Part 6 keeping it civil - the Depp Heard jury is out

[ENoeuf]

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4556643-part-5-aibu-to-want-15-minutes-fame-depp-v-heard

hoping we can continue to discuss without unpleasantness - so far so good.

I saw on some mediums that a verdict could be expected today.

I heard that recording. It's all speculation though. He doesn't know how his finger got cut off. There was substantial evidence that Amber didn't cut it off.

Mummy

Which evidence?

In that recording why is she apologising? Admitted to take a cocktail of drugs and Jerry is trying to get her out of Australia asap. He was trying to protect them both.

neumeister could not verify the photographs because he did not have the originals or devices, Ackert has claimed to have seen the originals but has not provided this proof. If you have proof you show it. Ackert embarrassed himself and his industry. Heards team also provided the photographs to disprove Depps photograph of bruising but why on earth would I believe anything regarding photographs out of Heards team. It has been an embarrassment of discovery and I actually think an embarrassment of the legal process when lawyers and experts are presenting photoshopped images with no accountability.

Amber is Jussie Smollet 2.0

People were angry at those that questioned and doubted him originally - you were racist and a homophobe to not support him. Many still support him because he is black and gay and they truly believe everything he said was true, despite the evidence to the contrary.

How we have a lot of aanger at anyone who doubts or questions Amber. You are anti-women and anti-feminist to not support her. Many still support her because she is a woman and they truly beleive everything she has to say, despite evidence to the contrary.

The two men Jussie accused had every right to defend themselves and so does Johnny. Had she filed a police report and made these allegations of years of fearing for her life while being brutally assaulted day in and day out, he would have had a chance to give his perspective during both the investigation and if charges were filed - then a trial. She chose to go the public statements route instead - that doesn't mean he has to just sit down, shut up and take it. He has a right to defend himself publicly as well.

I agree mid

Many AH supporters especially on the likes of Twitter are so closed off to any contrary evidence or opinion they are downright abusive themselves, especially if you mention being a survivor yourself. You are a liar, gaslighter etc. speaks volumes to me.

Also I think eve Barlow has given Amber her password

It makes me sad for the people who have sons who are teaching their sons that they are not worthy of respect. If a woman hits them, throws pots and pans at them, punches them in the jaw, demeans and mocks and taunts them - they are to sit down, shut up, and take it. If a woman accuses them of rape or assault, they are not in any way to defend themselves or speak up for themselves, even if they didn't do it. If the accuser is a woman, then she is right and they should take whatever punishment and consequence comes their way. They are never to question, criticize or disbelieve a woman.

I didn't realize until these threads how prevalent this thinking was and how many people don't think that men / boys deserve any respect or to be treated with respect at all. I didn't realize that people truly believe that males can't be victims and that they therefore should defend any action taken against them. It makes me sad for these young men Not a suprise male suicide rates are higher when they are being raised in families that tell them that as males they do not deserve respect.

JD's text after the Australia incident says it all for me, he sounds broken, not at all like a controlling abuser imo.

I'll tell you what put me off AH. And this isn't a reflection on the legal proceedings, just simply "do I like her as a person"

It was her final cross examination about leaking to TMZ. Her combative argumentative response.

Despite saying for ages "I don't know how to leak anything"

She comes back with anger

"If I wanted to leak something, I'd have done it better than that" the eye rolling the head shaking.

Then she's corrected "you testified earlier, you didn't know how to leak anything?"

And she replied "I don't"

Wtf you just argued you could, which one is it 😳

I was like....ohhh that's what's Dr Kipper was on about on Australia that she gets combative. If she's like that on the stand with the world watching, I can only imagine what she is like behind closed doors.

I don't think the attack in Australia happened as she said, absolutely not. There is no evidence of injuries after the attack she described and that's just not possible.

Evidence that she didn't cut his finger off? Multiple texts, emails and recordings where he says he cuts it off himself. In one audio he references her throwing vodka bottles but still says he cut his finger off. The pictures of the bottles presented don't look like the one described. The doctors notes say he changed his story, first a knife, then she cut it off.

The medical evidence shows it was a crushing injury and could not have been caused like he said because the nail was in tact and from the position of where the thumb was cut also there were no pieces of glass in the wound or around it. Wouldn't that be impossible?

Mid. My DH is a survivor too. He wasn't perfect but he definitely wasn't the aggressor. 26 years he lived like that so yes, sometimes he reacted to the constant emotional, physical and financial abuse. (This has been backed up to me personally by both his adult children as they experienced it from their DM too) and 9 years later he still won't open up about it fully. Now having EMDR therapy (which is amazing) and I can finally see the real DH coming through more and more.

The damage this does to both sexes is abhorrent.

Don’t really give a crap how he cut his finger off, more concerned about the rape allegations. I broke my leg in a car accident, most people realise I didn’t break my own leg.

