To think many schools forget that lots of mums work?

[malificent7]

In primary school it was almost a given that they scheduled things in the school day which is understandable but a bit sad that when i was teaching myself, i couldn't get time off for sports day etc.

In secondary school I was chatying to a mum friend who was asked to go to a meeting during school time. She can't...she works! Not a huge issue i guess and not sure how it can be solved. As an ex teacher I wouldn't have wanted to meet parents outside school hours.

Teachers don't occasionally catch up on things outside their hours. I do at least an extra four hours a day plus evenings and weekends.

This thread is a race to the bottom isnt it. I do what I can to spend time with my children.

It is sometimes frustrating that so many school events involving parents go on within the working day - but from my perspective..

• it's natural due to school hours
• I appreciate the chance to be involved and I enjoy it, as does dh
• lots of dads attend, abouta third
• it makes the kids happy

-they give options and notice

• covid made so much impossible and I'm v grateful school is fully normal again
• it builds school community when parents, children and staff all see each other
• it's one reason why I am still working pt with dc 8 and 10. I had been warned about the demands of primary school!

I sometimes wonder when it became expected that parents attended everything. When I was in primary school (1980s) loads of mums were SAHMs, but they might have come to school events about twice a year - nativity and sports day (plus obviously parent teacher meetings etc which us kids probably didn't know about).

They were never expected to come to special assemblies, art exhibitions (they had a quick look when they picked you up, at most) or even medal hand-outs (I remember our netball team getting medals for a tournament; they were just given out in normal assembly and you told your mum when you got home).

And it was fine. Why is it expected that parents now have to go to everything? Why can't they just be sent a photo on SeeSaw?

School have a target of engaging parents. They do that via different methods - as you can see some have breakfasts, others sports days, some have parent meetings about internet use or phonics - all part of the Ofstead tick box scheme.

Oh absolutely! All these parents who want to shout out that they are upset because they too want to spend time with their children and experience these school events but also need to be able to put a roof over kids heads and food in their bellies meaning hard choices to be made.

From this thread I dont think anyone is stating all events need to be outside of school hours, as that would be absurd but more an understanding that employment isnt set up in a way that parents can just swan off to events at a moments notice.

We dont even get enough annual leave to cover the school holidays let alone to cover extra events. Perhaps try giving parents a couple of months notice, hell, even a months notice, and maybe we could shuffle around work responsibilities. But telling us on a monday that sports day is on a friday or guilt tripping the parents who cant help at the summer fayre stalls isnt the way to get parents involved and on side.

Parents just want some organisation, that's all. Help us! We want to support our kids and support our schools, but we need some level of understanding.

This. All the this.

Give me proper notice and I might be able to switch things around at work. But less than a week’s notice, not a chance.

And I can’t use A/L all the time, I’m storing it up to cover the endless school holidays.

In the last two years there has been this thing called 'covid'.

Our school does give loads of notice on most things, but in the last two years have had to arrange things last minute out of necessity. They have been very apologetic about it.

I think thats changed things a lot and it also changed financial dynamics and how much holiday availability there is and how willing employers are to accommodate the school play on top of the time off to look after kids with covid.

In terms of it being a race to the bottom, theres an issue that greater parental involvement is known to improve child well-being and educational level. So encouraging it in deprived areas, where employment levels are lower is a good thing. In the most affluent areas, you tend to get the opposite with both parents in professional type jobs and little time and parents are much more 'i need to see my child do this play' or whatever it happens to be, rather than be indifferent - with the benefits of parental engagement with school being less significant.

If it were a race to the bottom we'd be saying no to the parental engagement because the affluent parents are working and can't go and they dont need the attention anyway, cos they are doing ok.... Alright jack.

Having dealt with the rare breed known as the entitled prick of a parent who hasn't go a fucking clue beyond their own bubble in life, i really don't think complaining about requests for parental support are hitting the broad spectrum of economic demographics.

@RedToothBrush I disagree fundamentally with your view. Often it is the working parents who are in less flexible jobs, on lower paid salaries, or on variable contracts who are completely screwed by how schools are organised and what support is available. Our primary is in a perceived OK area and gets so little extra support from the LA compared to the primary half a mile away which is classed as in a deprived area. This means the school relies on the parents much more - to volunteer to support the summer fair, to do the traybake, help with outings, pay for extras at short notice etc etc. It's not recognised that parents might be in work but struggling anywhere ...

Our school does give loads of notice on most things, but in the last two years have had to arrange things last minute out of necessity. They have been very apologetic about it.

Hollow laugh over here. Our school have not once apologised for any such thing or even acknowledged that it might make life difficult for families.

What the heck has covid got to do with this? Covid is done, schools got back to their usual routine months ago! Plus, this was the same issue before covid!

Parents need notice and a decent amount, not a few days. It's nothing to do with demographic.

I was sahm and attended every event possible, now I'm not and due to meetings being booked often 6 weeks in advance I need notice now. It's simply the difference between working and none working parents and their requirements and wanting the school to take that into account in their planning.

Totally . Dads too. Sports day today. Given date last wed and time on Friday.

This! You don't complain that the Dr or dentist or hospital forget that you work! Or any other thing that happens when you work.
It's not that they forget, its that it doesn't matter. IF you work, you need to take time off for things you need to do that clash with that. OR you don't do them.

It's really not that difficult

My doctor opens at 7am 3 mornings a week, and stays open til 8pm 2 nights a week, and every other Saturday. Because they know their "customers" work. My dentist opens til 7pm 3 nights a week too. Businesses adapt to keep and increase business.

Schools don't because you go or not, whatever.
I attended 2 parents "evenings" at primary, 3.30pm is not an evening!

4 year olds are not going to run their sports day races at 7 o clock at night though are they? Schools are about the children. You have to fit in around them.

The time isn’t so much the issue, it’s school, I accept most things will be during or shortly after school hours. It’s the lack of notice - with sufficient notice parents can make arrangements for things that are important to them.
as an example, our monthly school newsletter for June came out last week, with a date next week for sports day, but there’s been no other communication about if parents can attend or if the children need to bring/wear/do anything.

@Momicrone because they had been at nursery full time previously, I had a job previously. I had to commute to that job. Had I carried on commuting to work when children only at school three hours it meant I would have to drive there. Work for an hour and drive home. My son couldn't go back to nursery as too old.
You're showing your privilege there

@theyetijumpedoverthemoon too old for nursery - in school but part time. Weird middle ground

I have no issue with things being in school time it's the lack of reasonable notice that is possibly the issue for working parents