Is this racist?

[ToastedWaffle]

Okay.... so my ex was over at my house tonight to see our kids (he often does this).

Eldest DC was brushing their teeth whilst the same time trying to ask my ex a question.

Because you couldn't make out the words DC was saying with the toothbrush in their mouth, ex then proceeds to imitate the 'sound' saying something like "wah sah wah ha insert random sound here Are you Chinese or something?"

I've just had my arse handed to me by my ex for pointing out it was casually racist and could he not say things like that.

He has kicked up a massive stink which involved shouting, swearing, in which I asked him to leave. Still, the kids overheard him as he was being deliberately loud in shouting at me.

I'm sat here confused as hell.

How would I know? I live in the UK

Maybe get out more then, before speaking of 'undeniable facts' and other nonsense (I don't remember if it was you who said this), but still, you get the idea

I can't think of an example in my particular career (as I'm self employed) where I would be discriminated against for being white but in principle yes

I think IRL, if an actual indecent happened in the workplace or somewhere else, most would find it difficult given the current state of affairs, and that's a problem. I hope true equality is achieved at some point in the future.

Isn't it kind of simple to understand if it's offensive or not?
If someone was saying something incomprehensible and someone else said, you sound like English people, don't you find it offensive?

if an actual indecent happened

I meant incident 😑

The purpose is to help change attitudes and to understand that people don't always appreciate the perspectives of the marginalized. Especially when arguing against stuff like racism/sexism
The problem is that's its not really used to help those who are more vulnerable, uts used to shame white people, trying g to make them feel guilty over something they can't do anything about-born white- and ultimately put them on the defensive.

Initiatives to help those less privileged were in place long before the term 'white privileged came into it and I feel the use of it is doing more damage than good.

It is racist yes and for your ex to flip out like that in front of your children is pretty appalling. Good for you saying something to him, he sounds like hard work.

What is unnecessary about acknowledging privilege? Without acknowledging it you can't
It's unnecessary because uts not the issue. People are not discriminated against because others are privileged, especially when that privilege is not at individual level.

The issue is people not being treated equally. We can't change white privilege, we can change the latter. Acknowledging it makes no difference at all.

If someone was saying something incomprehensible and someone else said, you sound like English people, don't you find it offensive?
According to some people, it's all about the context. It seems that it would be OK if it's a French person because of our history!

People are not discriminated against because others are privileged, especially when that privilege is not at individual level.

Minority races are discriminated against precisely because they aren't the race that has societal privilege.

The issue is people not being treated equally.

Yes and in cases of racism, this inequality is due to the victim's race and the lack of privilege it affords them systemically.

In your keenness to dismiss privilege you're making no sense now and I don't know how you can say things like this in good faith.

I wish you well but I'm bowing out of the conversation with you as I don't think you're open to acknowledging truths that you find uncomfortable.

It wasn't me so, no, I don't get the idea.

If you can't even keep up with who said what, then how do you expect to be taken seriously?

The mental gymnastics and whataboutery attempts to deny racism (both individual and systemic) is laughable really. If only some posters put the same amount of effort in something else,anything else.

What a load of tripe. @youvegottenminuteslynn has explained why you are so very, very wrong. Again.

@mustlovegin

You got the wrong poster, they never said that.

Your post is bizarre: "Maybe get out more instead of saying the thing I'm about to quote that you never said..."

I know! And when you call it out as laughable, you are accused of being happy to hear of white people's heads kicked in.

Incredible isn't it?!

If your kids did what in the playground? No one’s brushing teeth in a playground. Whatever hypothetical situation you have in your head it’s not the OPs situation nor the racist hate speech one I was responding to. I’m getting a bit tired of the since completely different situation X is racism, therefore the OPs situation must also be racism arguments. It’s all false equivalencies and straw man arguments.

