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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To have a late night / early morning rant about how no sleep is ruining my entire life?

307 replies

Notsleepingandnotcoping · 29/04/2022 01:54

Lying here unable to sleep as have toddler with me. He refuses to go in his cot.

I have a three hour window (you can almost time it to the minute) when he goes to bed where he will sleep. Usually 730-1030. Then he wakes and that’s it.

I can either try to sleep myself then, or get all the other shit done. Either way I’m exhausted but if I sleep I am in chaos. If I don’t I have literally no sleep.

I can’t see friends, have a glass of wine, there is no enjoyment or pleasure in anything at all.

rant and moan and misery, pure misery.

i wish I had never done this.

OP posts:
Brefugee · 29/04/2022 10:27

DB is still a bad sleeper, and he's almost 66. He still gets up and goes for a walk in the early hours pretty often, and sometimes gets stopped by the local police!

my DC is like this. late 20s and still never sleeps through.

Also agree with pp that the way OP talks about herself on this thread is concerning. I hope she's not answering because she's asleep.

Sallycinnamum · 29/04/2022 10:34

My now 13yr old DS was a terrible sleeper as a baby and toddler.

I bought every book on sleep training, cranial osteopathy, the whole shebang. It was absolute torture. I look at photos from that time and I look like I'd aged 10 years.

It was only when I had my second DC who was a dream in comparison I realised my DS was probably a high needs baby.

The only thing that worked in the end was proper sleep training so basically leaving him to cry. It was awful at the time but worked in the end.

Even now as a teenager he doesn't need alot of sleep in comparison to his friends so maybe it's just the way he is.

I hope things get better OP and I know you don't hate him, it's just the desperation speaking.

RiverSkater · 29/04/2022 10:36

Ive been through this and it was a living hell. Still breastfeeding and she latch on all night if she could.

You need to get sleep training. It costs. And you are at your wits end. Is there anybody who can help you do it? That is essential while you are struggling. The hands on help. Where do you live?

RiverSkater · 29/04/2022 10:38

You could start a sleep training thread and get us all on Mumsnet to talk you through it. I've seen it on here!

DonnyBurrito · 29/04/2022 10:43

The issue is your stress. You have too much on. You're taking it out on your son in the night (the source of your torture) which is making you feel like a monster. Then you feel even more stressed for acting like this angry, horrible mummy monster. It is impossible to sleep when you are angry. Impossible. Good, restorative sleep happens when the brain is calm, obviously. You are angry with yourself that you're not coping with something 'millions of families go through' and you're angry and stressed that your work is suffering as a result. You go to work feeling like shit and slip further down into depression. The night comes and the cycle continues.

Based on your other replies, you're not even going to consider doing this... but here goes anyway...

You need to pull him out of nursery and take an extended sebatical from work. The amount you will be paying in nursery fees and wrap around care must be a massive chunk of your wages that can better go towards the upkeep of your home while you are not working. Your DH works and seeing as he works away, he must bring in a decent-ish wage. Your child didn't ask to be born, but now he is here, he needs his mother not to hate him. You and your husband need to stop soldiering on like you have a child that sleeps through. You are having a mental breakdown.

My son is EXACTLY the same as yours, but it is manageable because I am not at work. It's horrible, and hard, but I'm not screaming at my son in the night or posting on mumsnet night after night about how I hate him. I don't have the additional stress of work, but before you think it; no, I'm not well off in the slightest. I live on porridge, beans on toast and everything home made with ingredients from Aldi. We absolutely just scrape by. I don't have support from friends and family, either. But over all, I am happy, and I can see a light at the end of the tunnel. There is no way I could work as my son has the same sleep behaviour as yours.

You need to find a way to stop working. It is too much for you right now. You are unwell. There is financial help available. Get a credit card. Being slightly less well off isn't going to kill you.

Stop this madness and chose yours and your sons happiness. What else is there in life?

Tangled123 · 29/04/2022 10:49

You can’t pour from an empty cup, OP. You need to take some time for yourself. Book some time off work, get signed off sick even, and send your kid to nursery. Have a nap. You’ll feel so much better and more able to tackle his lack of sleeping at night.

