To insist my daughter goes to uni?

[Stropalotopus83]

I'll try to keep this brief!! DD (18) was supposed to go to uni last September. She had applied to various unis and had offers from most but had her heart set on Edinburgh. At the last minute she panicked and set Warwick as her safety as it had a lower grade threshold despite it not being in her top three choices. Sadly she didn't get into Edinburgh and then couldn't get into any of her other choices through clearing due to oversubscription on her course (biochemistry) despite having the grades (A*, A A). We went to visit Warwick but she ultimately decided to take a year off, get a job, earn some money and save and try again this year.

We visited Leeds and Manchester and she loved both, we didn't visit Edinburgh as so far away. She received unconditional offers from Leeds and Manchester. Again, despite meeting the grade threshold she didn't get into Edinburgh which is sad but not really the end of the world (at least I don't think it is). So she needed to decide between Leeds and Manchester.

Last night she casually mentioned she doesn't think she is going to go at all. I was dumbfounded as she has always been set on uni and has known she wanted to do science in some form since yr8. Initially she was considering medicine but for the last few years has been set on biochemistry.

Anyway. I asked her what she was going to do if she didn't go, she said she has a job. She does have a job she's working full time as a receptionist at a hotel at the moment. I said that job wasn't enough for her to afford to get her own place and keep a roof over her head etc. she laughed and said well you aren't going to throw me out, I'll just keep living here.

I'm worried she is going to massively regret this.

She currently pays £100 rent per month but earns around £1300. I deliberately only asked her to pay a token rent on the basis that she was saving as much as possible for uni.

So do I know sit her down and say ok - you don't have to go to uni but if you intend to stay here you need to pay a realistic rent being a quarter of all bills and shopping (4 people in household). This would dramatically increase her rent but might make her realise that just because life is great now (that she works and has a large disposable income and I do all washing etc for her) it won't stay that way?

I don't know what to do. I didn't go to uni and I have always regretted it. I am now doing a degree through the open uni alongside working full time but still wish I had gone when I had the chance. I don't know therefore if my own feelings about missing out etc are in play here and I'm perhaps not being as objective as I should be.

Any advice?

Thanks

Lots of very good advice upthread. It has been tough for the cohort that finished A-levels in 2021 as uni open days were, almost without exception, virtual meaning it was hard for DC to get a feel for particular institutions - important for those unsure and equivocating. This would have added to the uncertainty felt by your DD, perhaps. It might be worth talking to her about that. Her paid job is something concrete and it will be hard to let go of that. Discussing openly what worries her about uni might help - but do not frame it as an exercise in persuading her to change her mind.

Uni might or might not be the best route for her but, either way, she needs to develop a plan for becoming financially independent sooner or later and that means exploring other 'developmental options'. I would actually be tougher regarding the finances. Certainly charge her the market rent for your local area and expect her to pull her weight regarding household chores but also ensure she saves (ideally into an account that requires notice access) a good portion of her remaining money so that she has a much more limited amount for general living expenses, more akin to a student. This will make the eventual adjustment to financial independence much more straightforward.

Yabu to insist on uni. However yanbu to make her pay a realistic amount if she intends to choose work. Welcome to the real world kid.

I would be as close to insisting as I could.

I think it sounds like taking a year out without a concrete plan and then not getting her first choice uni have made her lose momentum and knocked her confidence a bit. I think I would sit down with her and talk it all through, how much you want her to go, and how if she doesn't go she needs to be making another proper plan (paying £100 rent is clearly not a proper plan). Also (while I'd be careful about phrasing this) if she really loathes it, she doesn't have to stay- just give it a decent try.

Does she have friends at uni?

She's obviously highly intelligent so exactly the sort of person who uni will benefit.

YABU. I was 22 when I went to uni and I don't regret having 4 years between school and uni to earn a bit of money and think more about what subject I studied, plus I was very immature at 18 and don't think I'd have been able to cope so well. I don't think anyone should go to uni to please their parents or because they think they ought to, only because they really want to and feel they would benefit.

We all change a lot in our late teens and 20s, so it could be a wasted opportunity to go now if she's unsure, might end up dropping out or regretting her choice of subject. In a year or two (or even longer) she might be much clearer about what she wants and more motivated to do a degree.

That wouldn't go down well anywhere. At all. It is just too silly for words as you simply cannot dictate that another adult must go to university, whether they want to or not.

OP thankfully doesn't seem to share your thinking.

OP, it is a fair decision from your DD. She doesn't sound sure that university is really for her and has taken her time to make that choice. Perhaps she isn't keen on ending up in a ridiculous amount of debt. Perhaps she is also really enjoying her job and doesn't want to leave.

As others say though, time to sit down with her and discuss the finances and her contribution to them, and other ways you would like to see her helping around the house.

This is also is a very good article on lifetime's earnings non graduates vs graduates.

ifs.org.uk/publications/14729

It also highlights that there are some degrees which deliver more in terms of earnings than others.

Depressingly, it shows how women's wages stagnate during the child birth/rearing years

This is a good point. I work at a university that offers these. They still have to study outside of working hours (which a lot of apprentices don't seem to get at first) but it's a brilliant deal in my eyes. Most aren't being paid apprentice wages either.

Even if they’re just eighteen?

Even if you could force a young adult to go to university against their will, it would be utterly counterproductive. If they are there under duress, they will not apply themselves properly and will either drop out early or do poorly. Talking about "insisting" sounds a lot like putting your fingers in your ears and refusing to accept that your child is now a legal adult who will - whether you approve or not - make their own life decisions.

