Just privatise the NHS

[user1237865]

Totally prepared to be told IABU but I've just got to the point where I think the NHS is so far gone it should be privatised.

Totally outing so I've Name changed. In NI we have 2 private hospitals but they don't do emergency's, they don't do ante natal care. Really they only provide you with an appointment with a consultant who will then decide in treatment which in most cases will happen on the NHS. If it's something like cataracts they'll do it but the private hospitals here don't do anything major. Perhaps the rest of the UK is the same. I'm not sure.

Today DSis was sent to A&E by the GP. DM and her have now been waiting 7 hours to be seen. While waiting another man collapsed and died in front of them. I think this is beyond ridiculous how can they let this happen?! If people were seen in a decent time frame this would be less likely.

FIL has terminal cancer again nowhere to treat him when he gets recurring sepsis so most times he sits on a chair (around ever 2 months) for 36 hours getting an IV in A&E before he's finally gets moved to a ward.

I paid for private ante natal care each time I was pregnant. It did give me appointments every 3 weeks and scans with a consultant but when it came to giving birth it was a time when the consultant was working a shift for the NHS thus using their resources and beds. Yes the care was probably therefore cheaper than had I been paying for my stay in hospital too but it isn't an option here.

The whole things a complete joke. Those willing to pay/ have insurance are still stuck blocking the NHS which in my opinion should be there for those that can't afford their own treatment or can't get insurance through their job.

Surely if a lot of it was private, pay would be better, meaning more people choosing it as a career (and not leaving) meaning people actually get proper care! Though so much of what I think could be wrong as I don't understand it all fully.

Then why don't you?

you don't HAVE to get it on prescription??

Where on Earth have you got 40% from 🤣 The DHSC spent £192bn via the NHS in 2020/2021. Total government managed expenditure was £1,112bn. That's more like 17%

It is more efficient to fund the NHS via national taxation for many obvious reasons.

The NHS has been eyed as a cash cow for years - same with other national services which were initially set up by government.

It is funny how the private sector comes along after the government has done the hard graft of setting up national services, claims to be more efficient and usually cocks it up for their own gain (see trains, water services, energy, children’s homes, I could go on).

They will do the same with the NHS.

I've worked in private hospitals in the uk and they're totally incapable of dealing with post operative complications. It really is like in 'this is going to hurt' any sign of emergency like pph or post operative bleeding is shipped off to the nhs. They don't have the resources to deal with emergencies. I've seen women pay ££££ to be looked after in a private hospital, only to be sent by ambulance (for which you call 999) to the nhs to save the baby or the mother.

Yes the nhs has its issues but we shouldn't privatise it. People will still be using it as well as paying through the nose for things.

My issue with the 'just privatise it' calls, people will not be able to afford to be looked after. People will die and they'll still blame the nhs.

I follow a nurse on TikTok and they post about people in their gp surgery and what they want to see a dr for.

Sunburn
Athletes foot that hasn't gone after a week
Thrush
Cystitis
Ingrown toenails

That's the issue. People want a face to face appointment with gps for stupid reasons that the pharmacy could deal with, then they go to a&e with it when they can't get an appointment at the dr.

Fund the social care system properly so old people aren't stuck in hospital waiting for care home placements and you'll free up so much more space in hospitals

@Pyewhacket needs to do some research.

Our population is getting older and has grown and is getting more unhealthy. That obviously has an impact.

Prevention is better than the cure but oh wait, the government won’t do anything about inequality (which is known to negatively impact health outcomes), has cut public health funding, has let covid rip (which will mean millions have long covid)……

@Pyewhacket your grasp of public finances and outcomes is weak.

Tiktok is that great known source of independently verified information 🤣

I went to the doctor for cystitis @HuffleWoof because I was pissing blood! Not going to rock up to a pharmacy because I needed antibiotics.

Also the NHS is having to suck up the cost of inflation via increased prices, pay rises for nurses, admin, doctors and dentists...the government isn't funding that stuff. But £12bn will not send their funding level up to 50% of government spending... that's only 6% of their 2020/21 budget and we all know inflation is running at 9%+ and more is being asked of the NHS each year with people becoming more elderly and more unwell. They're making 30-40% of jobs redundant at NHS England to save £1bn over five years. Those decisions are being made as a result of current budgets and the need to make efficiency savings. It is also likely significant programmes will not be able to continue due to funding limits. Cancer care to name one...

nursingnotes.co.uk/news/politics/health-chiefs-warn-of-difficult-choice-between-cancer-care-and-a-nhs-pay-rise/

I think it depends on the area you're in. We're in the Midlands and our local (major teaching) hospital is utterly brilliant. Likewise in the northwest where my elderly dad is. Both Trusts have received awards for their great care. There's defo been a sharp decline in standards generally due to lockdowns but I think it comes down to the management of the particular Trust. This leads me to think that if some Trusts can get it right, why can't them all?

