Talk me down - is this country really so bad?

[BluePassportsAreBollocks]

I’m a long time MN user, NC for this.

Anyway, I’m really down about what our country has become. I’m Scottish but live in England, so much of what I’m saying relates to England but Scotland is just as bad if not worse whenever I go back (before anyone comes along and tells me that it’s all rainbows and unicorns elsewhere!).

The quality of our public services is pitiful. You can’t get a doctors appt, mental health support non existent, hospital backlogs, social care on its knees, schools underperforming, staff in every public sector unhappy and considering going on strike, huge wealth inequalities, huge health inequalities, outrageous profiteering by private companies exploiting the rise in inflation for their own gain (energy, fuel, food, travel), companies cutting their customer service to a shoestring level where it takes 45 mins for someone to pick the phone up only to tell you to use the online contact form, customer service in general appalling and delivered by people who just don’t care, continued and endless political divisions forced upon us and tearing people apart (divide and rule… brexit, boris, scexit, covid), no reply for days and weeks for administrative services like passports, overcrowded public transport, completely unattainable house prices, exorbitant cost of childcare, everything about parenting is a completion, I could go on and on.

I am genuinely thinking of looking for work abroad. But before I do, can someone please tell me…

1. Are things really as bad as they feel here compared to other peer countries (if so which)? Is it that we are living in a bubble and I’m not grateful enough for the things that work? Yes I appreciate the rights and human rights we have, but even they are being trashed as we speak.

2. If I could move anywhere in the world where stuff just worked, where would I’d be and why??

If you feel that way why not get involved in changing things here? Choose one problem and lobby on it. Talk to your mp or local councillor or find a political or activist group that's working towards positive change. For NHS stuff the NHA party springs to mind. Go on demos etc but while you do remember we have it a lot better than many places, even in peer countries.

Yes, it is, and it's only getting worse, especially if you weren't born here. I'd choose Northern Europe - although right now they're obviously under threat because of Putin's war.

I'm born and raised in the UK, mid forties and have briefly lived in Netherlands and for 2 years in ROI. How I wish I'd stayed in either of those countries! I'm nearing mid forties and wondering if it's too late to uproot and move....

I'll start with the good, based only on my anecdotal experience. I love the NHS. I don't live in a particularly affluent LA, but I've had excellent care for a nasty chest infection recently including a fast x ray to ensure nothing more sinister. My Dad amd father in law were both treated quickly and effectively for prostate cancer recently. My dh had received excellent care for pancreatitis, including a walk in centre quickly diagnosing an obstructed bowel, from which he could have died. I believe from other people's experiences that the NHS is on its knees and I know it won't get the support it needs from the current government.

Which brings me onto the rest. I am ashamed of what the UK has become, politically, economically, socially and I find it hard to find anything to be proud of about it. Racists and the far right are flourishing, we have a liar, a cheat and a charlatan as PM and an electorate who will probably keep voting them back in because they have collective amnesia and Stockholm Syndrome. The worldwide pandemic has been further exacerbated in the UK by Brexit (except our media refuse to say it) and a corrupt government.

The only positive I can see is that we've not yet gone down the America route and women still have bodily autonomy.

I wish we still had freedom of movement but the bastards have even taken that away from us, so instead we're marooned on this shitfest of an island with the very people that put us here.

I have just come back from Barcelona and it’s completely gone to the dogs. Rome in April was overgrown, litter everywhere and falling apart.
i was shocked at the state of Stockholm in December - this is not a purely U.K. problem

I think it depends on where you live. I've definitely noticed a deterioration in services but my life in a green village in the north of England is good. People are friendly, it's relatively easy to get a GP's appointment and there was a real community spirit over the Jubilee.

There is so much in the world that I cannot control and so while I can do my bit (protests or whatever), I won't lose sleep over the big stuff I can't change. So I just try to make my corner of the world a bit better wherever I can. I smile at people, try to be a good neighbour, look out for people who are sick or grieving, try to notice people that get un-noticed. Basically, 'be the change you want to see'.

I haven’t rtft but it’s individual

What you are after won’t be the same for others

I have two passports and choose here because I love living in London for many reasons, I’d always choose a big city as it is compatible with who I do and enjoy etc

On services we don’t use them much but always had good experiences with healthcare, private and NHS

ditto schools

I am interested by the passport renewal angst. I got my passport renewed in 3 days in my home country last year but believe me, none of you would ever want to live there. I don't much want to myself. Great service often depends on cheap, exploited labour.

I agree with this too. Also moving to a new country takes optimistic outlook and gumption - if you look for jobs when you get there. So you’d have to change and be positive

@InChocolateWeTrust Where do you live? We need to perhaps consider moving there!

I too appreciate many things about this country: history, beautiful buildings and parks and countryside, humour, surprising levels of friendliness even (especially??) in big cities.

I am however very much worried about the future of public services and pensions - not just caused by funding issues but by our demographic timebomb.

