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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think there is no solution to bullying

113 replies

cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 19:06

So my ds has been in a team for just over 2 years. He is not the best on the team, or the worst - if that matters. The coach is very competitive. DS has been miserable going to matches and training for about 6 months. He says (and I've seen and heard it) the boys give out to him all the time, if he makes a mistake they say under their breath FFS, or tell him he's standing in the wrong place, or shout at him. The coach's son was the worst culprit. So gradually DS attendance has fallen off. I offered to speak to the coach but DS said it wouldn't help, would probably make things worse - does speaking to the coach ever work?

Anyway last night was another training session, and ds didnt want to go, so I just said we should just tell them he is leaving - it was hard, cos he loves football, and I have made friends (as I thought) with some of the parents. Anyway, in the end, he made the decision to leave (with my help). So I texted the coach and said I would ring him tmw - it was getting late at this stage so I didn't want to disturb him by ringing.

Almost immediately he texts the group chat saying DS has decided to leave and best wishes to him. He also texts me that he had had a feeling for a while that DS was becoming disinterested.

I slept on it, but it really annoyed me, that yet again, this kind of thing was being swept under the carpet, and the coach was even going so far as to say ds wasnt committed enough - that was what he was hinting at.

So wrote a long text to the coach explaining how unhappy ds had been, that I had witnessed the behaviour of the boys, that I had suggested saying something to him, but ds said no way, that I felt it may not have made any difference in any case, as once it's the norm to pick on someone, it's very difficult to change that narrative. I mean 13 year old boys don't take much heed of what the adults say do they. I've seen it before - when a teacher has tried to 'help' and ended up making things worse.

Well, the coach is very angry - he wrote me a long email about how the club does not condone bullying and that he had seen or heard nothing, and that I was to describe specific incidents to him (which of course I can't, as it's that insidious, snide type of bullying that is very hard to pin down). In a word, he is clueless how to deal with it. He said that the boys were very competitive, as they should be, and challenged each other. I wanted to respond that ds is well able for banter, and is very competitive and is popular at school, with lots of friends. But I didn't. I also posted a similar message in the group chat. (I left the group then).

Only 1 mother has texted me to say how sorry she is - ironically her son is one who was nice to ds on a few occasions.

I'm just disappointed, not surprised, but I was bullied in school over 30 years ago, and honestly the attitudes and ways of dealing with it don't appear to have changed one bit. Don't we need to look at this from a different angle. THe coach was literally blaming ds for not coming forward He said "DS has never mentioned anything to me or the other coachers". Well OF COURSE he hasnt, are you an idiot.

Just wondered about others experiences - is there an answer to bullying, or are we destined to leave it up to the victim to leave, move on, heal themselves, always wondering if there is something "wrong" with them, that they got picked on.

I'm left with a nearly 14 year old who is very down on himself, thinks he is crap at football, and what team would even want him now. I'm so sad - he bloody loves football. Not fair.

OP posts:
cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 19:10

sorry that was really long!!!! If you want the condensed version - ds bullied in football team, decided to leave, coach has no clue except defensiveness and victim blaming.

OP posts:
cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 19:17

PS I'm also sad - the parents I got to know are not my "friends" are they. Just random folk who I chatted to at matches. I really struggle with this generally in life. I always think I'm "more friends" with someone, and then get let down/disappointed when I realise I'm not. Does that happen to anyone? Like we would have shared quite a lot about our lives, our kids, etc etc.

OP posts:
jimboandthejetset · 12/07/2022 19:19

I'm sorry your son has gone through this. My DC's are involved in a couple of sorts clubs, and over the last year a few things have happened that has really brought home the fact that coaches are parent volunteers who can get out of their depth when things get challenging. My DCs haven't been impacted, I'm happy with the clubs and will continue to support them. But we have always kept a close eye on how the teams are managed etc. I totally understand that you didn't want to go against your son's wishes, but this type of thing needs nipping in the bud, with escalation to the club safeguarding lead / league SG team if needed.

I hope your DS can find another local team to join where he is treated with respect. Flowers

Aquilegia23 · 12/07/2022 19:20

He says (and I've seen and heard it) the boys give out to him all the time, if he makes a mistake they say under their breath FFS, or tell him he's standing in the wrong place, or shout at him

To be honest, I don't think this qualifies as bullying. Football is very competitive, and it's natural for team members to comment if they think a player is wrong. Saying 'ffs' isn't bullying.

I appreciate that you are disappointed that your son left the team, but that was his own choice. The coach didn't ask him to leave.

Thereisnolight · 12/07/2022 19:23

Being very very honest - was this a competitive team rather than a fun team? And if so, was your son really competitive enough or engaged enough or motivated enough to play at that level? Standing in the wrong place etc?
Apologies if I sound critical - I’m just asking in case there may have been a difference of opinion over how seriously they were supposed to take it. Were the other boys being bullies or were they frustrated by your DS not being fully engaged?

