To say no to 12 year old going to friends house without parents details?

[ddeey]

Key facts:
12 year old DD has been invited to a friends house straight from school and would like to be collected at 8pm.
DD does not hang around with these kids at school but they have a shared interest. The idea is that a group of them will be going to the house tomorrow for this shared activity.
I have the address, but asked DD to get a phone no for the hosting parent as wanted to message them. DD says she has asked but has not been given one. Two of the kids have been reminding her today that she should be there tomorrow night.
For context, DD has been bullied previously and can struggle socially at times. Importantly (i feel) we live 45 mins away from where she will be as she goes to school a fair way away. So we don't know the area or local families.
AIBU to think that at age 12 its still ok to say i want to speak to the hosting parent in this scenario or are we being over protective?

I would also insist on speaking to the parent, even if it was just to confirm thay were aware their DC had invited everyone to their house.

Not over protective. With all you've described it sounds so suspicious. If it was my daughter, going with close friends and therefore assuming all parents pretty much knew each other and all had each others contact numbers then ok, different story altogether. But what you've described sounds too much like a horrible set up considering she has been bullied before. I'd say no. And I'd say your instinct is always right.

YANBU I had my 14 year old sons school friends mum ask for my number. I was glad as I wanted hers too but didn't want to seem overprotective.

I do think you’re being a bit overprotective and I doubt DD has actually asked for the number in that case. Would you compromise by using find my phone and insisting she text you throughout and absolutely let’s you know if they change location. Then just reassure her if she texts you, you can pick her up early with some excuse.
I think at 12-14 it’s all about giving them that independence but putting in safeguards so they can be reassured.

Once in secondary school you really don't tend to check with parents. You make sure your dc has a charged phone and knows to contact you if there are any problems.

I agree, that's what I would do.

I strongly doubt it is the case that the parents are refusing to give a phone number. My guess is that either a) OP's daughter hasn't actually asked, because she doesn't want to be laughed at for having over-protective parents or b) OP's daughter has asked her friends but the friends have forgotten to pass that on to the parents.

If she has a phone of her own I'd say it's perfectly OK.

What exactly were you going to say in your message to the hosting parents, OP? "Hi. My DD is meant to be coming to your house with some of X's other friends. Can you please confirm that you and your home are a suitable environment for her and that your child isn't a nasty bully?"

Once at secondary school, I rarely meet or talk to any of my kids friends parents. They have phones so can get in touch that way.

Same here, I've never 'checked out' any parents

To those that do not know where their dc are or who they are with, are you not concerned? And if not, why not? Surely they are too young to be roaming around by themselves at just 12?

They have phones, but even if they didn't, its good to encourage independence

No I'm not concerned. Obviously thers is that tiny little niggle in the back of my mind but I get that about DS1 who is 15 and even DH when they are not with me. 12 is perfectly old enough to walk about in daylight hours without your parents knowing your precise location. Its a lot safer now they have phones and mine have all been taught the same old safety things we were told as kids (dont talk to strangers, if you are worried go into a shop and tell an adult etc etc)

So how do you know they are not drinking cider and smoking in the park? Having sex with someone that is grooming them? Trying out drugs or being assessed to become the latest mule for the local dealer?

I guess you don’t, put simply.

Its either extreme naivety or you are hiding behind the independence slogan which is really shorthand for lazy parenting. Parents should know where their 12year old children are unless they live in splendid isolation with sheep, because it is children like yours that become fair game to the predators around them.
I say that as someone that works directly with the outcome. You need to know who your children are meeting are all times, and where they are. I always wondered who those parents were that were so very casual about safety, and how they justified their poor decisions. By the time it comes to us it’s too late.

I'd be worried. If she's been bullied in the past, how do you know they won't take her phone and leave her no way to contact you?

You won't be saying that of something goes wrong.
Do what's right for you OP. All you will get here is different answers. Trust your own instinct.

Exactly this. The girl from Liverpool aged 12 was stabbed in town. Its a horrible world out there. Best to be safe than sorry. She is a child.

We don't know if her parents knew she was in town or not? Even if they knew which friends she was with and where she was the outcome would have been the same. Just knowing where your child is doesnt stop them being in danger.

Exactly how will a phone call to the parents prevent any of that?

I know where my child is because they tell me. Their phone is fully charged and they have earned my trust gradually by sticking to rules as they grow. I monitor their phone periodically and all well, they have made good choices so far in their friends so as they make new ones i will trust their judgement and try to meet her friends at some point. I can track location on phond if i need to. Things could change dd could rebel hopefully i will see changes early enough to intervene. Phoning parents is a snapshot in time and doesn't help much at all.

Totally agree with this. It’s over protective until something goes wrong!

The issue isn’t whether you trust your child or not, it’s not even about your child - it’s about the people around them sally and the child’s capacity, or lack of to deal with a challenging situation, finding themselves alone after an argument or getting involved in the adult world and being exposed to danger. At 12 they have no real idea of the consequences and risk, how quickly situations can escalate and what is going on behind the scenes.

Its not about you trusting your child, you are looking at this from the wrong angle. No 12 year old is going to be a match for a 20 year old man, no child is going to fully understand the mechanics of drug dealing, stabbings, gangs, under age drinking and sex. The child may be entirely trustworthy and STILL find themselves in deep water. They are too young and lack the maturity - and it’s entirely your responsibility and no one else’s to keep them safe from harm first and foremost.

I don’t think Yabu. At that age and upwards my parents tended to trust me and what i was up to.

there was one time I went to a girl from schools house and called to ask if I could stay over. My mum said fine, but my dad asked for the persons surname.

turned out it was a local gangsters daughter I would be staying at . There had been attacks to their and their families homes over the last few months.

so, I would always be a bit worried about who my child was staying with

But how will a phone call with parents make any difference? Ideally you would no the parents but once they go to high school that isn't practical/possible anymore.

Teaching my child it is always ok to leave, that i will come at any time and to choose good friends is more important and definitely not lazy parenting because i don't see the need for a phone call.

I don’t know why you keep banging on about a phone call?! I certainly haven’t said a phone call will make a difference.
Knowing who your child is with, where they are will make a difference. Monitoring their on line use and being aware of the dangers in your local area will make a difference. Your child cam make ‘make good friends’ and have excellent judgement and skills and still be raped, assaulted, spiked and hurt. Stop being so bloody naive and wake up, it’s not the 1950s anymore.

But OP does know where her child will be (she has the address) and who she will be with.

Of course DD may be somewhere else entirely, or be bullied mercilessly by the "friends", or sexually assaulted by a family member of the child whose house she is visiting.

OP is asking is she unreasonable to ask for the parents' phone number. Having the parents' phone number will not prevent any of the above happening. Not ever letting her child out of her sight and not allowing her unsupervised access to the internet is the only thing that will, but at some point, and 12 seems a reasonable enough age, you need to give your child some independence. If you don't, they will be even less equipped to deal with anything that arises.

red I disagree. If op calls the mother to check out the logistics she will know the following;

1. the invitation is legitimate and is less likely to be a set up by girls with ill intent

2. At least one adult is present and supervising minimising the chances of ops dd being bullied or hurt, and she has someone to immediately turn to if things go wrong.

3. Times can be confirmed given the distances

4. Op knows exactly where her dd is that evening.

The child is 12 not 15, of course her parents should still be looking out for her, checking she is safe. She is still very young even without the bullying back story.