If anyone can shed some light on where they think the money is going to come from
in future years to fund pensions and healthcare and social care for Generation X and below, please let me know.

Agree with comments up thread re New Zealand. Very expensive. Very far from anywhere. But safe and peaceful and clean. We have options to move there but there isn’t enough of a cultural pull for me. Great if you’re an outdoor sports fan but not enough for our family.

Standard of living in Australia is higher than even NZ. State pensions are amazingly generous. Housing - except for astronomical Sydney - is better value and food is reasonable. Great healthcare, properly funded by an insurance system by those who can afford to pay. Drawbacks: historical racism that is hard to eradicate, distance from rest of world and the wild climate.

Friends who have lived in Switzerland have found it really expensive. Ended up in flats (with shared washing facilities) and these people work in banking. Schools finish at lunchtime making it hard to work if you have young children. Au pairs can only be hired by Swiss. Beautiful, yes, but lots of rules including when you can run a wash cycle.

Every country has its problems and are going through difficult times. Oddly, people who move to a different country will sing the praises of that country over their country of origin. I think it's because they refuse to admit their decision making could have been flawed. This includes people who have immigrated here. There are always good and bad sides of every country. So much focus on negativity in the UK.

If anyone can shed some light on where they think the money is going to come from
in future years to fund pensions and healthcare and social care for Generation X and below, please let me know

It actually gives me anxiety & it's so frustrating that any ill is blamed on migrants, we need a shit load!

"There are now more over-65s (11.1 million) than under-15s (10.4 million), a dramatic reversal on 10 years ago."

How can the NHS exist in its current form? I guess I need to stop navel gazing!

Take a look at the immigration figures. A lot of people still want to come and live here. Ask yourself why.

Because they don't know yet about the state of it here...

I have lived in France and Switzerland as well as Portugal. If I had my pick, Switzerland hands down. It's expensive but wages are high. Best place in the world.

Count your blessings before you move.
If you still feel you hate England then move to where you are confident you will have perfect health and public services,immediate response to your phone queries and happy smiling assistants everywhere.
or count your blessings.🌈

I think the countries that are mentioned here for being awesome are also very conservative and homogenous. I love, love, love Switzerland but it is in no way supportive of working mothers, is deeply racist and has been able to support its high living standards by extremely tight immigration policies. If your face doesn’t fit, you’re not going to have a great time.

It's not perfect anywhere.

That said, the state of health, social care, and education in the UK is dire. We are expected to be grateful for a "free" NHS (paid through taxes), but we are constantly let down by a healthcare system that simply isn't built for purpose. Our disabled and elderly are having essential services cut left right and centre and are being left to live without the 24 hour care they require. Our children are being educated in a stressful system based on exams and memorization, as opposed to trusting teachers to deliver the bloated curriculum how individual students learn best.

I am Canadian. My husband and son are British. We have ties to the UK. That said, I can't imagine we will be here much longer with the Tories in power. Canada is better.

Being a brown person in several northern European countries is difficult.

50 year mortgages being considered, is that progress? Nope, take me back to the 80s, rent or buy a place for not much, bus and train journeys were affordable, for most. There was council housing, you could work your way out of poverty, not anymore, an entire full time teachers assistant wage (my daughters) only covers rent on a damp ex council flat and council tax. The race to the bottom and spiralling social inequality continues at a pace.

I’ve thought about this a lot because I have a job where I can work anywhere in the world.
The UK has its problems for sure but I think we are very lucky to live where we do.

There’s relatively low risk of natural disasters. We have a lot of rights. We have a benefits system which I know isn’t amazing but you are unlikely to end up on the street if you develop an illness preventing you from working. We get a lot of annual leave/time off work compared to other countries. Women are treated better here than in a lot of other countries. Contraception is free. Vaccines are free. Healthcare is free. You don’t have to pay to give birth. Maternity leave. We have some of the cleanest tap water in the world. Supermarkets are always well stocked with produce from all over the world (probably not a good thing though). Our food is a lot cheaper than many other countries. Most people are decent and friendly. There are a lot of beautiful landscapes here.

Not British myself and so agree with all of this.

Life has been pretty difficult for everyone over the last couple of years, and consequently everything have suffered. However @likeli has summed up many good points about the UK. It’s so easy to take these for granted, and the situation in America makes me appreciate these things even more.

Yes, not everything is hunkydory, and everyone has different experiences of life, but generally we know we’re pretty safe in the UK.

I think YABU because I think it's easy to lose sight of the bigger picture when we live in such a stable country. I have an EU passport but would never dream of leaving England. I try to think of it like this. Are my DC safe and happy. Are we financially stable and able to provide a reasonable standard of living ( food on the table ). Are we able to access healthcare when it really matters ie cancer care or a car accident. Do i have to wait to get seen by a GP about an ear infection ? Yes. Does it suck that i have to wait ? Yes but is it likely to kill me to wait ? No. We have a great life here in England and I was not born here so perhaps I appreciate it more because I can compare it to something far worse. It is too easy to see the problems when you have not experienced anything worse.