Teacher insulting my daughter

[Lua1978]

I work as a teacher at the same secondary school my daughter attends. In the staff workroom yesterday, a couple of teachers were discussing which two pupils they'd overheard saying something about something another pupil had done which they needed to report as a safeguarding concern.

When one of these teachers (who clearly has no clue it's my daughter she's referring to) starts going into great depth discussing one of the girls appearance as they couldn't remember her name... all very personal comments. She then remembered the pupils name and said "oh yeah it's (dds name)" she's got a very unusual name and the only one in the school for sure.

TBH if they had said poorly applied fake tan and skirt rolled up to short I'd have thought fair enough! I'm not overly precious about my daughter but these comments were really personal. I just sat there absolutely stunned and then walked out as honestly I was going to lose my temper or cry if I didn't and I'm normally a really calm person who doesn't get worked up about stuff.

Should I report it- it was really unprofessional, obviously she had no clue it's my daughter but it was so derogatory

You’re spot on here.

You absolutely cannot have a bitch fest in the staff room when discussing minors. It’s one thing when “bitching” about adults (they’re fully aware of their behaviours) and bitching about children who are still incredibly immature, learning and growing up. I can’t think of a single adult who didn’t make any mistakes in their teenage years.

There’s also the imbalance of power in this situation, too, as these kids never will know what’s said about them. At least when it’s a workplace situation where adults are entirely involved, the chances are the person will find out and be able to defend themselves. There will also be procedures in place to sort these issues out and disciplinary measures available if something truly bad has been said.

OP should absolutely report the behaviour. And some posters on this thread should stop thinking the sun shines out of every teacher’s arse.

In a senior school with departmentalised staff I certainly would not consider it a failing if one member of staff does not know the family circumstances of another. There were over 50 odd members of staff at my DDs' school. I don't know the names of the children of most of my colleagues: why would teachers be more likely to share such information with each other?

OP: if they were making comments about your daughter's appearance which are personal to the point of causing you offence then you need to address it with them, in exactly the same way as if you had heard someone speak about your daughter this way in the street.
(Some ) Teachers will say terrible things about the children behind closed doors, so I wouldn't report it formally, but a discussion about a) the appropriateness/professionalism of what was said, b) the potential impact on the child and their family if they had been overheard, and c) that they were overheard and you are the mother in question, will probably give them a learning opportunity. Try to stay calm through a) and b), to give c) more impact when you lose your cool.
Good luck

Some people really are tying themselves in knots to make this the OP’s fault. Teachers are not beyond approach. Most are fantastic, unfortunately a small minority shouldn’t be teaching.

As for teachers discussing pupils, massively depends on the context. “I gave Emily yet another detention for a rolled up skirt, does she never learn?” is different from “Emily always rolls up her skirt and looks like a tart”. (Hate that word, just using an exaggerated example)

I cannot believe all the comments here supporting the teachers and/or saying don’t raise it. Or blaming it on the child’s appearance and calling her a brat!?? So nasty. It is never ok to comment negatively on someone’s personal appearance, let alone a student’s.

OP, the teacher was horrendously unprofessional. Please report her.

Utter crap. Without outing myself, I worked for a company that had over 400 people working in one building, and we all knew each and every one. We also knew the new ones - as in, we knew that they were new!

People just don't talk to each other enough.

It's a very large school and I only started working there a couple of months ago.

It doesn't sound good but it really depends what was said as to how far you take it.

Pupils discuss teachers and I doubt that much of what is said will be flattering. Teachers will discuss pupils and no doubt that some of what is said will also be unflattering. Everybody talks/gossips about everybody else, it is naïve to think otherwise

exactly, that's the way the world works and is reality yet by mn logic it is always shocking.

Pupils discuss teachers and I doubt that much of what is said will be flattering they are children and aren't paid to be there

Speak directly to the teacher but also is your daughter wearing her uniform incorrectly? Shouldn't you address this?

they are children and aren't paid to be there

nobody is discusiing the morals of it, they are simply pointing out how reality is.

As many of my HTs have said you shouldn’t be saying anything about children that you wouldn’t want to hear about your own. In my opinion making derogatory comments about a child, regardless of the circumstances, takes away from the behaviour or incident, making the focus on the wrong thing. We aren’t at school anymore, which many staff forget, we are now the adults helping to shape children for the future. No wonder children end up so bitchy if staff can’t withhold it themselves at their work.

