School, dd with special needs

[Leftie202]

Dd age 10, struggling significantly at school. They have gone to a reduced Time table, she has a one on one, echp, not yet been diagnosed but all professionals say probably adhd. She’s hard work at school no doubt about it. At home she’s not so bad. She lives full time with her father, only spends weekends and half the holidays with me. It has been this way for a couple years, she seems happy with this arrangement. So here is the aibu… the school struggle so much with her that they have to call me or her dad in to help them quite often, daily, every other day if we’re lucky. Now they usually call her dad first, but he normally says he can’t come in for whatever reason, so it’s left to me. I work full time, im having to leave work, have so much time off which I simply can’t afford to do. Her dad claims all the benefits for her, so I simply have to work to live, so I’ve said to school I can’t come in anymore, sorry, but I can’t. Im going to end up losing my job if it keeps happening. They said that’s not acceptable and I should be available when they need me. But I think her dad should be! He’s the main parent, he claims for her, including dla and carers. Basically he has the option to not work and care for her, where as I do not. So aibu or not? Im so stressed with it because I can’t keep on like this.

I'm pretty sure the courts would take a dim view of parents refusing to collect a child infected with chicken pox when told to by the head. SS contacted parents and said child would be collected by them within the hour.

Bizarre argument. We aren’t talking about chicken pox so that is irrelevant.


Stood up to schools? I see where you are coming from now. If more parents were decent and reasonable there would be fewer DCs causing problems or in need of extra support. Leaving the support for those actually in need of it.

My ‘agenda’ is to ensure pupils with SEN get the support and provision they are legally entitled to and need. Yes, stand up to schools acting unlawfully. Or do you think schools should be allowed to discriminate against disabled pupils and act unlawfully without repercussions? A parent wanting to enforce their child’s rights and for their child not to be discriminated against doesn’t mean they aren’t reasonable or decent. Strange you think it does. It also doesn’t influence their child’s needs or the support they require so wouldn’t alter the support available for others - especially if the support is specified and quantified in the EHCP (but the OP hasn’t said either way).

"Stood up to schools? I see where you are coming from now. If more parents were decent and reasonable there would be fewer DCs causing problems or in need of extra support. Leaving the support for those actually in need of it."

Let me guess. You are not a parent of a child with disabilities?
If I had not stood up for my son and insisted that the law was obeyed, his quality of education would have been appalling. I'm proud to be a ' difficult parent' and it is difficult parents that force organisations to change their ways.

DC whose parents can navigate the system, advocate for their child and enforce their child’s rights do get better support. It shouldn’t be that way but it is. Just because a parent is able and willing to do this doesn’t make them unreasonable.

Well said. You are spot on.

Yes, stand up to schools acting unlawfully. Or do you think schools should be allowed to discriminate against disabled pupils and act unlawfully without repercussions? A parent wanting to enforce their child’s rights and for their child not to be discriminated against doesn’t mean they aren’t reasonable or decent. Strange you think it does. It also doesn’t influence their child’s needs or the support they require so wouldn’t alter the support available for others - especially if the support is specified and quantified in the EHCP (but the OP hasn’t said either way).

You seem to think schools want to break the law. That's just daft. I say again if there is no one available to give support despite the school's best efforts to find someone then what do you suggest they do? You still haven't answered that.

I worked in special ed for many years as well as mainstream schools. There are children who have no special needs who demand a lot of the teacher's time by their lack of discipline. I do blame their parents for that, I've seen it often enough. The time spent dealing with them takes away from those in genuine need of support. You seem to have deliberately misunderstood me and imply I think they are not worthy of support.

Tell me where the school gets a support teacher from if there is no one available, despite their best efforts to employ one. No point in slagging off schools doing their best, maybe have a pop at the tories - they caused this.

But the head is not asking for a distressed child to be collected. They are asking for OP to join the staff and remain in school with the child - probably as they've been burnt with unlawful exclusion before.

The OP offered to collect the child and make other arrangements so she could work - but the school refused that. So this is andifferent scenario.

Taught in special ed for many years. Autistic family member.

I'm not saying the situation is right. I am saying if no one wants the job the school can't magic up support staff. Surely you can see that? Schools have been cut to the bone. No school wants to fail a child but sometimes they have little choice. You can insist on the law all you like. Without a person to obey that law then it's pointless. No school wants to fail their children. Sometimes circumstances mean they do.

You seem to think schools want to break the law. That's just daft. I say again if there is no one available to give support despite the school's best efforts to find someone then what do you suggest they do? You still haven't answered that.

Well there are options other than acting unlawfully. Actually I have answered it more than once. I even replied directly to you posting the same thing last night at 21.48.

I worked in special ed for many years as well as mainstream schools.

Disappointing a teacher condones such discriminatory and unlawful practices.

There are children who have no special needs who demand a lot of the teacher's time by their lack of discipline.

This thread isn’t about that though so that is irrelevant to the thread.

You seem to have deliberately misunderstood me and imply I think they are not worthy of support.

No I haven’t, it just isn’t relevant to the thread.


Tell me where the school gets a support teacher from if there is no one available, despite their best efforts to employ one. No point in slagging off schools doing their best, maybe have a pop at the tories - they caused this.

As I have posted previously, the schools should a) ask for an early review, b) redeploy existing staff if available away from those who don’t have sport specified and quantified in F, c) pass the buck on to the LA as it is them with ultimate responsibility to either fund at a higher rate/find staff themselves/provide alternative arrangements/amend the EHCP, d) stop the unlawful part time timetable e) if they need to exclude do it formally, f) refer to medical needs tuition if the child genuinely cannot attend full time (and not just because it is easiest for the school) and g) not lie to the OP about the father’s decisions carrying more weight... Others have posted similar.

