Part 4 AIBU to keep this discussion on Amber and Jonny going?

[ENoeuf]

Just in case we run out on part 3

I think he has said he is currently in recovery and sober. Not sure after almost 50 years of addiction, he can look much past today.

I haven’t been active on here but I have followed the trial
what I struggled with was AH testimony that she was upset and anxious about JD using drugs and going on benders and that’s why she would get upset

yet every video or audio says nothing about drugs at all, barely a mention and nothing about benders. Just that he’s leaving her/the row and she’s upset he won’t stay with her to talk to her. Which fits with the diagnosis of BPD and abandonment.

I wonder if when they refer to splitting she is talking about him going on a bender after an argument. Although you're right it was not specifically said. She was pretty controlling too though. Getting upset when he spent too long with his friend Travis, upset when he wanted to go to a party and upset he wanted to spend time with his daughter. You could definitely say she wanted to isolate him or was worried about his time without her. She had bad dependency issues imo.

"he can look much past today"

Oh, of course. I did wonder, before I saw the detail about the jelly babies, if he were munching sweeties to compensate, don't ex addicts do that sometimes? 🤔

I really am trying my very best to stay neutral whilst following all this, despite my extensive though not exhaustive collection of JD DVDs going back nearly thirty years. I don't envy the jury in this one bit.

"Sources' say this is the list of possible rebuttal witnesses. Found on twitter.
twitter.com/GellertDepp/status/1528786046586068992

3 by deposition (Jennifer Howell, Candie Davidson-Goldbronn, Walter Hamada)

2 by live video link (Kate Moss, Lydia Filip)

11 live (Dr. Richard Shaw, Dr. Kimberley Collins, Ricahrd Marx, Mike Spindler, Doug Bania, Morgan Knight, Dr. David Kulber, Morgan Tremaine, Brian Neumeister, Dr. Shannon Curry, Johnny Depp)

I am surprised they aren't recalling Kevin Murphy to clarify a few details.

Amber's team has just over 4 hours left, Johnny's has just under 16.

@mummyrocks1

it makes a lot of sense that these abandoning episodes triggered AH very badly, and to me it sounds like when she got triggered and hysterical, he became triggered to run away and withdraw. So they were never able to resolve any disputes at all in a healthy manner. I am not sure if the jury will pick up on this, that none of the audio or videos actually match with her testimony on this issue. I think she was too afraid to admit the abandonment triggers in court in case it was used against her, so she’s using drugs as the reasoning for her behaviour, which are well documented (and admitted by JD). I can accept she didn’t like JD on drugs, who would it sounds awful, but I don’t buy into that’s why she got upset when he was trying to leave

Additionally yesterdays testimony about her career contradicts AH team saying he was stifling her career doesn’t it?

Yes. I can see both sides. A very tricky decision for the jury. It's complicated with much of being she said/he said and contradictions.

If I was on the jury I would want more clarity on the photos AH produced. Were they doctored or not? I hope they revisit this. It's a huge deal.

Some of these clips need to be remade with male / female voices switching roles. I really wonder if that was the case if people would be so quick to jump to supporting a male Amber as the imperfect victim if they heard a man saying what she is saying. Would they call the woman the abuser if they heard a woman saying what Johnny is saying. Would they hear these clips and think he was the one being abused if the voices were flipped? I think people are socially conditioned - they listen to this clip and can only imagine or hear Amber as the victim - no matter what she says or does. It would be an interesting study down the road. Play various clips to random people with the voices as they are and switched and see what the public's sociocultural perception is of males and females as abusers and victims. You would have to do it with people who had never heard of the case.

twitter.com/jacxpearl/status/1279723647192707073

There was an informal (?) study done where they had a couple walk through a park and sometimes the man hit the woman and sometimes the woman hit the man. Responses were completely different and those who saw it had a men can deserve to be hit but women can't, and its always wrong to hit a woman but not always wrong to hit a man, and they care if a woman is being hit but don't really care about a man / find it funny (weak), they stepped in when the woman was being hit but not the man...

