DD being bullied by a riding instructor at horse therapy

[howler21]

I honestly can’t believe this is happening and that an adult is behaving in this way, especially with vulnerable adolescents.

DD13 has depression, undiagnosed ASD (she’s due to be assessed) and severe anxiety. I had to pull her out of school in January and home-educate her. She was being severely bullied and was at the point of being suicidal.

I work very part time (I’m a lunchtime assistant at a primary school, Monday-Friday) and DD gets left for a couple of hours a day. Now she’s out of school she’s no longer self-harming or suicidal and she gets on with her school work fine during this time.

My local authority home education team recommended me some resources and activities to enrich her life and give her something to do, with a view towards confidence building. One of these things is an all day activity Tuesdays and Thursdays at a stables. It was described as ‘horse therapy’ and being great for mental health. DD loves animals so I thought it sounded brilliant and it fit around my work hours. They do riding lessons, horse care, and some study work towards some kind of horse care qualification, and friendship building is encouraged. It really did sound perfect for DD and she actually really wanted to go. There’s about 15 kids in the current cohort, a few are like DD (out of school due to mental health/bullying), some are in care, some have experienced recent bereavement. All are very vulnerable. None of the kids have behavioural issues, I know because I asked (some of the other home-ed activities she’s tried she was with kids who’d been excluded and they caused trouble which made DD anxious). They said they won’t have kids with behavioural issues anyway because it’s a safeguarding issue for them and the horses, it’s only for kids with trauma/confidence issues. I bring this up because it shows that there’s no need for the kids to be shouted at.

DD loved it for the first few sessions but today had a panic attack and refused to go. She revealed that the instructor who does the Thursday sessions (apparently the Tuesday one is lovely) has been picking on her. DD’s ASD make her very matter of fact and she doesn’t lie, she just doesn’t. She was also visibly distressed. Incidents include:

1. They were taught how to take a bridle off the horses and put them away. DD got hers confused and the bridle got all tangled up on the shelf. Instructor yelled “What the hell are you doing to that bridle?????”. Later on DD overhead her talking to another member of staff saying “I don’t know what the fuck x did to this bridle.”

1. They were bringing some ponies in from grazing field into the stables. Instructor told DD to open the gate to let the other kids lead the ponies out. DD struggled to get the gate mechanism open to open (she struggles with fiddly hand things, but can get there with patience). Instructor rolled her eyes and said “fucking hell” under her breath, didn’t help, just stared and watched. DD then panicked and managed to get the gate open but then it swung fully open and the instructor said “Oh nice one yeah, just let all of the horses go free onto the road! Well done!” sarcastically.

1. I was 45 minutes late picking her up one day. It was a complete one off, car trouble and I’d phoned the stables to let them know. There’s a reception to sit in with seating and vending machines, so I assumed DD would just be kept there. Instructor taunted DD repeatedly saying “Well your mum best get here soon because I’m off at 4 and I have to lock the reception so you can’t stay in here.”. This caused DD’s anxiety to skyrocket.

1. Somebody from the family who owns the stables came into the reception when the kids and instructors were there with their baby. Instructor proceed to go over to make a fuss of the baby and some of the girls did too. Baby’s mum was apparently fine with this and was passing baby around to some of the kids and generally encouraging them to pass the baby around themselves. Another girl was about to pass baby to DD and instructor then said “No, you’ve got to give her back!”. I explained to DD that it can be stressful for babies to be passed around like that and maybe it wasn’t personal but DD says the other girls were being encouraged and it was only when she went to have her ‘turn’ with the baby that the instructor went funny. Baby’s mum didn’t appear to have an issue apparently. I’m not sure about this one and whether it really counts as targeted incident but based on the other incidents, I’m suspicious.

1. Yelling at DD during riding lessons and making her do things she doesn’t want to do. DD didn’t want to do a jump and instructor shouted “Oh just get on with it!!!!”. DD ended up having a panic attack on the horse and the instructor did nothing. DD had to get off the horse herself with the instructor yelling at her. Instructor was fuming and told her to go to reception and wait for the others to finish. The woman at reception saw DD come in crying asked what had happened. She was apparently horrified that DD had been made to walk across the premises to reception alone as kids on the programme are meant to be supervised at all times (due to being vulnerable, MAJOR safeguarding issue to have them wandering around alone).

1. One day when I was ill DD’s stepdad took her in his work van. Instructor said to DD “Your stepdad’s work van is an absolute state! Jesus Christ!” and was laughing about it. DD found it weird, and I do too. Completely unnecessary.

