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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to be fed-up of non-drivers seeking lifts?

607 replies

GoldfinchTart · 28/05/2022 12:03

Disclaimer: this post is not about people who for whatever reason — sight problems, epilepsy, disability, poverty etc — cannot drive. It's about people who could learn to drive but don't want to.

Earlier this week I had a knock at the door and it was a couple asking if I could lend them some gardening equipment. They're in the process of buying a property a few doors along from me. It's a probate sale and it's taking ages, so they'd come down (with the vendors' permission) to start tidying up the garden which has become quite overgrown. They wanted a rake and a spade and loppers 'Because it's difficult to carry a rake on the train'. I invited them in and made them tea while I went to unlock the shed and find the tools. Turns out neither of them drive. He has a licence but found driving stressful and she prefers to be driven.

Our houses are a half-mile walk to a bus stop which isn't much fun when it's pouring with rain. I raised an eyebrow and asked if they cycle? Electric bikes are getting popular around here. We're 11 hilly miles from the nearest major town for shopping and transport links. No, they don't cycle. Long silence. I said that was a pity: taxis were very expensive because they had to come out from the town. She said that they have very nice neighbours where they currently live and they help out with lifts. Apparently the nice neighbours had run these two to the station that morning and would pick them up on their return. And then she asked 'I don't suppose you'd be going into town around 4pm, would you?' Fortunately I had a full afternoon's zoom meeting booked and showed them my diary. My partner and I try to be good neighbours but surely this was a very large red flag?

Next week I'm going to a book festival. I'm going in the camper van my partner and I share. A friend who doesn't drive is coming by train and will be travelling with a tent and camping gear. We arranged that I would be at Hereford station to pick her and her gear up at a certain time. It was planned to give us time to drive to the festival campsite and then for me to go and attend one of the events, which I've booked and paid for in advance. Today she's contacted me to say that she can't get anyone to give her a lift to the station at her end in order to catch the train required. Someone can give her a lift later to the station later in the morning, so she'll be arriving in Hereford two hours later than planned. She still expects me to pick her up from Hereford. I've told her she'll have to catch the bus from Hereford and she's responded that she has far too much gear to get on a bus. She fancies herself as a bit of a green crusader, always knocking me and my partner for having two vehicles and yet she's totally dependent on drivers to get her around.

In August my 28-year-old nephew and his girlfriend are coming to stay. They hope to go walking in the area and to visit several out-of-the-way places. They live in London and don't drive. It's become clear while we've been making arrangements that if they're to do half of what they've planned, I'll need to ferry them around almost every day. They're my relatives, they're here for a week and I'll do it without grumbling. But they'd have far more freedom and independence if they learned to drive and could hire a car for a week.

It strikes me that driving is one of those life skills that all eligible adults should be capable of, even if they choose not to own a car. AIBU?

OP posts:
UnsuitableHat · 29/05/2022 18:21

Nobody’s obliged to drive; There are loads of reasons why people don’t. It’s up to the individual, and up to the driver to say if giving a lift isn’t convenient.
It does annoy me a little bit though when non drivers (despite always accepting lifts) become ‘green crusaders.’ I have a friend like that.

Smartsub · 29/05/2022 18:29

I agree, everyone who can, should learn to drive. It's a life skill and not having a licence disadvantages you in not dissimilar ways to being unable to read or being scared of computers.

I don't mind giving lifts though. I generally enjoy doing favours and do find that what goes around comes around. You get it back, even if it's not from the person you gave it to. I only do it if I'm going anyway though. It would have to be very special circumstances to make me do the trip specially.

I'm worried for DS2 though. He's 19yo and was about to start driving lessons as lockdown started so that was delayed. He did have some lessons when we first came out of lockdown, but those soon ended when we went back in. Now it's very hard to find and instructor with availability and he doesn't see the point, as there are no tests available anyway.

Pliudev · 29/05/2022 18:32

OP, someone might already have said this. If it's Hay, I envy you because I'm just back. It's heaven. There is a regular bus service between Hereford and Hay and the festival are also running coaches to and from. I'd suggest she gets one of those. Have a great time.

Smartsub · 29/05/2022 18:33

BraveryBot9to5 · 29/05/2022 13:25

I agree! To me, you just get around not driving by living near bus routes, or being prepared to walk

The 4,000 euro I was quoted for insurance as a driver with no driving history would equate to taxi trips to the value of about 75 euro per week.

I also feel OK in my choice not to put another car on the road. I cannot believe that while there are documentaries being aired about the state of the planet some people are saying (shaming) ''its a life skill''. No figuring out how to make your own life run is the skill. I'm 52 and have got by without driving all this time.

Definitely not a cheeky fucker asking for lifts either. More often I was politely turning them down because I was thinking oh by the time you've moved all the car seats I'll be half way there.

You can get by without driving, but I see it as a life skill not because of the inconvenience, but because of the way it reduces opportunity. There's no way I'd be doing the job I do now if I didn't drive.

user3199 · 29/05/2022 18:33

It's a life skill and not having a licence disadvantages you in not dissimilar ways to being unable to read or being scared of computers.

