Retention of staff is an issue, strategies need to be put in place to counteract this. Management needs streamlining. Lots of opportunities to cut costs and improve efficiency.

That’s not true. The U.K. baseline spending on the NHS is around £136bn per year. It’s been temporarily augmented to £230bn this year due to COVID (and COVID backlog). But even at £230bn, that is less than 25% of U.K. Gov spending.
www.statista.com/statistics/298524/government-spending-in-the-uk/

coolernow · Today 05:32

It's unsustainable. We now have more over 65s than under 15s. To fund adequate health & social care for that people are going to have to pay more & not just from income. No one would vote for it though because people think they've paid for their future care when most haven't.

This.

And why does being over 60 automatically mean free prescriptions? Obviously those entitled to benefits at this age should access free prescriptions (like at any other age) but just being that age? I mean 60 isn't even retirement age.

This sort of waste of money is just unnecessary.

So you don't think the NHS should be an inclusive workplace?

"Bureaucrats" ensure drugs are competitively priced, bedding equipment all available for front line staff to use.

Without good back room staff, medical staff wont be able to do their jobs.

As previously stated, the NHS is one of the worlds most efficient healthservices in the world.

@Roselilly36 totally agree with all your points - particularly about letters, we’ve had a few arrive after the appointment date, which is then more wasted cost in missed appointments and rescheduling.

Ok, this post is clearly a wind-up.

The uk spends less per head than many countries with private health systems ( poor countries spend less per head but only the rich get any treatment)

We get better outcomes for less much less cash than say USA

We have a government who would love to privatise it as they hate paying to support people who are ill or old or otherwise not good productive economic units because they can't imagine being poor

So the government does what it can to bring it to disrepute - and some people fall for it

Oh, yes private businesses are very efficient at making profit. It’s just that IRL healthcare systems run by private businesses make decisions like the cost of treatment to prolong a patients life by months/years is “inefficient” as it “negatively impacts on profit margins”, so the result is the insurance company denies coverage and the patient is left to die. Over time, the insurance company gets greedy and raises the premiums and copays that patients pay so many end up going without healthcare because they cannot afford it. So yes, I don’t doubt that there is plenty of profit to be made by privatising healthcare. It won’t save overall costs though, because the profit is literally squeezed from the budget. And you can see the proof of this in the US…shorter life expectancy, millions with no healthcare, higher per person spending on healthcare, etc.

In the NHS every cost is analysed too, but their efficiency goal is best outcome for the patient not the company’s profits.

Having a functioning NHS benefits individuals and companies.

It is funded out of general taxation (not national insurance), and that includes corporation tax.

The tax burden needs shifting and the economy has to get used to having more over 65s. We have a current model of work and then retire, but what if people want to work later? Keep them healthy for longer and yes they can do!

perhaps if this country wasn’t so xenophobic and encouraged migration, we would have a fluid younger population who would be welcome to work here and pay taxes instead of demonised. This would help massively too.

👏👏👏

Totally agree: they lead to missed appointments. We had to repeatedly ask for our address to be updated as letters were going to an old address, and nothing changed, so I missed three scan appointments. And we’ve also had letters arrived after an appointment date. I know there are data issues but they could be tackled.

What i don't get with the calls for reform/privatisation etc is how any of that, apart from being very expensive and disruptive (as any re org is) would get the new organisation, more medical staff?

Are there 10s of 1000s of qualified AHPs working in other industries waiting to rejoin a revitalised health service? and if there are, who would do their jobs if they left these sectors?

Yes the GPs have been quietly privatised…and guess what they are now absolute shit. Completely inefficient. Millions cannot even get an appointment. Privatising ruined the GP Surgery.

Another person who sees the odd job advert and thinks they know the answer.
the NHS has been “reformed” so many times. It doesn’t work because it avoids the hardest issue which is that it needs more money.

as does adult social care.

But there are no grown ups actually able to grasp that and just do it. Fund it properly, stop cocking about and tweaking it and let it settle down!

perhaps if this country wasn’t so xenophobic and encouraged migration, we would have a fluid younger population who would be welcome to work here and pay taxes instead of demonised. This would help massively too

Lol We voted to kick out 1000s of qualified EU staff from the NHS and make sure no one from EU wants to come here.... but now moan about poor care.

Except you’re wrong, all those countries have publicly funded universal healthcare system. They don’t have a privatised healthcare system. Some have private as an option, similar to the U.K., but the vast majority of people in these countries use the universal publicly funded healthcare system.

Switzerland has universal healthcare, not privatised.
France has universal healthcare, not privatised.
Germany has universal multi-payer healthcare, not privatised.
Austria also universal healthcare, not privatised.
Sweden universal healthcare, not privatised
Denmark universal healthcare with private option alongside like UK
Finland universal healthcare, not privatised

The NHS is not badly managed. That’s propaganda designed to get you thinking private companies better at managing than civil servants.