I don’t know what to do or who to complain to but I believe DD, she doesn’t lie. Maybe she’s been oversensitive about the baby thing and I’m willing to overlook that but the other incidents I think are just awful
The instructor knows of DD’s diagnosed anxiety and self-esteem issues. I can’t believe an adult is bullying her like this. I’ve met this instructor myself a couple of times and she is in general a very brash, loud personality and tbh hard as nails. I tried not to judge a book by its cover but these incidents have shown she’s not a very nice person. I struggle to believe that she can be in any way qualified for this job. Some of these kids have been through very recent bereavement. I can understand that sometimes when horses are involved an instructor will need to shout to stop a child about to get into a dangerous situation but I don’t feel this applies here.

Haven't RTFT but if it were me, I'd be staying and observing, and calling out any bullying behaviour. Chances are it will be less if you were present anyway.

Hmmm, my experience of the horse world is that this is a particular kind of horse person, and it’s not actually bullying, but that’s just how she is. It’s old school - I recognise so much of it. An older world where part of learning to ride was learning about the complexities of bridles and other gear, and the importance of caring for them properly. And overcoming fears of jumping etc. I was a timid and anxious rider at first, and I think just being challenged to get on with it, try, fail, try again, was great in making me more confident. But I grew up in tougher times.

What you describe isn’t unusual, and I wouldn’t call it bullying. It’s old school and from a time when you just got on with things.

But that said, she’s clearly NOT suitable for the horse therapy situation. perhaps take this angle, rather than the “She’s picking on my child” approach that the word “bullying” suggests.

An older world where part of learning to ride was learning about the complexities of bridles and other gear, and the importance of caring for them properly

absolutely. But you can explain to a child who isn’t familiar with a bridle how to hold and carry it properly, how to cross the throat strap so it doesn’t get tangled etc.

you do not do this:

Instructor yelled “What the hell are you doing to that bridle?????”. Later on DD overhead her talking to another member of staff saying “I don’t know what the fuck x did to this bridle

that absolutely steps over the line from teaching- she didn’t even demonstrate how to do it properly, just yelled and belittled her to a 3rd party.

People like this have no place in teaching children. I don’t care if they are “horsey”. In fact if they genuinely cared about the horse why wouldn’t they show her how to do things properly rather than just yelling.

it is actual bullying.

In my experience the "old-school strict" instructors are actually beloved by kids and really well-respected. They are usually tough but gair though. The meanest angriest instructors at my daughter's yards are actually the young ones.

tough but fair*

And like posters above, I am really surprised they encourange inexperienced riders to jump. That's really weird.

@XelaM.

Actually you’ve described the Tuesday instructor (who DD likes) quite well. I’ve met her briefly as well. She’s in her 50s and is apparently quite strict during the lessons and around the horses but in a constructive, educational way. From what I’ve heard she’s brilliant with the kids on a one to one basis as well.

The bully is late 20s/early 30s

DD likes the Tuesday instructor because she’s a great teacher and makes DD feel competent and responsible. She teaches, she doesn’t belittle. She is strict but in a way that provides education and structure.

Her and the bully are like chalk and cheese.

You pull her out, complain to the horse riding school owners and report to the school. Hope your daughter will be ok

@howler21 Yep, my daughter's favourite instructors are the older strict ones. We are at different yards, but there is one particular young instructor in her 20's who is an actual demon. I don't know wtf her problem is, but she's really nuts even by horsey people standards. My daughter is very immersed in and used to the horsey world (she is quite tough and bitchy herself 😬) but even she switched her lessons to a different instructor.

Some of the responses on this thread are really depressing.

Some horsey women are awful, and definitely not people people (god that's clunky) - but that doesn't excuse the behaviour or the attitude, and these are people who definitely shouldn't be teaching in this sort of environment. Unfortunately, people do often end up in unsuitable jobs.

Some gates are bloody fiddly. I've seen able bodied adults struggle to open certain gates, and I've encountered gates that I have taken my time over despite god knows how many years of horse experience. There's no excuse for the attitude, and struggling with a gate doesn't mean the OP's daughter is unsuitable for this yard.

I've also dropped a bridle and got it mangled and wondered what the fuck I'd done to it - again, despite decades of working with horses. The laws of physics are strange. Shit happens, you don't make out it's the novice kid's fault.

The RDA are a brilliant organisation and they do amazing work, but it's a pretty poor situation if finding an RDA is the OP's only option. Whilst the RDA are the only option in some circumstances for safety / training / equipment reasons, they shouldn't have to be responsible for everyone who doesn't fit into the standard horsey teenager box. As a community, the equestrian world needs to be better at making space for people who need it, rather than just trying to push people out of the mainstream horsey world. For this reason, you should definitely complain about the instructor, because she needs to either do better, or find an alternative role.