I also think for someone to stand up in front of a jury and the world, testify under oath that two images were taken at different times and have not been edited, when they are clearly, beyond any doubt, from the same original image, then they will literally have no problem lying about anything under oath.

Thank Mummy yes I heard that too but the rebuttal hand doctor came back and said it was possible due to his hand being against a hard marble surface (no give) and not with a knife as the skin was jaggered consistent with a high force crush/tear injury.

Also glassing in Australia is a serious crime so I put no value in him taking the blame but consistent with Jerry wanting her out of AUS immediately and them covering it up as she was already on shakey ground with the dog smuggling. He was still married to her and in deep. Plus AH hysterical in the background. This makes far more sense to me than he cut his own finger off

But one could argue that's exactly what victims of abuse do, deny their abuser did it, change the story, dismiss or play down the incident.

But then on the other hand one could argue it's proof she didn't do it.

Depends what side of the fence you are sitting on doesn't it.

With regards to glass injuries, I've had a few working in hospitality, such as optic bottles smashing in my hand when replacing them, wine glasses exploding in my hand when I've taken them out of the 90 wash and brought them out in to a air conditioned room causing one to explode in my hand with the rapid change in heat. I've also had a glass bottle thrown at me when working behind a bar which exploded on the edge of the bar and sent shards flying everywhere.

The problem with glass is that it doesn't shatter in a uniformed way each time, so the shards are different sized, flying at different speed. Even though the wine glass exploded in my hand, the cut I had on my fingers didn't have any glass inside it, the shard simply sliced through on its journey. I had my finger stitched back up in a and e, and no glass was removed.

So lack of glass in the wound for me, doesn't mean a glass didn't cause it. But that's from my personal experience.

It is. I have a family member who is still in a relationship with a woman who is abusive. It has made him a shell of a person in many ways. And yet there are no resources and as you can see from these threads - many who would outright deny his experience if he was ever to speak up.

Boys and men can experience abuse and trauma and be very impacted by those experiences. I worked in mental health and men's mental health is really no different from womens - other than they talk about it less, are believed less, and expected to suck it up and deal and be strong. The impact is still there

I hope both you and your husband continue on your paths to healing and happiness. EMDR is a great tool.

Thanks Mid ❤️

Apparently we get an hours notice to a possible verdict??

@TiddyTidTwo What sort of things did she do to him, especially financially?

Completely off topic, but does anyone know why Mumsnet have never introduced a like button on people's comments (or something similar). I've often wanted to acknowledge people's replies to me or indicate my agreement with someone's comment, but don't want to clog up the thread doing this all the time. My thinking is maybe they don't want it to be like social media or turn people's comments into a popularity contest, but just wondering if this has ever been discussed, as it would have some benefits.

What's verbal abuse, physical abuse, threatening with losing the kids if he didn't comply with anything, control of money, debt etc. I might start another thread as to not derail this one as it's a looooong story.

Just read on Twitter that umbrella guy has received threats on his 8 year old daughter. Unverified of course

Apart from trying to fleece him for 20m, 3 penthouse flats, cars in their divorce, they were only married for 15 months.

Aspiring matriarch I agree with your a few pages back.

There is a massive bias toward JD.

I myself wavered probably in Johnny favour but I feel she's just had a massive addict in denial on her hands, VP suffers because of his addictions, his daughter suffers, his staff all have suffered and then amber.
It's a cycle and denials system all around an addict albeit a very rich charismatic one.

Ah is feisty. She's not a soft kitten and people don't like that.

It more than dodgy and also it wasn't just what depp photo expert said then, they were purposely not given to depps before trial, in to check metadata. It was court ordered by they disobed. So it could have very easily been verified. But heard didn't. Why is that? Her team thought it was better option to disobe a court order to hand over photos to be verified and just expect everyone to belive she didn't doctor them. When it could have just been verified. There a clear reason why they choose to do that. Someone who has nothing to hide do not do that!

I'm sorry but this is just untrue. I've seen one poster make the argument that absent any other factors changing the power dynamic, a woman can't be the abuser in a heterosexual relationship. I don't agree with that but it's not the same as arguing that boys or men don't deserve respect.

What I have seen is all evidence that Depp was abusive dismissed as unreliable in some way, but the (weaker) evidence against Heard is accepted because it fits with what you decided at the beginning. You seem determined to make a victim out of Depp when his own words show the kind of man he is. There are male victims you could absolutely support and discuss - Kevin Spacey's victims for example. But you're hung up on THIS case because you're projecting a load of misogyny onto Amber in the mistaken belief that your past experiences make you an expert.

The truth is this is just another abusive Hollywood male being protected and excused by everyone around him. It's not the exception you've decided it is.