To be amazed how much women benefit financially from marriage

[Singleparent78]

I've been single most of my adult life, worked FT and built up a good career but despite this... I'm always struck how much better off women who are married are than me.

It's not just about the merging together of two salaries, but about how much easier financial life is when you have the benefit of a man's higher average income, giving many women a lifestyle they could never afford on their own salaries.

Consider:

• the many women I work with on low salaries or working part-time who are living much nicer lifestyles than I as they have a man significantly supplementing them.

• the married women I know at 45+ who have moved to part-time or stopped working as they have accrued significant savings with their dh but, critically, their dh is now a high earner who can pay for both of them.

• the girls from school who didn't go onto further education, got married soon out of school and haven't worked at all or a bit of p-time - they mostly live in nice houses and cars, have enjoyed nice holidays etc. There hasn't been much 'penalty' for not being independent or not having a career.

All in all these women, by way of marriage, seem to have an easier go than solo me slogging it out for 30 years working FT and trying my best to be independent.... like the teachers at school told us girls to be!

I understand: all the constraints on women to generate their own income esp the gender pay gap and the impact of childrearing; that the above scenarios don't apply to all couples; that I'm assuming a heterosexual set up; that women contribute within marriages in other way than bringing in income; and that assets in a marriage are shared as is any income that comes into a marriage. I know people might think I'm being anti-women for challenging women's choices or women's rights or just plain bitter...

Still, AIBU to wonder:.......Is it not depressing that the best or most common way for women to be financially comfortable or create wealth is still through marriage and the merging of assets with a man?

Yes. Really annoying feature.

Thank you.

I see your point with paragraph one, but of course that's not applicable now. Not to "us" anyway, women in the "Western" world. (""< in the interests of brevity)

Your second paragraph doesn't outline any limitations for women based on our sex.

Anyone else? Anything?

Are you able to offer an answer to my question and challenge that belief?

Yes. How long have you got? Let's start at the beginning shall we?

From birth, children are bombarded with messages about what is an appropriate way to behave in relation to their sex. This includes how to dress, speak and appropriate jobs. The language used to describe the same behaviour is different depending on whether you are talking to/about boys or girls. This continues into adulthood ( women are bossy, men are assertive etc)

By age 5, children group jobs by sex, they will associate subjects and jobs that require you to be 'clever' with being male. There's a great section on 'brilliance bias' in the book Invisible Women but it's also supported by other evidence.

By age 14 teenagers will have very fixed ideas about the type of jobs that are appropriate to their sex. When making career decisions, people consider three things; interests, status and whether the job is sex appropriate. If they need to compromise ( which most people do) they are more likely to choose a job that is sex appropriate over one that they are interested in or holds a particular status. There is so much evidence to support this.... happy to share the links when I'm next back at my desk.

So, stereotypes are clearly very influential but so are societal expectations.
We know that women are more likely to take on more childcare and housework which absolutely has an impact on job choice and ability to progress - this was highlighted quite starkly during the pandemic and there is a significant amount of evidence to support this.

Obviously, maternity leave causes issues for many women in terms of career progression. The uptake of shared parental leave is at less than 2%. Why is this? Societal expectations and employers views on the role of men and women in relation to childcare absolutely play a part. The research around unconscious bias is also interesting and relevant.

Sexual harassment was mentioned earlier- again, that is a factor which shouldn't be overlooked.

There's lots more I could say/share but these are the main points. I can support all of this with evidence once I'm next back at my desk.

I'm a university academic and this is one of my specific areas of research and teaching.

This thread has really tested the limits of MN's new quote function

You can just read the final comment and skim past the nests.

What a weird post. Are you suggesting that @Madmaxxy is lying?

It really isn't unusual for women to earn more than their husbands these days. Is it surprising that quite a few of those women might choose to comment on a thread like this?

A high earner will be a high earner based on previous life choices. No one's enabling anyone. Ironing, childcare, sex, food etc can all be outsourced with money. The good news is high earners can be either sex.

Joint effort and economies of scale mean a husband and wife (or a homosexual couple - I don't know why you have to assume heterosexuality) can be more financially efficient than a single person. Single shop, single laundry, single meal prep (though it is not fair that these have traditionally been seen as "women's work", and I get your point that men have been able to progress in their careers with work done in the background by women). Its' not quite "two can live as cheaply as one" but certainly more efficient because of teamwork.

