To insist my daughter goes to uni?

[Stropalotopus83]

I'll try to keep this brief!! DD (18) was supposed to go to uni last September. She had applied to various unis and had offers from most but had her heart set on Edinburgh. At the last minute she panicked and set Warwick as her safety as it had a lower grade threshold despite it not being in her top three choices. Sadly she didn't get into Edinburgh and then couldn't get into any of her other choices through clearing due to oversubscription on her course (biochemistry) despite having the grades (A*, A A). We went to visit Warwick but she ultimately decided to take a year off, get a job, earn some money and save and try again this year.

We visited Leeds and Manchester and she loved both, we didn't visit Edinburgh as so far away. She received unconditional offers from Leeds and Manchester. Again, despite meeting the grade threshold she didn't get into Edinburgh which is sad but not really the end of the world (at least I don't think it is). So she needed to decide between Leeds and Manchester.

Last night she casually mentioned she doesn't think she is going to go at all. I was dumbfounded as she has always been set on uni and has known she wanted to do science in some form since yr8. Initially she was considering medicine but for the last few years has been set on biochemistry.

Anyway. I asked her what she was going to do if she didn't go, she said she has a job. She does have a job she's working full time as a receptionist at a hotel at the moment. I said that job wasn't enough for her to afford to get her own place and keep a roof over her head etc. she laughed and said well you aren't going to throw me out, I'll just keep living here.

I'm worried she is going to massively regret this.

She currently pays £100 rent per month but earns around £1300. I deliberately only asked her to pay a token rent on the basis that she was saving as much as possible for uni.

So do I know sit her down and say ok - you don't have to go to uni but if you intend to stay here you need to pay a realistic rent being a quarter of all bills and shopping (4 people in household). This would dramatically increase her rent but might make her realise that just because life is great now (that she works and has a large disposable income and I do all washing etc for her) it won't stay that way?

I don't know what to do. I didn't go to uni and I have always regretted it. I am now doing a degree through the open uni alongside working full time but still wish I had gone when I had the chance. I don't know therefore if my own feelings about missing out etc are in play here and I'm perhaps not being as objective as I should be.

Any advice?

Thanks

I think given her response, I’d let her know that rent at home will now be at market rate. You can save it to cover her uni tuition costs if she decides to go later on.

It's not 'just' about a job though.

1. Some careers will be extremely difficult, if not impossible to enter later in life. Especially since she's interested in science. Academia, research are all very competitive.
2. Many career opportunities are available mainly through university. Year in Industry, internships, many unis have partnerships with reputable firms. You get to try a wide range of things, unavailable to the general public.
3. It gets harder and harder to return to studying. We have a few degree apprentices currently working for us and some are 25+, in their first year. They haven't made many friends among their younger cohort who are, shall we say a bit wilder at uni ;)

Of course it doesn't make much of a difference if she was going to do a generic humanities degree. But if she had her heart set on science she may very well regret it!

I'm a business major, now a software engineer doing a computer science master. I have seen all sorts, career changers, etc etc. Many people come to degrees etc later in life, they should be encouraged, all well and good.

However someone who had the chance to go as a youth - and throwing it away? That's a different matter entirely. Especially if they're academic and will enjoy exploring their subject of study. You only get to daydream and experiment all day in uni, there's nothing quite like it. I discovered my love for programming in uni.

Also you can't 'insist' on her going to uni... but you don't have to sit passively and be 100% supportive. Addressing her concerns is the first step (as she's a bright young girl and has a BF at uni, so good environment).
But if all else fails you have to strongly encourage her to go to uni, or pay adult rent. Making her move out after a year would be a good idea too. Let her deal with landlords, her own bills etc and see how she likes it.

I wouldn’t let my adult children live at home if they were working. I will happily support them through education but once that’s over, they’ll be moving out. What’s the incentive for them to grow up otherwise?

Equally, I didn't do A Levels or Uni but I'm more successful professionally than my friends that did.

Presumably you would be paying ALL costs? As forcing someone into £50k+ of debt for something they’re not keen to do is completely unreasonable.

I think she should go her grades were brilliant but you can't force her.

Sounds like she is very clever with those grades

Look, loads of people have already said stuff about it being her decision, she's an adult etc. Just because she's 18 doesn't mean she is emotionally mature or can see the bigger picture.

Does she have a career in mind? Is it in the science world?

There are certain careers where having a degree or a higher level of education is expected and needed to get on.

e.g. Law - I am sure there will be the odd person that has a high flying legal career, who dropped out of school at 16 and studied hard at night school..........however, 99% of lawyers/barristers will have a degree.