Is it just me? My understanding is that OP's daughter is attending a provision specifically for vulnerbale young people who benefit from therapeutic intervention with horses. It it therefore not unreasonable to expect the stables and staff involved to work with a therapeutic ethos? This is very much a thing and as I have said before on this thread, it has made a massive difference to vulnerable young people I have worked with.

Any suggestion of this being 'horsey people' or going and observing is irrelevant. These programmes are advertised as therapeutic, cost a lot of money (although maybe funded if you are lucky enough to get funding) and safeguarding should be paramount. OP's daughter should absolutely not have to leave something that should and will dramatically improve her quality of life and also make a positive difference going forward because the provision is not providing the service it claims it does. It is not riding lessons, this is a stable that says it provides a therapeutic intervention on these days for young people within a strict criteria.

It IS bullying. Singling out a child in a vulnerable position and using your position of power to make them look and feel bad about themselves is bullying. Just because it’s ‘how it is’ doesn’t mean it isn’t bullying. If this woman can’t cope with teaching she needs to let her supervisor or manager know it’s out of her capabilities. Otherwise, her superior needs to know she’s being nasty to vulnerable children she’s being paid to provide a therapeutic activity to. We must not carry on this silly notion of ‘oh it’s just how x is, we just need to our up with it.’

You wouldn’t allow a shop worker to swear at you. You wouldn’t accept it from your boss, or swimming teacher, or cafe worker. So you shouldn’t accept it from a horse riding instructor.

Any suggestion of this being 'horsey people' or going and observing is irrelevant

the therapeutic environment is irrelevant. Yes there may different expectations or further training necessary but bottom line is this woman is a classic bullying bitch who is singling one child out to demonstrate her power and superiority to the other children.

she has no place working with children. She either needs retraining, or if she can’t or won’t change, sacking.

i honestly can’t believe the posters who think this is ok and excuse it. And I can’t believe they think it’s ok to abuse children in this way.

I was generalising - I don't have a horse at the moment but I've finally found a lovely instructor who is harsh but fair where I ride.
Safeguarding seems to be taken very seriously there too and the yard seems a very happy place (with the caveat that they all talk to each other like shit and I couldn't work in that sort of place!)

But if OP went and observed, she would then have first hand experience of what is happening which will help her when she comes to make a complaint. It minimises the possibility of the instructor denying it or claiming it's the DDs word against hers. Completely agree it is unacceptable behaviour and needs to stop.

Did you manage to speak to the yard owner OP?

So update for anybody interested. I ended up speaking to the nice Tuesday instructor who got in touch to ask what was wrong and offered support in getting DD there when I told them DD would no longer be attending the Thursday sessions.

I was very honest and just told her about all of the incdients. Her reaction was exactly what I expected “Well that’s just how Caitlyn is. You just get used to her.” I felt this was completely unacceptable.

I don’t have the energy to fight it really. DD is just going to continue with the Tuesday sessions.

@XelaM

Sounds like a good strategy. Can you choose to pay for only one session?

“Well that’s just how Caitlyn is. You just get used to her.” I felt this was completely unacceptable

it is completely unacceptable.

i hate this. It’s endemic in sport, especially kids sport, it’s no wonder girls in particular don’t stay in these kind of activities past 12

as a coach/instructor I was always told your first aim is to get them to come back. If you don’t do that what’s the point.

i’d report to BHS/LA anyway.

I think you should first talk to the instructor , spell out that DD is sensitive and vulnerable and directly request her to amend her way of handling DD. Give her that chance and she may surprise you. Some blunt rude hard-shell people are hiding a heart of gold. Consider the possibility that she may have some degree of autism herself. IF she agrees to amend the relationship , then get DD to give it a try.

Explain to her that nobody is perfect. DD has some problems; and so does her instructor . They have some common ground. That some people have limited patience, short tempers, and part of growing up, is learning to hold your own when other people are showiung their weaknesses. That there is much more to be learned from this instructor, than how to handle a bridle, a gate and a horse.

You're not wrong - that's a completely rubbish reaction to your complaint. No attempt at all to get the instructor to moderate her approach 🙄

I don't blame you for not wanting to argue with them about it, though.

Very horsey person here and have met on occasion the worst sort of bitches in this environment.

I would report her and I would also accompany your DD to Thursdays lessons. I would keep my distance but make sure the instructor knew that I was watching her every move.

If necessary, I would politely call her out on her disgusting behaviour.

Alternatively try and go on another day when she’s not on duty.

I havent read the full thread but although we use a local stables for equine therapy for the kids I work with, I have NEVER met a horsey type person that I could gel with

I dont know what it is about them,, they seem cold to me