Some of the comments on here are shocking?!

I would also be so upset OP you need to say something to the teacher in question at the very least.

The poster suggesting your daughter should work on her appearance is disgusting

If they carried on about her appearance after identifying her then yes it’s inappropriate. It all turns on facts and tone.
So teacher A I need to report serious safeguarding incident. Brian and a girl are witnesses. Teacher B who is the girl? I can’t remember her name. She’s got bad BO and a monobrow - oh you mean Honey-Sue. End of conversation. Not nice to hear but not reportable. Two teachers being repeatedly rude for no reason - reportable.

She didn't mention my daughters name being unusual I added that so that I knew it was obviously my daughter she was talking about and not another girl with that name.

The comments she made about her were about her eyebrows - which she repeatedly compared to slugs- my daughter doesn't dye or have particularly thick eyebrows. They are just her regular eyebrows. She also made comments about her big face that looks like a slapped arse. She also called her a 'big girl' - she's 5ft nothing and a size 8/10 but does have very large boobs.

Is that clearer as to why they were so personal?

Rubbish.
i work somewhere with approx 150 and I wouldn’t have a clue if they had children, their names etc.
You’re obviously not busy enough if you’ve got time to chat to over 400 people about their personal lives!

Is this really how it is in schools? I am genuinely shocked. If this was a work place you'd be called into a meeting for this sort of behaviour.

Used to work at a high school as well. Some teachers / HOH's comments were really quite disturbing. What a bunch of "slappers" some of the Y8s were because they wore fake tan or their skirt was on the short side etc. Or what a vile, little cretin another student was. And on and on it went. It always made me feel deeply uncomfortable listening to their rants.

I figured it would depend on the severity of the situation, but if that’s the case then I still believe reporting first is the correct route to go down.

OP has a duty of care to her own daughter as well as all the other children in the school, and I’m sure she is aware of the boundary between not inappropriate but not perhaps “kind” behaviour and inappropriate.

But they weren't being bitchy for fun, they were trying to describe her out of hundreds and hundreds of girls on the school.They can just sat the one with the brown hard and brown eyes, can they?

Exactly this.
if people feel it is ok and acceptable in a culture to make personal comments at work about anyone it is a clear indication that the organisation is rank with unconscious bias.
if people accept other colleagues making comments about pupils on the way they dress, their appearance or even personal habits it is a clear indication that employees are discriminatory in the way they approach and relate to people. What is the boundary then to stop them making comments and judgements on kids with SEN, different race, or making comments on girls appearance (like slag comment in PP) vs white male pupils.

we all have unconscious biases, we all have to work on dealing with those and being self aware to overcome them. If people are not picked up by their colleagues when it it expressed out loud they think it is ok. And then it just gets worse and spreads as a culture.

it is a management issue. Any organisation should have policies to deal with this. The individuals involved need feedback to explain why it is highly inappropriate and how it normalises these unconscious biases into outright discrimination.

It sounds like the had a legitimate reason for wanting to identify her/know her name.

Obviously no idea what she looks like but there could be hundreds of girls who are about 5ft 3 with say brown hair. So I can imagine the teacher may have needed to give a more detailed description. To know if it needs reporting I'd have to know what they said and if it was matter of fact or said as a piss take.

Eg things like "she always has her hair in a ponytail, tends to look quite greasy", or "she has really bad acne" or "she's the one who wears that odd yellow jacket with all the patches badly sewn on it" ....might not be nice to hear but could be the most helpful description for the other colleague to identify her.

Did they stop the description once they had her name?

Well if they said something like, the chubby girl with the red frizzy hair and crossed eyes its not very nice to hear, but it is descriptive, as long as they being factual and weren't sniggering about her appearance I don't think it is something you can really report.

I don’t understand why you wouldn’t have just stuck up for your daughter in the moment. If I heard someone talking about a loved one I would defend that person immediately.

Those comments would bring some grown adults to tears, especially if they were struggling with their body image. Completely inappropriate to say about a child and completely unnecessary. I’m so sorry you had to listen to that.

What a spiteful bitch she is.