Without a person to obey that law then it's pointless.

No it’s not. The rights of the child can, and should, be enforced.

The school can tell the LA they cannot meet need and say an emergency review is needed. They can ask for extra funding and so offer a higher rate of pay. If there aren't enough staff to cover the whole class they could put the entire class on a part time timetable rather than discriminating against one child.

I suspect a lot of 'no one available' is lack of decent pay to deal. if SN Education was better funded by LA / Government I bet 1-1s would be more easily available.

redeploy existing staff if available away from those who don’t have sport specified and quantified in F

My point is that schools have been cut so badly that there is no one to redeploy. Everyone is already committed. To move a teacher or TA you leave a group of children floundering. This isn't the heady days of floating teachers and spare staff. Everyone is tied up - there often is no one to redeploy. Which is my whole point. What then?

As a parent I'd accept going in to support my child until a better setting could be found in a special ed school.

The school is demanding the parents stay on site, which is a big red flag to me. That's masking the reality of the situation.

The OP is at risk of losing her job, as she is not the resident parent and not in receipt of relevant benefits like DLA etc, any claim for JSA UC isn't going to recognise her caring responsibilities.

Even when a child is excluded, the school has to keep them until the end of the school day.

The OP going in is not actually helping, if the child's dad starts to feel the full effects he might reconsider his stance on a special school.

Though look carefully as some SEMH provision (if that's the main area of need) can be quite marmite in terms of suitability.

what then

See the rest of my list don’t just completely ignore all the other points I posted and the “if available”. Not to mention everyone else’s post.

To move a teacher or TA you leave a group of children floundering.

Like the OP’s DD then? Many schools do have staff who are providing support where it is not specified and quantified in EHCPs which is why it was in my list. If they don’t then there are other options - I listed some of them.

As a parent I'd accept going in to support my child until a better setting could be found in a special ed school.

Good for you but as has been said by multiple posters, by going in the OP delays her DC getting the correct support.

As a parent you would be better off g

Better off giving the LA grief and so forcing them to sort it out. Not providing what is in a ehcp is judicial review territory so a pre action letter will probably be enough.

It's not just as simple as saying a child needs a special school, my son has severe autism and learning disabilities, and he's always gone to a special school, but his needs are such that it was a relatively simple process, his needs are met in one of mu LEA special school, s
Some children though who don't have cognitive disabilities but still have significant SEN ,where do they go often mainstream can't meet their needs ,and the LEA special school s will be working at levels far below their abilities
I mean there are schools out there but they cost ,££££,s and many LEA s refuse to fund them

See the rest of my list don’t just completely ignore all the other points I posted and the “if available”. Not to mention everyone else’s post.

The rest of your list is pointless when the phone call comes this afternoon. Of course there are other things that can be done in the longer term, I have never said they can't - but my concern is with right now, not next week, next term. Now.

That argument only works when it is a one off, not day in, day out. This is next week, next term. The school should have acted before now with other solutions of which I gave examples in my pps not continually act illegally.

This has been an ongoing situation. The school might have had the "can't magic up" excuse the first one or two times, but not after that.

They should have taken proactive steps to apply for further funding to cover the necessary support and arranged an early annual review so that amendments could be made to the EHCP that would ensure that they could meet the child's needs - in which event they wouldn't need to call on anyone for extra support. If the LA wouldn't play ball, they could and should have told them that they could not meet the child's needs and that alternative arrangements would have to be made.

"As a parent I'd accept going in to support my child until a better setting could be found in a special ed school."

You will be doing that for a long time whilst the parents refusing to do it will be getting their child the place in special school.

There’s actually nothing stopping the school formally excluding now. Nor asking for an early review now. Or referring to medical needs tuition. Or stopping lying to the OP about the father’s decisions taking priority or stopping acting unlawfully. Or passing the buck to the LA - including pointing the OP in the direction of threatening JR - usually when the parents threaten JR LAs pull their finger out.

If the only reason the school wants the child collected is that they are failing to meet her SEN, social services should tell them to get lost.

What do you think should happen if neither parent is available, e.g. because they work some way away, are away from their workplace or otherwise uncontactable, are ill, will lose their job and therefore risk losing their home if they drop everything to help out the school? OK, something else would have to happen if the child was ill, but why should it if it is just the school not coping with the child's SEN? Bear in mind that if the child has an EHCP, the school when consulted must have told the LA that it could meet needs; and if they don't, it is because the school hasn't applied for an EHCP, or applied too late, presumably again because they are claiming that they can meet needs.

the school when consulted must have told the LA that it could meet needs


In theory this might not be the case. Unless the school is wholly independent the LA can, and must, name a school regardless of the school’s objections unless the LA can prove:
-The setting is unsuitable for the age, ability, aptitude or special educational needs (“SEN”) of the child or young person; or
-The attendance of the child or young person would be incompatible with the provision of efficient education for others; or
-The attendance of the child or young person would be incompatible with the efficient use of resources.

The bar to prove the above is higher than many think. It is more than an “adverse effect”, “impact on” or “prejudicial to”.

Exactly, I started off wanting to work with the school, realised over the next year or so how nieve I was

To be fair some social workers knowledge of Sen is pretty shocking and they often come from a background of trusting other professionals over parents so I can well imagine the situation where a social worker put pressure on a parent when they refused to pick up a child for an illegal exclusion. When my child first had an ehcp he was supposed to have 32.5 hours 1-1 the school weren’t putting in place and were still excluding him. I had early help at the time and the sw said I was being unreasonable expecting a mainstream school to provide what was in the ehcp and I should just feel grateful that he hadn’t been permanent excluded. Was glad when I was signed off from early no help.