While I agree that it's a useful skill to have, I don't think not being able to drive can be compared in any way to being illiterate.

Smartsub · 29/05/2022 18:35

user3199 · 29/05/2022 18:33

It's a life skill and not having a licence disadvantages you in not dissimilar ways to being unable to read or being scared of computers.

While I agree that it's a useful skill to have, I don't think not being able to drive can be compared in any way to being illiterate.

It does hugely restrict your employment choices though, both in terms of where you can work and the type of work you can do.

Frazzledmummy123 · 29/05/2022 18:35

Yadnbu at being annoyed at being asked or expected to ferry non-drivers around at their request. If someone doesn't drive they should accept they have to make their own arrangements to get about, and not expect others to be giving them lifts all the time.

However...

Yabvu say anyone who can drive should do it. I am a non-driver by choice (unless you count anxiety as a valid reason). I also have a terrible concentration span which makes me an unsuitable driver. i nnever expect anyone to ferry me around, or cadge lifts everywhere off drivers. If someone who is going same place as me offers me a lift I might on occasion accept, however I always give petrol money, and only accept as long as not putting them out their way. It is up to me to deal with the consequences of not being a driver, and it is nobody else's responsibility to get me about.

I get that many people out there like those you have mentioned, are forward enough to expect to be given lifts everywhere, and these people give non-drivers (by choice) a bad name. I have had a lot of judgement from people for my choice not to drive, and I find it is seen as a failure by some people. Driving might seem like second nature for some, but it definitely isn't for me and I make no apologies for it.

I get it will bother you given you are experiencing people being CFs and expecting you to give them lifts, however don't judge everyone who chooses not to drive. It might be a life skill which gives people more freedom to get about, but in my eyes, it isn't a completely essential one.

Starwind74 · 29/05/2022 18:39

Missing the point of the thread I know, but I wonder why OP potential neighbours want to buy that house so much ( going through longish sale process) if it is some distance from where they currently live and without good transport links. I don’t necessarily think it was rude to ask to borrow tools, but to ask for a lift to the station which presumably is several miles away when you had already made them welcome made tea etc takes the biscuit. Talk about give them an inch and they take a yard as my late Mum used to say!
As others have said fair enough if people don’t want to drive, and finding it stressful could be a reason, but it doesn’t mean they should expect everyone else to put themselves out.

threatmatrix · 29/05/2022 18:39

Just learn to say no, it feels so good. Tell your friend you are trying to go greener and so not using much petrol.

Kanaloa · 29/05/2022 18:41

I agree, everyone who can, should learn to drive. It's a life skill and not having a licence disadvantages you in not dissimilar ways to being unable to read or being scared of computers.

Absolute nonsense. Not driving is absolutely nothing like being unable to read or computer illiterate. This is just getting silly now. And why do you care whether others learn to drive? It isn’t affecting you. Why are you so so invested in other people’s ‘life skills?’ It literally will not affect you in any way unless you’re such a walkover that you can’t possibly refuse anyone who asks a lift.

Smartsub · 29/05/2022 18:44

Kanaloa · 29/05/2022 18:41

I agree, everyone who can, should learn to drive. It's a life skill and not having a licence disadvantages you in not dissimilar ways to being unable to read or being scared of computers.

Absolute nonsense. Not driving is absolutely nothing like being unable to read or computer illiterate. This is just getting silly now. And why do you care whether others learn to drive? It isn’t affecting you. Why are you so so invested in other people’s ‘life skills?’ It literally will not affect you in any way unless you’re such a walkover that you can’t possibly refuse anyone who asks a lift.

I don't really care if "others" can drive. It bothers me that my son hasn't yet learned because I know it restricts his choices in life. Not being able to drive absolutely doesn't affect your employment opportunity.

You can pretend it doesn't, you can decide it doesn't matter to you, but it does affect you.

Kanaloa · 29/05/2022 18:48

Smartsub · 29/05/2022 18:44

I don't really care if "others" can drive. It bothers me that my son hasn't yet learned because I know it restricts his choices in life. Not being able to drive absolutely doesn't affect your employment opportunity.

You can pretend it doesn't, you can decide it doesn't matter to you, but it does affect you.

If your son is restricted from something he really wants to do by not driving then he’ll make the choice to try to drive. If he is struggling for employment because he can’t drive then he’ll soon learn.

And it doesn’t affect me. How could it possibly affect me that other people can’t drive? I drive well and enjoy it. I take little notice of whether others drive.

JustABloodyMinute · 29/05/2022 18:49

It's definitely not a life skill in my book. People can live perfectly happy without a car depending on their choices (e.g. where they choose to live).

OP has obviously had a couple of bad experiences. However, that doesn't equate to all non-drivers. Of the non-drivers I know I don't know any that would ask for a lift, let alone expect one.

puffalo · 29/05/2022 18:51

YANBU. If you don’t want to drive it’s fine… as long as you handle your shit and make sure you can make your own way/cause as little hassle to the person giving you a lift as possible, etc.