Where do I think adults learn to use racist hate speech? Not as kids from trying to talk to a parent while having their mouth full while brushing their teeth and the parent joking “are you Chinese?” in a friendly manner to indicate they could not understand what they were saying. Equally the parent could have said “that was all Greek to me” or “you just spoke double Dutch” to convey the meaning that the kids words were unintelligible to them…and it still would not be racist.

Racist comments require some sort of prejudice or derogatory meaning in them to be considered racist. After all, racism is the belief that your ethnic group is superior to another ethnic group and racist speech and actions are a reflection of that belief. No where in the OPs situation was there any implied or overt denigration of or prejudice against Chinese people. Kids would learn racism from adults saying actual racist (derogatory or prejudicial) things about other ethnic groups.

Well thanks OP, for calling out your ex, for teaching your kids that mocking how someone speaks/looks/acts in a derogatory manner is not OK.

I am of Chinese descent and I do think it was racist and offensive. I will (and have in the past) confronted racists because otherwise they will constantly pick on what they see as the easy targets, to get their racist kicks out. And east Asians are seen as easy targets because usually we don't make a fuss.

@Discovereads

If your kids did what in the playground? No one’s brushing teeth in a playground.

Sigh. Obviously she means making up random, garbled words that they think sound like Chinese. Like a poster upthread who said:

Well my username gives away my heritage.

It was racist and Chinese people themselves tend to be a bit less vocal about racism they endure. But I remember being mocked at school with made up words like that and I don’t like it. Same thing happened to mixed race DS and DD at school.

Why are you skimming over the "wah sah wah ha" part? Is it because that's the bit that's blatantly unacceptable? As has been repeatedly pointed out?

Why are you skimming over the "wah sah wah ha" part? Is it because that's the bit that's blatantly unacceptable? As has been repeatedly pointed out?

According to @Discovereads it's obvious that OP's ex meant to say "wow, sound of wind frog” in Chinese and everyone saying ex was racist are actually the racists.

In your keenness to dismiss privilege you're making no sense now and I don't know how you can say things like this in good faith.I wish you well but I'm bowing out of the conversation with you as I don't think you're open to acknowledging truths that you find uncomfortable
And here we go again. Don't like what others say so let's insult them. Seems to be a common attitude.

Don't try to understand, just bash those who don't sing on the same tune.

Then it ends with the same, talking about facts and truths to shut any conversations.

Okay then but it doesn't make you right -or wrong-.

I already addressed that part pages and pages ago. Had a lovely discussion with a Chinese poster on what that meant in translation. Depending on intonation, there were a few different possibilities. Because “wah sah ha” were actual Chinese words, not “animalistic noises” or “nonsense noises” as some posters tried to suggest they were. So I don’t think it was blatantly unacceptable imho unless you actually think Chinese words do sound like animal noises? Best not go there if I were you.

I think that a spurious attempt to turn a loose transcription of a racist man's pisstaking into something approximating a genuine sentence is… something of a stretch.

Not as kids from trying to talk to a parent while having their mouth full while brushing their teeth and the parent joking “are you Chinese?” in a friendly manner to indicate they could not understand what they were saying. Equally the parent could have said “that was all Greek to me” or “you just spoke double Dutch” to convey the meaning that the kids words were unintelligible to them…and it still would not be racist.

Funnily enough he didn't use Greek,French, Dutch,Italian or whatever other language. If you think that was a coincidence, coupled you the fact you insist he was actually making Chinese sounds, then you're more deluded than I thought. Sadly I don't have the crayons or the meds to help.

Thats not quite accurate. One possible translation is wow, sound of wind, frog. Another posted by @AffronttoBS was wow, sand, stir fried prawns. Without having heard the exact intonation and pronunciation cannot do an exact translation.

I wasn’t claiming the OPs ex is bilingual or anything, merely that he did in fact use actual Chinese words. Therefore, he did not mock Chinese by using animal noises or nonsense noises as other posters have suggested in their outrage.

I also never stated that anyone saying the ex is racist a racist themselves. That is a false accusation.