I'd say that many MEN are better off when they marry a woman. Its not a one way street (though in family courts it often can be). I married my wife and we both benefitted from this (got a house etc) which wouldn't have been possible on our own.

My point is I wasn't encouraged to think outside of the "caring professions". Which notoriously don't pay as well. I could have done engineering for example but knew absolutely nothing of it and would have been discouraged as "not creative enough".

If you earn 20k pa and you marry someone who earns 50k pa I'm fairly confident that your financial situation will improve.

Only in the conditions that @BadNomad outlined, in a true partnership, where each looks out for the other.

In other conditions, the woman could find here self financing the household so that the only beneficiary is the man whose costs are reduced. How often does a thread crop up on MN in which a lower paid woman is expected to contribute 50:50 to household costs regardless of disparity of income.

Having read the updates to this thread, I realise that I do still do not really understand what drives the OP's opinion.

May as well just outsource living and set up home behind the desk.

If you earn 20k pa and you marry someone who earns 50k pa I'm fairly confident that your financial situation will improve

No. I think there are plenty of women who will find themselves supporting two adults on their £20k, and then children as well, whilst the higher earner keeps their money to themselves. Moreover, the fact that there is a higher earner in the household will reduce/omit altogether a right to means tested benefits making a woman worse off in marriage than if she were single.

do you not see that the man in this scenario would also be better off? By £20k in a true partnership but by potentially more if you’ve got a wife paying for everything and you’re keeping your cash to yourself. Have a look on the relationships board, there are many, many cocklodgers out there. Marriage isn’t a guarantee of anything, other than a share of assets on divorce but even that can be seriously manipulated

for most (not everyone), coupling often gives more of a financial boost than anything one can achieve through independent career progression.

What leads you to think that? Can you hold that men naturally outperform women in earning power? What do you see as the barriers to woman's success?

The only cases in which I have seen this to be true, is when women sacrifice their career in order to parent, while minimising the impact of parenting on the other parent.

Isn’t your point really just that family life is generally much easier with two income streams and two pairs of hands than it is with one income and one pair of hands?

From 6 months FT day care then from Kindergarten. They have done FT wraparound care since they can recall! (and they are fine/thriving!!)

They're awful aren't they?!!!

Well, sometimes it is easier. But in terms of financial security marriage is probably an easier solution for an easy life than working or career development for most. Jane Austen-y but prob true.

Marriage can benefit both, either, or neither. When DH and I married, I suppose you'd say it 'benefitted' him because I out-earned him (not by a huge amount) and I was debt free whereas he had changed careers (pay drop) and brought a small amount of debt with him. Within 5 years our earnings were pretty much equal and the debt was paid. And so we continued because I did not give up work. It's now 35 years later, we're retired and are still pretty much 'equal' if you look at our pensions. All assets are joint so we're equal there, too.

Whether or not a marriage benefits one, the other, or both is really a matter of one's own life and career decisions. But at least if one remains single one knows where one is financially, since it's all up to that person. Whereas a married woman OR man could be rich today and destitute tomorrow depending on, not just their own decisions, but the decisions of their spouse. ys

Bottom line: you 'pays your money and you takes your chances'

Why do you assume that women earn less than men? I always earned more than my XH and am now probably on £100K than him. I've always worked hard and have never had any family money given to me (unlike him).

Yes. It seems like a goady post because it focuses on women being more fortunate after marriage. And yet many men would also be more fortunate after marriage, not only financially but because many women also do the wife work.

But that doesn't suit your narrative does it OP?

It just looks like another of those stealth threads that are having a go at women. There are more and more of those I've noticed on MN: having a pop or pitting women against each other. Weird that a supposedly women-heavy forum has so many threads that knock them....

What jobs pay 100k? There seems to be lots of people on here with that salary. What do you all do? I’m genuinely interested.

That’s your reason then. Some people choose not having wraparound care for a six month old over money.

Not my 'reason' @Pumperthepumper I had no choice whether it was 'over money' or not as I had to go out and work every day. But my children thrived and loved it.

Other women choose not to have wraparound care because they have enough money (usually but not always from a partner) allowing them to work PT, reduced hours or not at all. Sort of the point of this thread.

They "won't say because it's outing"