The people in your OP just sound stupid, tbh. I wouldn’t be giving anyone a lift in those circumstances.

Hummingbirdcake · 29/05/2022 18:51

A decent affordable public transport system would certainly help with all this.

Carpedimum · 29/05/2022 18:53

YANBU @GoldfinchTart I’ve worked with a few “I don’t drive” types, who (in the past pre Teams/Zoom) got out of doing external meetings or could only do them if someone went with them. I realise we all get stressed by different things, but driving means that you have to rely on others do much. If there’s no genuine reason, then I think non-drivers aren’t fully functioning members of society. Luckily for them, the need to drive will dwindle over the coming decades.

riesenrad · 29/05/2022 18:56

Also, decluttering without a car is a pain. I have a bike trailer which is useful, but some things are just too big to fit in it, and the bike/foot access section of the tip is tiny

Actually, this is a good example of our car-centric society. In our area you have to register your car registration number to use the tip. For months they wouldn't let people on foot or a bike in!

Ejk1990 · 29/05/2022 18:57

Apparently I'm not a fully functioning member of society and lacking a life skill 🤣

I don't drive and I never will. I've been in a major car accident as a child and now I have no desire to drive.

I have a well paid job and not driving has never impacted that.

Its amazing that I've survived this long according to this thread and I don't ask for lifts either. I'm full capable of using public transport and walking when needed.

bluesapphire48 · 29/05/2022 18:59

YANBU
I don't drive because I had a stroke, and have a lot of cognitive problems and am deaf in one ear. Even in light traffic, I would get confused behind the wheel and have an accident. I've had to rely on my poor husband for the past twenty years and I hate it! I have a driver's license in case of emergency (can't think what, but it comes in handy for ID), but would never drive in the city.

People who CAN drive and don't are being unreasonable, unless they live in a city with regular bus service, they need to figure out how to get around without relying on other people all the time. They should be GRATEFUL that they can be INDEPENDENT and are not disabled and really can't drive. They need to grow up, because right now, they are childish parasites, just like your neighbors. I wouldn't give those folks anything more: you probably won't get your tools back.

People need to GROW UP.

user3199 · 29/05/2022 18:59

If there’s no genuine reason, then I think non-drivers aren’t fully functioning members of society.

Wow.* *Me and several friends who don't drive do jobs that I think would be deemed important for society (including dentist, computer scientist and cancer researcher). I can assure you that we are fully functioning!!!

Happygirl79 · 29/05/2022 19:00

KarmaStar · 28/05/2022 12:31

Hi op,what struck me is that you showed your new neighbours to be your diary to prove you were busy.
They will latch into that as a ' weakness ' to saying a firm no.
You need to start saying that and not providing evidence to back it up.
No lifts for them at all,you give in once they will take advantage.
Tell your friend again,no you cannot collect her,she gets the earlier train and don't give in
Your nephew,give him certain days,times you can drop off and collect then say after that it's up to them.
Do not feel guilty.🌈💐

I thought the same. Why on earth are you showing your diary to them? A simple no will suffice. You don't need to apologise either.

LookingforMaryPoppins · 29/05/2022 19:02

Non drivers expecting to be ferried around is unreasonable.
Choosing not to drive and using public transport without any expectation or reliance on others fair enough.

I agree with you, driving is a life skill. Even if you can't afford to run a car it's still worthwhile being able to drive one.

Sylvaniandream · 29/05/2022 19:03

Yanbu. 'Drives' me mad! Of course people who are unable to drive because of illness or disability, or someone who needs an emergency lift, are a different case. I HATE driving. Learning to drive cost me a fortune in holiday job and 'real' job money. Didn't pass til late 20s and went through several driving instructors. Don't enjoy the process of driving AT ALL but where I have lived it has been a necessity. Keeping a car is also very very expensive. The people who I have given lifts to rarely offer petrol money, and I wouldn't normally take it anyway for short lifts for friends. The trouble is, there might not be one person taking the mick and asking for several lifts a week, but if you know 10 people who dont drive and each one 'only' asks for a lift once a fortnight, that's still a lift more than every other day in the car I'm paying to buy and maintain and run.... Each person thinks its 'just' one lift oblivious of all the others. Its all very well deciding you don't want to drive or giving up driving, whether to save money or the environment, BUT DON'T DO IT THINKING YOU'LL RELY ON THE FACT THAT SOMEONE ELSE WILL STILL DRIVE YOU WHEN NECESSARY!!! I made and still make a lot of sacrifices to pay for lessons, pass a test and to run a car..... I try to be kind in life over most things , but unless you want to pay me taxi rates or have an actual car share where you pay half for everything, get the bus. If I give a lift, I will actually be out of pocket.... It will COST me to drive you, before I even get to the fact that I don't have much free time, and did I mention? I HATE driving!

user3199 · 29/05/2022 19:04

@Ejk1990 and all the other non drivers on this thread - it gets better and better, according to @bluesapphire48 we are 'childish parasites' and need to 'grow up'!!

Momicrone · 29/05/2022 19:04

I don't need a car for my job

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