To hate it when people say “my husband/partner/boyfriend doesn’t do the night feeds because he works”

[ForestFae]

Every time I see or hear this phrase, I rage. Usually said by some poor sleep deprived new mum who’s looking after the baby/ies all day long. Why is looking after a baby not considered valuable work? Why are men getting away with using this rubbish excuse?

That’s fair enough, but surely people understand that it can be equally dangerous to be knackered with a baby? With DS1, I almost fainted at the top of the stairs, while holding him at 8 weeks old, due to sleep deprivation - I can’t sleep if there’s any noise in my room, and hearing him rustling about all night meant I couldn’t sleep even though I had help with the nights. Surely you can see how that’s dangerous?

@ForestFae

If you screw up at an office job you could wipe millions off the valuation of a company. Or you could publish a story which was defamatory and destroyed the reputation of an innocent person.

These are not (usually) life or death but it’s just not true that all office jobs are pointless wastes of time. There’s a vast amount of difference between being an admin in the NHS, the editor of a national newspaper and the CEO of an investment bank. Yet these are all “office jobs”.

I know some people think going out to work is a selfie indulgence compared with looking after children but at least acknowledge that not all “office jobs” are the same.

Sorry selfish indulgence. Not selfie indulgence!

I get what you mean, office jobs cover a wide variety of careers with different consequences if something goes wrong. I just think that caring for a baby can be dangerous if sleep deprived - also people don’t seem to be acknowledging that a) not everyone can sleep when the baby sleeps and b) not everyone only has one baby. If you have multiple dc at home -twins, triplets, older toddlers - then you can’t really rest at all.

How do you think many, if not most, people get to the office? Not to mention the countless people who drive as part of their job. If a SAHP is so tired they are at risk of falling asleep at the wheel, they would be extremely negligent to get in the car in the first place.
You give just two examples of risk for a tired SAHP, and both can be mitigated, whereas there are countless examples of risk out and about in the world for the working parent, which extend far beyond the immediate family.
Sleep deprivation is unpleasant and tough to cope with. Most parents have been there and know this. There is no need to falsely over inflate the difficulty for SAHPs compared to working parents to make that undisputed point.

This threads like a bad game of top trumps, it really doesn't matter what each family decides to do as it doesn't affect anybody else. Happy Saturday all.

Why do you assume a SAHP has any choice? Doctors appointments have to be attended, groceries have to be bought, for example. I’m aware most working parents drive, which is why I’m suggesting it should be split so no one parent is so tired that they can’t function.

im not overinflating anything. Working is hard in a different way to being a SAHP but it’s not anywhere near as intense.

Working is hard in a different way to being a SAHP but it’s not anywhere near as intense.

That really depends on the job. My trauma surgeon friends would certainly disagree with you.

I think it's strange when people assume their parenting experiences are the same as others.

Would we assume all interactions and relationships are the same?

I did the night feed(s) between midnight and 6am and DH went out to work. One minute outside of those times he got up. I also did contract work at home so was not off work.

It was easy. Usually just one feed for me during the night. DH gave her bottle in the morning, washed up and got the rear sorted then handed her into me in bed, we had another feed then went to sleep. We would go out for the day then. I'd get a few hours work done in the afternoon while she napped or if we had stayed out in the evening when DH was home. It was so easy and I loved it. He was out of the house between 7.30am and 7pm. He took over then. We often went out in the evenings for dinner or to friends with her in the buggy.

At the regular coffee gatherings post new mum yoga and workout classes I'd look around and see the rest of the women looking deranged and thoroughly miserable. I kept my mouth firmly closed about how much I was enjoying it all.

Why? Because I just happened by some massive stroke of luck to have a baby who slept and was alway easy to settle.

So I was well rested and relaxed.

If she'd had colic or been an uneasy sleeper it would have been an entirely different story with me sobbing in the bed. I know he would have done the night feeds then. In fact he did them on the weekends. Now, he always takes me breakfast in bed at least one weekend morning.

So yes I completely agree OP. It's a shared responsibility. No mother should be sleep deprived to the point her mental health is suffering while her partner's whistles off to his big job in the city.

I've checked back on your posts so apologies if I've missed this information, ForestFae, but how many children do you have and how old are they?

3dc between 7 and almost 4

Thanks for your answer.

think it's strange when people assume their parenting experiences are the same as others

this.

it’s reasonable in the working week s-t mum gets up if dad is working. Then dad does fri/sat night so mum can get a solid couple of nights.

that plus taking turns to do late/early feeds so one can get to bed/sleep in/have a nap seems a fair share.

i can’t work sleep deprived. I make mistakes.

My DH is a Plane Operator driving a machine bigger then JCB. I was at home, of course I got up in night.
He did the witching hour when he came in from work.
I never got to eat his tea in peace.

"I don’t get this - if you screw up at an office job, no one dies or gets injured. if you’re so tired you drop your baby, or fall asleep at the wheel, that’s objectively way worse."

But if you're on maternity leave you can choose not to drive. And if you're that tired you go to bed with the baby (co-sleeping safely if baby won't go in the cot) so it's a non-issue. If you're working you don't have a choice.

Yabu. Whichever parent is going to paid employment needs to be able to sleep. During maternity leave I always looked after the babies at night. Even after a bad night, it's possible to rest/watch TV or just do the minimum the following day.

When going to work being sleep deprived and making crap decisions could get you fired.

Sorry, ForestFae, one more question (which I should have asked earlier): are they girls, boys or a mixture?
I'm sorry if it feels like I'm being obtrusive; to share back, I've got two daughters who are adults.

Do you think SAHP never have to go anywhere or that we can just choose to sleep whenever we want to? That’s not how it works.

2DS 1DD. Mine were also all NICU babies, I tend to have premature births with complications, so my newborn period was probably a bit more stressful than someone who has a full term well baby, which probably influences this a bit.

I was with you @ForestFae until you said 'if you screw up at an office job, no one dies or gets injured' and this has made me really angry, you have no clue

What other job types would qualify? Ones where you need to use your brain a lot? Ones where peoples health and/or safety is in your hands?

I don't assume the SAHP has a choice, it a matter of fact, not assumption, as there is huge flexibility in the role. With a bit of planning groceries can be bought anytime. Doctors appointments? Realistically that's hardly a daily occurance for most.
While you may consider being a SAHP more intense than paid work, I did not, so why is your experience the more valid of the two? You may have had extraordinarily demanding babies or a very easy job, but you can't project that on to everyone.
I was the working parent with a male SAH partner, and I did some of the nights, if for example he had something important to do the next day. But no way would we have considered an equal split fair or feasible. We both understood the relative demands and pace of each others day, and the importance to the financial security of our family that I was able to do my job.
He also felt he had a very good deal. And if he hadn't would have had the option to return to work so we could afford to buy in some help.

so my newborn period was probably a bit more stressful than someone who has a full term well baby, which probably influences this a bit.

Quite a lot, I'd have thought. No doubt that's why you are minimising the importance of the jobs people do (of which many enable society to run safely and smoothly, includung for mothers if small babies, even if they're not life-or-death jobs) and exaggerating the knife-edge, life-or-death nature of looking after a baby which, though it's an important role, has been done every day throughout the world by unskilled people since the dawn of human existence.

Didn’t you know? Nothing anyone does in an office is ever worthwhile. And it definitely never affects anyone else.

If you are staying at home the next day it is absolutely your re to get up in the right. It's completely unreasonable to ask someone to be up at 2am and then up at 6am for work if you are not working the next day.