CassandrasCastle · 12/07/2022 19:48

If I was a parent in the group, I wouldn't respond immediately to your message either tbh.

jimboandthejetset · 12/07/2022 19:48

Aquilegia23 · 12/07/2022 19:20

He says (and I've seen and heard it) the boys give out to him all the time, if he makes a mistake they say under their breath FFS, or tell him he's standing in the wrong place, or shout at him

To be honest, I don't think this qualifies as bullying. Football is very competitive, and it's natural for team members to comment if they think a player is wrong. Saying 'ffs' isn't bullying.

I appreciate that you are disappointed that your son left the team, but that was his own choice. The coach didn't ask him to leave.

The OP said he's neither the best nor the worst player. Is it just him that's being treated like this? The team should be behaving in a way that shows respect and sportsmanship. Imagine a child in a classroom, and one or a bunch of kids muttering "ffs" every time they do something. I'm pretty sure that's classed as bullying.

cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 19:49

My ds is very competitive ! He took everything the coach said to heart. He practises outside all the time. On sunday mornings before a match he would get up early and run around the block as the coach had said they should do this. I don't think I'm explaining very well. There are about 6 or 7 boys who are really good, and the rest of the team is pretty average, or worse than DS. These 6 or7 seemed to put all the blame on ds if they had a loss. Also before the match not one of them would speak to him. I saw it with my own eyes. We'd be in the car and ds would be nervous - what if he made a mistake, why didn't they like him etc etc,. I'd say just go up and 'join in'. And he would go up and grab a ball and join in with the group and they would all move away from him and turn their backs on him. It was very noticeable. Same after the matches - none of them would walk back with him, he was always on his own.

He did a trial for about 3 months before he was allowed onto the team - and the coach said he didn't know if would allow him on. But he tried really hard, and the coach said ok you're in. The thing about ds is he responds really well to praise - when the coach praised him, or at the beginning when the boys would shout 'good shot' etc, he would play even better. but it became more and more negative.

We can argue about the language - was it bullying? Seemed so to me but people will say it wasnt.

Also if the coach was that concerned, he could have talked to ds and asked him was he ok, or talked to me. As the more negative things got, the more ds froze IUKWIM. There was one particular match where ds missed a goal and the whole team shouted at him, and the coach immediately took him off after roaring at him, and he was on the bench for the rest of that match.

I mean it's not manchester united here right?

And the other parents - wusses. It's so "my kids ok so I'll not say anything". Nobody cares as long as their kid is ok. Am more disappointed that only 1 mother, who I don't even know, texted me. They don't care - maybe they all wanted him off the team. I'd prefer if they'd had the courage to just come to me and ds and say it. Rather than this insidious and snide things he has had to put up with.

OP posts:
cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 19:52

CassandrasCastle · 12/07/2022 19:48

If I was a parent in the group, I wouldn't respond immediately to your message either tbh.

How come? Keep your head down kind of thing? Not my business kind of thing?

I really respect that one mother who texted me and said she felt so bad for DS. She also said that her ds felt like an 'outsider' on the team, but had decided he could put up with it, and so was staying. And I don't think I ever spoke to her at a match as I don't recognise her pic. Some people are just genuine.

OP posts:
Clymene · 12/07/2022 19:53

Aquilegia23 · 12/07/2022 19:20

He says (and I've seen and heard it) the boys give out to him all the time, if he makes a mistake they say under their breath FFS, or tell him he's standing in the wrong place, or shout at him

To be honest, I don't think this qualifies as bullying. Football is very competitive, and it's natural for team members to comment if they think a player is wrong. Saying 'ffs' isn't bullying.

I appreciate that you are disappointed that your son left the team, but that was his own choice. The coach didn't ask him to leave.

You know precisely jack shit about bullying.

OP - is it a regulated club? I'd escalate. He's rubbished your concerns rather than addressing them. And it sounds like he was relieved your DS left because that was a headache he didn't (or couldn't) deal with.

cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 19:53

Yeh it only happened to ds. I saw other boys miss shots all the time, and nothing was said by either team members or coaches. Often the boys would fist pump and said don't worry kind of thing. DS noticed this a lot. He noticed no other boy getting the treatment he did.

OP posts:
Runnerbeansflower · 12/07/2022 19:59

Aquilegia23 · 12/07/2022 19:20

He says (and I've seen and heard it) the boys give out to him all the time, if he makes a mistake they say under their breath FFS, or tell him he's standing in the wrong place, or shout at him

To be honest, I don't think this qualifies as bullying. Football is very competitive, and it's natural for team members to comment if they think a player is wrong. Saying 'ffs' isn't bullying.

I appreciate that you are disappointed that your son left the team, but that was his own choice. The coach didn't ask him to leave.

Stunned that you don't see this as bullying.

'Competitive' is no excuse. If he was picked for the team, and was doing his best, then he should expect support from his team mates.

Runnerbeansflower · 12/07/2022 20:00

If he was good enough to be selected for the team, he was good enough to be supported by his team mates

BeenThereBoughtTheTeeShirt · 12/07/2022 20:01

Is the club connected to school or separate?
If not connected, I would reply to the email with the fact that you yourself witnessed insidious bullying from the top seven players including his own son, which as a coach he should not be blind to. But I am a bolshy bugger.