I clicked on streaming thought it started but they are just taping people standing in front. Like wtf even one woman with little boy under 5 standing in that gross weather, are people crazy. They are like hanging out giggling. God I feel so grossed out by the fandom. I was never a fan of anyone basically, can't remember in my life being like let's go there, I might see xyz 😩cringe

There were many issues with the photos if you read that motion.
www.fairfaxcounty.gov/circuit/sites/circuit/files/assets/documents/pdf/high-profile/depp%20v%20heard/cl-2019-2911-plaintiff-mot-sanctions-3-22-2022.pdf

Amber's team have not been allowed to introduce any metadata because they didn't provide the evidence to Johnny's team as legally required for it to be verified.

The photo expert is on Johnny's rebuttal list.

I am not sure if this issue was yet fully resolved and if there are more motions related to it before it goes to the jury.

and they care if a woman is being hit but don't really care about a man

Maybe because people don't perceive a man being threatened by a slap from a woman, maybe because we all know it's men who murder women and other men in far bigger numbers than women do? Like I call bs on this one.

Well, well well.... we agree on something!

There's a woman dressed like poop standing there waiting for crying out loud

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxL7MW05PpB4fjxOp2Thjd-vWMx3uPN_b1

Is threat of death the only concern anyone should have?

Yes men kill each other and women far more often than women do. That isn't the totality of abuse nor abusive behaviour nor harm caused to others. There are many, many significant impacts of abuse and assault other than death.

If your son has a girlfriend who beat him with a frying pan, who kicked his balls repeatedly, who punched him in the face and called him names. Who spread rumours and lies to try to ruin him professionally, who demeaned him, taunted him, mocked him. Would you care or would you tell him well men kill more women than women kill men so I don't care. Would you think he probably has done something to deserve it. Would you continue to support his girlfriend as she must have a good reason to assault your son and he has more power so she is still the victim?

err... they have a different attitude to life than you? If a 5 yr old wants to see JD (Jack Sparrow?) so what?

"grossed out", odd thing to say. You do you, let others do what makes them happy.

My point was, the man can defend himself. The woman in different situation might not be able to and just from experience everyone already expects a violent attack from men so that's why they would be concerned it might escalate. They see women as weaker, as in majority cases they are

I really doubt a 5 year old would want to see him, he isn't wearing a bloody costume or looks like him. He looks like creepy old man that he is. And the kid didn't look like he was having fun he was moaning, as kids those age do

Also it's a court proceeding on domestic violence allegations. Why would you come there

I am curious as to why you think men can always defend themselves. What if the woman comes up behind them? Knives? guns? psychological abuse? less strong and disabled men? very strong women? Social pressure to never fight back? fear of repercussions and legal action if they push or hold a woman off of them?

Would you call her abuser? Would you call your son a victim? Would you care and support him or her?

@Miscfeminista Creepy old man 😬

Objection! Ageism! Sexism!

This is a fair point, and I am aware of the social experiment you are referring to.

Whilst a power imbalance is prevelant between men and women, and statistically more women are killed by men, than men killed by women. The fact remains it still does happen.

I do think that more discussion need to be had around female on male domestic abuse outside this circus. I also think social norms around women slapping or hitting men in arguments needs to re-framed.

If a woman stands up in a restaurant and slaps her male partner and storms out, there is little to no objection. However role reverse if a man stood up and slapped a woman, I can confidently say a ruckus would occur.

I'm the mother of a son, and if anyone behaved abusively towards him male or female I'd support him. Just because he is a male does not mean he can not be abused, belittled, assaulted and so forth.

RE hypothetical son situation. I would tell him to get away from her just as I would tell my daughter. But guess what women don't have that mercy from others, when they tell others they are being attacked or abused by their spouse they have to stay because most of the family doesn't want you back home once you are"married off"or people tell you to deal with it. We see a lot more adult men living with parents than we do women

I completely agree that this case is not the right forum. It has opened up online channels for men to share stories of their experiences of abuse - and get support rather than mocking and being dismissed. There is also a lot of support for Johnny from female victims / survivors and so I don't think it is as harmful to women as some people think. I think the younger generation is more open to an egalitarian view and most do accept that men can be victims. A couple times over the past year I have seen threads on a reddit site where people ask questions and men have shared their stories and it has been well received overall.

Once you start looking you also see all kinds of places in movies and TV where violence against men is trivialized, minimalized or made into a joke and this gets reinforced and normalized in people's minds as acceptable.