You might want to show her this graph comparing wage differences between non-graduates & graduates
www.statista.com/statistics/1191970/annual-salary-of-graduates-in-england/#:~:text=Average%20annual%20salary%20of%20graduates,graduates%20in%20England%202007%2D2020&text=University%20graduates%20in%20England%20had,average%20salary%20for%20non%2Dgraduates.

If she wants to go into business, there are some really good apprenticeships at leading companies. If I was doing my career again, it would definitely be something to look into as you don't get into debt.

If this all fails, you definitely need to get more rent off her.

Perhaps a uni near home so she could live at home and work her job pt?
Or nhs apprenticeship
www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/career-planning/study-and-training/nhs-apprenticeships
I'd talk about having a plan. Not having everything figured out but not making the mistake of getting stuck because its comfy

I don't think anecdotal evidence for either side is useful. It all depends on the person.
If you were never academic to begin with, just want 'a job', 3 years of uni isn't clearly the right path. A generic degree for the piece of paper, if you have no responsibilities is easy to get. A lot of professional certifications also offer top-ups. Like the Oxford Brookes degree with you can do after completing certain accounting qualifications.
Of course, the qualifications themselves can go up to an NVQ Level 6, equivalent to a degree.
So for me.. some form of qualification is important, not necessarily a degree.

However there is no substitute for a degree for 'academic' subjects. If you have a genuine interest in Physics, History, Politics... a waste to not do a degree. Leave jobs aside, you won't be as free to explore in the working world.

If my daughter was the OP's DC I'd encourage her to go. If she was just scraping by, and didn't seem particularly interested in anything? Probably the opposite.

She may not want to go because life is pretty good for her now

She has a job she likes, pays minimal rent and has assumed that will continue. She has plenty of disposable income, secure home, looked after by her mum etc.

Uni may feel like it’s going to be a hard way to live compared to now.

She may be naive to the fact her living like this can not continue if she is deciding that she isn’t going to uni.

@SunshineLake
Well clearly she doesn’t wanna go down the academia route if she doesn’t wanna go to university.

by the word of ‘major’ i assume you’re American? Well OPs dds grades are good so at least she isn’t gonna end up with some toilet paper degree at bumfuck polytechnic.
So I see ur point there

She can also always quite and come back if she REALLY doesn't like it at uni.

Uni isn’t the only way to a great career. Plenty of talented young people come in at the same level as the grads with more practical experience behind them these days.

in Europe it’s quite normal to go to uni in your twenties, once you have worked for a few years and know a bit more about what you want to specialise in. It doesn’t mean she will never go.

you can tell her about your regrets and experiences but there’s no point forcing her hand. It could be a pricey mistake and negatively impact your relationship.

@Stropalotopus83 you asked ‘So do I know sit her down and say ok - you don't have to go to uni but if you intend to stay here you need to pay a realistic rent being a quarter of all bills and shopping (4 people in household)….?

The short answer is YES.

My very DM announced on the day I turned 18 that her housekeeping services were no longer available. So I would do my own washing, ironing, shopping, share of cooking, cleaning up etc & I would be paying a appropriate rent.
I survived that OK & so will your DD.

To be honest, that's what my parents would have done!

Frankly, growing up in my house, NOT going to uni was never an option. It was an assumed given. My parents met at uni and still look back on it as the best time of their lives. It wasn't like that for me. I had a neutral experience at best, and was horrendously homesick for the entire first year.

She could do a degree apprenticeship so she earns and learns a trade while studying for a degree. My friend's sister is doing an engineering one via Manchester University. She's gaining industry experience and will have a guaranteed job at the end of her course as well as a BEng.
degree apprenticeship

No, she has good grades and previously showed a strong interest. She may be having some wobbles now, but she's likely to regret closing the path off in future. Unlike people who fall asleep at the mere mention of 'more studying'.

Also polytechnics.. a lot of them are actually good at their core subjects, with industrial placements. The problem arises when they start churning out traditional 'academic' subjects and accepting people with D's in said subject. Which is what you're referring to I suppose

I'm not American, but did a degree there ;)

Yes, if she doesn't go she pays her way. And you stop washing for her. She lives like a lodger in your house.

@pipsquiggle please would you download that graph as an image & upload it here.

I really wish I'd had a gap year as I think I would have made a better choice. I desperately wanted my DS to go to university but he refused.

I think a year off might do her good. But if you need her to pay her way more then that's the deal.

It has been a rough few years for everyone and maybe she just wants to enjoy earning for a bit.

Uni isn't the only way to a great career but working in any old job isn't an alternative plan it's not making a plan.

Definitely lodger treatment, she needs to think through her future career trajectory for both uni and non.

I agree totally.

@SunshineLake

lucky! :) hope it was in the south as I’d love to visit texas.

totally agree with you on the polytechnic front. You seem cool fist bump