CassandrasCastle · 12/07/2022 20:02

I guess I'd want to speak to my child first? @cofingalthetime

cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 20:04

Clymene · 12/07/2022 19:53

You know precisely jack shit about bullying.

OP - is it a regulated club? I'd escalate. He's rubbished your concerns rather than addressing them. And it sounds like he was relieved your DS left because that was a headache he didn't (or couldn't) deal with.

Thanks - this attitude to bullying really depresses me. People really have no clue do they. Including this coach. I felt his response was very immature. And confirmed my and ds instinct that saying something would result in anything but making it worse.

I cant help but think that the coach might have been slagging ds off to his own son as he was one of the main team members who always had a go at ds.

Other things included in training - always allowing the same couple of boys to "be captain" and ds always always always being picked last with a lot of groaning.

OP posts:
RedWingBoots · 12/07/2022 20:07

With the next team he plays for if they give him shit like that he immediately needs to leave and he find another team.

Unfortunately some sports teams are nasty and cliquey, so it's whether your face fits and not on your ability.

girlfriend44 · 12/07/2022 20:09

Move on. You've left now and said your bit. Your just prolonging the agony.

Find something else or another team.

girlfriend44 · 12/07/2022 20:10

cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 20:04

Thanks - this attitude to bullying really depresses me. People really have no clue do they. Including this coach. I felt his response was very immature. And confirmed my and ds instinct that saying something would result in anything but making it worse.

I cant help but think that the coach might have been slagging ds off to his own son as he was one of the main team members who always had a go at ds.

Other things included in training - always allowing the same couple of boys to "be captain" and ds always always always being picked last with a lot of groaning.

Boys shouldn't be picking their own teams. The coach should be sorting out the teams imo.

Runnerbeansflower · 12/07/2022 20:11

girlfriend44 · 12/07/2022 20:09

Move on. You've left now and said your bit. Your just prolonging the agony.

Find something else or another team.

That's right. No consequences for bullying and favouritism.

cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 20:11

BeenThereBoughtTheTeeShirt · 12/07/2022 20:01

Is the club connected to school or separate?
If not connected, I would reply to the email with the fact that you yourself witnessed insidious bullying from the top seven players including his own son, which as a coach he should not be blind to. But I am a bolshy bugger.

lol after his first response which was the usual spouting of how the club does not condone bullying, HE would never condone bullying, and he had had never witnessed, seen or heard anything, and neither had the other coaches. But if I wanted to talk about a "specific" incident I should telephone him.

I did say then "with all due respect" (a phrase I loathe, but it seemed perfect in this instance), that rather than denying it occurred, or blaming ds for not telling him, he should take the opportunity to reflect on how unhappy ds had been made to feel, and how he missed it.

In all seriousness though, it's a problem isnt it. I've seen it so many times, and I don't know what the solution is. When you have these attitudes, and just ignorance really, it seems we have not moved on at all, or learnt anything.

I mean, imagine if ds HAD said something - first it would have been denied, even if accepted, the players would hate ds even more.

OP posts:
cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 20:15

Runnerbeansflower · 12/07/2022 20:11

That's right. No consequences for bullying and favouritism.

Yeh, yet again time for the victim to move on, while the bullies and their enabler, get to enjoy their summer of football, and pretend like nothing ever happened - and it ever is mentioned, I will be put down as a "dramatic" person, "sure it was just a bit of banter" "your ds was too sensitive" " he wasnt' good enough and should accept his treatment" and on and on it goes.

Yeh I'm very ready to move on - I'm just reflecting on how insidious and how bloody difficult it is to see a solution for bullying.

The kids who are the ones who are really good at football now think it's fine to behave like that. And maybe they're right - they will go far in life right? It's all a competition - start early. Are these the sons we want? Just asking the question.

OP posts:
cofingalthetime · 12/07/2022 20:18

CassandrasCastle · 12/07/2022 20:02

I guess I'd want to speak to my child first? @cofingalthetime

@CassandrasCastle I can tell you what some of the boys will say to their mums and dads if they even mention it to them - which I don't think they will tbh.

"But MUM, cofingalthetime DS is TERRIBLE, it's not FAIR, we're losing matches cos of HIM" "Even the coach says so"

MUM: "Well, it's not nice you need to be kind to your team mates"

Kid: "But MUM, that's not FAIR, he is SHIT at football, he shouldnt even be on the team, everyone hates him, it's good that he's left"

I don't think empathising with me, about the misery my son has been through should be a problem? It wasnt' for the one mother who was decent enough to txt me. Apple doesnt fall far from the tree I guess @CassandrasCastle

OP posts:
RedWingBoots · 12/07/2022 20:18

I mean, imagine if ds HAD said something - first it would have been denied, even if accepted, the players would hate ds even more.

Yes.

Unfortunately unless a few people stand up to the coach and leave the team, SFA will be done.

Clymene · 12/07/2022 20:19

I should have guessed his son was on the team. This is sad,y, depressingly common.