I understand the frustration, fear and disappointment of a bright, previously motivated teenaged suddenly not doing what it says on the tin. But they aren't little kids any more, and you "putting your foot down" as though you were dealing with a stubborn five year old isn't going to achieve anything other than a distant, resentful relationship with your adult child.

Uni isn't the be all and end all these days. In fact it hasn't been for a long time.

I went in 2005, got a communications degree. It was an utter waste of money as I'm now a paramedic (for which, even though you train at uni, I trained on the job and was paid to train)

A school friend of mine dropped out after a few weeks and got a job in a bank. Just hated it. We all thought she was making a huge mistake, but by the time we'd left we were all skint and looking for entry level jobs and she was an assistant manager and had bought a house. And this was back when uni only cost 1500 a year- i dread to think how much students today are spending. Whenever I have a university student ar work for a placement, without fail when they find out you can train in house and get paid, they are absolutely gutted.

hmmm shes had a while to think about it and a year " off" so to speak. Shes lost momentum

tell her she needs to move out or go to uni.
shell soon decide what she wants
but listen, i went for a course i didnt like at 17. Left. Worked. Went back at 23? And now i still do that career in my late 30s ( in Edinburgh uni!)
so it all worked out.

It's her choice and just because you regretted it doesn't mean she will. Let her be.

sure shes living with you now and able to work as a receptionist now but what about when she has a famiyl, doesnt she want to afford her own family home. I'd say its either uni or she makea her own fodo, does her own laundry, pays market rent often £100 a week minimum so that shes living as an adult

What do you mean by 10xs better? With a good biochemistry degree, she could easily be earning 100k plus within a few years of graduating.

It's her choice at the end of the day, surely you'd rather her be happy?

Sounds like you would throw them out on their ears the minute they finish school.

There's no harm in adult offspring living at home and working provided that they make a realistic and reasonable contribution to the household, financially and otherwise.

DH lived with his parents for several years after he started working. I was there with him for a year too and we both contributed to the household and saved to buy our own place.

Obviously there are people who don’t have a degree earning lost of money and are successful. But that’s not always the case for everyone. My mother has two degrees and my dad doesn’t have any yet he earns more. As she in interested in science I’m guessing most jobs require a degree? Perhaps she could study at a uni closer to home if she likes the comfort of being at home. She must be very bright to get those a level results. It would be a shame if she didn’t go.

I think with the cost of living going up each, you need to be able to earn more than the minimum wage. Leaving school at 18 and straight into a job won't put you in the higher wages bracket. So I do think having a degree and a professional job puts you in a better financial position.

Out of all my friends I went to university and I'm earning much more than them. There are certain jobs that you can't do without having a degree and they command £££. But I also think there are different routes to getting a degree & if the degree apprenticeship was available in my time, I'd have done that. It's a bloody good deal as you get paid work experience as well as a qualification.

www.uel.ac.uk/study/apprenticeships?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI4dnCkrPp9wIVAbDtCh33iQivEAAYAiAAEgIV9fD_BwE

is She happy working? Has she got friends still at home?
you can’t force someone to go to uni, it’s not mandatory! She could work her way up in the hotel industry and do a degree later. Biochem is really hard - if your heart isn’t in it then it’s not the degree for you.
I’d increase the rent a bit, but it depends if you need the money or not. Obviously I wouldn’t shell out for anything for her, but I assume she goes out, maybe runs a car etc and may want to get a mortgage one day.

Get her to look for apprenticeships in accountancy etc.

I wouldn't make her go to university if she doesn't want to.

But yes, make her pay a decent rent to encourage her to look for a job with prospects even it you save the rent up for her to give to her for a deposit.

Yes. This.

She could try something like a apprenticeship at one of the big four - you can go as a school leaver and study for professional exams. There are options but what had she hoped to do with her degree? I assume there was something she wanted to be?

I think I'd be making it clear to her just HOW hard it may be to make the decision to go to Uni later on in life - right now she has a lot of freedom which may well not apply later on.

Without a solid plan to go to Uni later, theres a strong chance it simply won't happen - which if she has decided she simply doesn't want/need a degree is fair enough but.. if she thinks she's just putting it off a while, may be a huge regret.

And of course, alongside that, make it clear that staying at home is not going to be the easy, cheap option she may currently believe it to be

I mean if she was doing a Mickey Mouse degree then I’d say no worries, but she’s clearly wanting to do something with a job in the end, so I think you should egg her on more to go. Give her the positives of university and the advantages of qualifying in that degree.

12 years ago I was in the exact same position!!! I always wanted to do pharmacy but was told I wasn’t clever enough and would never get the grades in science so I decided to go to uni to study law but after a few months I absolutely hated it and dropped out and didn’t want to go to uni at all. My dad said that there was no point going back to college to do a levels and to just get a normal job or get a job selling houses like my mum…my mum on the other hand was adamant I should go to university to do pharmacy. So I listened to mum, went back to college, got the grades and qualified as a pharmacist.

The last two places I worked in were stacked to the rafters with underemployed graduates, all in £30k debt and earning just over minimum wage. Degrees have been so devalued over the last twenty years that they are largely meaningless unless of course you do a vocational one like medicine or law, but those are hugely stressful and not to be undertaken half-heartedly.

A trade would be better, if she's practical, otherwise let her make her own mind further down the road when she's more mature and has better understanding of where her skills lie.