There’s a fair amount of evidence that the current government wants to see an American style system. It fits the ideology of small government and that market forces will solve problems.

if we brought our healthcare spending in line with current OECD norms and kept corporate profits out of the NHS, we might see an improvement. My experience of bringing contract companies in to deliver work is you do get more bang for your buck but they cost more because they need to make money and when they aren’t making money either because the work isn’t there or because they’re incompetent then they will get more creative in looking for the money.

Regardless of who pays for it (NHS or private) you still need the same number of staff treating the same number of patients - 'making it private' doesn't unlock doors to a wealth of amazing staff members in glorious buildings waiting to welcome you in. There are only so many people working in healthcare and so many buildings. There will be a lot less with a massive shift to privatisation as the terms and conditions of employment are likely to be worse and we'd be unable to pay the cost of healthcare ourselves so would seek alternative employment.

And there isn't 'people who can afford it and need to pay more' and 'people who can't afford' - what about the tons of people in the middle who on paper should be able to afford something but in reality can't at all for all sorts of reasons. What then? Think of all the people who can't afford dentistry now who live in pain. That's what you're condemning people to.

Yeah as long as you’ll give up your pension rights and pay more tax

usa spends more gdp on private health care than any other western nations

The problem as I see it is that the NHS needs a complete overhaul but no political party is ever going to be brave enough to do it. Everyone agrees that in its current form it is not efficient but is fearful of any change.

The public need to stop treating it like an all
Risks deluxe insurance policy and be prepared to make their own judgements. For example as I read on hear so many times, little Johnny does not need to be 'checked' as he tripped over.

The NHS is not underfunded just poorly organised and managed.

Slightly worrying that she’s compromising her professionalism like that. Thrush and cystitis can both be serious issues requiring proper treatment and/or mistaken for other things. An ingrowing toenail can require proper medical attention.

I don’t know what the solution is but I do know that I’ve experienced superb medical care in France, Belgium and Austria, all of which have national health insurance topped up by an element of co-pay (through private insurance) for those who can afford it.

I live in Switzerland. We pay 1500 a month for insurance. Then we have an excess for every bill. DC needs a dentists brace and the estimate is 15,000! We can't afford it.
DD's glasses cost 500, insurance gives us 180 back.

It's wonderful but expensive.

Vote, for goodness sake. Use tactical voting instead of moaning.

It may fit their ideology but their ideology has been proven wrong.

It is better for the nation overall if everyone is as healthy as they can be. Not if only those who are minted are as healthy as they can be. Not everyone can be billionaires.

Yes, you are being VVU.

The NHS is not underfunded just poorly organised and managed

Yet when that allegation has been researched, rather than just an ill informed comment, it shows that the NHS is one of the most efficient in the world.

Its just a lie the tories put out to speed along their obsession with privatising the NHS, which most of those in Govt or at the top of the Tory have expressed the desire to.

The Swiss pay around 8000 euros per person for their healthcare, thats significantly more than the UK does.

Behind a desk? I take it you don't mean the huge numbers of people on band 2-3, then?

Well we all knew this was coming. This is what the British government want, following the US, and returning to its own brand of Victorian imperialism.

No no and no, op. We don’t work all the hours we can get for wages that buy nothing now to be told we are not worth basic healthcare either.

Australia is perfect - pay private insurance and we’ll give you a 30% discount or pay extra into the nhs over a certain salary level - your choice.

Everyone goes private and gets amazing non critical care. Freeing up the waiting lists for those who need it and A&E for everyone.
why aren’t we copying them ?

A mixed system like in France would be best. Those who can't afford to pay don't have to; those of us who can, would.

Im leaving private healthcare to go to nhs...better pension and equipment in nhs plus I've been bullied in both private hospitals. More interesting cases in nhs too.
Sorry you had such bad care though op.

They are only private in that we are given a budget from the health boards and have to manage our buildings/staff/heat light repairs out of this budget. When the health boards provide GP services it costs the country far more and they push us to take back our budget.

I need to tarmac our carpark and put in 3 new boilers where I work. That's the best part of £25k that comes out of our budget before I get paid. Once I have paid all these bills then I get my share which is not as high as the daily mail would have you believe

No. Just no. It works. It's straining. But it's one of the best things about the UK, we should be proud and fight for it. Once it's gone, it's gone and we'll never get it back.