Onwards22 · 29/04/2022 10:49

Girl I know used to put her child in the car, pack a flask snack book and blanket. Car drive was sleep inducer for the baby. Once baby was asleep she would park up, chill and sleep herself. Not an answer but a way to get a bit of downtime.

I agree.

Don’t be too hard on yourself trying to do everything the ‘right’ way.

Find a way to sleep even if that means going to sleep as soon as you get home and then waking up during the night.

If you are already rested then it will make sleep training, putting him back in his bed or any other method a lot easier.

Quartz2208 · 29/04/2022 10:54

I think you may well be the poster who it is partly because of coughing - if so you had some good advice there as well that you need to get proper medical advice (from memory you had some that you didnt agree with).

Because actually getting rid of some possibilities may help

How is his sleep set up - is he at a slight angle (which would help for reflux/Gerd) or flat down?

RidingMyBike · 29/04/2022 10:55

Talk to his nursery and ask for help - DD's had advice and support on sleep resources available.

Ring the HV and tell them you're struggling to cope. I know support varies (my area was terrible but still offered sleep clinics for families like this). They can help you work out strategies.

If your DH is away with work this week that probably means he's had a week of lovely sleep in a quiet hotel?! Therefore he's in the perfect position to do something to help this weekend as he's well rested. Arrange to go to a friend for a night or to a cheap hotel. And let him get on with it. I had to strongly encourage mine to do bedtime etc from 3 months onwards when I was away in the evening 'but she'll only settle for you' etc. But now we take it in turns and she's fine for both of us. But you only get to that point by letting him get on with it. Nursery will be able to tell you what they do about settling for naps as clearly he must be capable of sleeping without you there?

And at 18mo they understand a lot - we introduced a groclock at this age and placed a lot of emphasis on being in bed asleep until the sun lights up etc.

EatTheToast · 29/04/2022 10:58

It's so hard OP, I think some kids are just really shit sleepers. I never slept as a kid. My 5yo doesn't sleep. Sometimes nothing works. Have you tried giving in and sending him downstairs in the night to watch TV with your husband to give you a break? Sometimes worked with my DS. You need a breather one way or another. If you moved his bed/cot into your room would he settle next to you rather than in bed with you. Maybe a night in a hotel, yes he'll scream for your DH but your DH could just deal with it for one night. You need a break and a reset to deal with it with a fresh head.

MrsMiddleMother · 29/04/2022 11:01

You say you haven't heard from hv but they don't usually contact you, so go to them and ask for advice. THATS what they can help you with. Or contact your gp for help as 'hating' your child is not a healthy thing. Get some sleep as soon as you get in from work when dh can help or keep at sleep training.

MzHz · 29/04/2022 11:17

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Oh come on! That’s over the line!

SlashBeef · 29/04/2022 11:21

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Bit much...

Lolalovesmarmite · 29/04/2022 11:26

I haven’t read the full thread, so apologies if I am repeating anything that has been said already. I’ve been there with my nearly 2 year old so I know how bleak it feels in the middle of the night when you’re so tired and you can’t see the wood for the trees.

What worked for us was putting a mattress on the floor for him and one for me. I just kept putting him back into bed and telling him it was time to go to sleep. It was a really rough few nights of screaming but we got there eventually. It wasn’t sleep training as such because I was right there with him and would repeat every few minutes that I was here, I loved him and he needed to go to sleep. He used to be all over me all night and I just couldn’t stand it anymore. You have my sympathy and I hope that you find a solution that works for you.

peachgreen · 29/04/2022 11:29

I think you've posted about this before under another name OP, and it seems like nothing has improved. I'm sorry.

You need to get professional help otherwise you are going to end up hurting yourself or your child. I'm not saying that in a judgemental way but as someone else who went through a similar thing (although not as long-lasting) and who knows that lack of sleep is torture and can send you genuinely insane.

It's not for you or for us to say what the professionals will do, but you are at the end of your tether and you can't carry on this way. There are medical interventions for both you and your son which can help - I know this because I had them.

AnxietyLevelMax · 29/04/2022 11:38

oh poor you! Whole post is literally about my situation so I feel you.
Husband never home because of work. 16 months old baby never had one full night of sleep, constantly waking up, tossing and turning while in bed with me so I cant sleep even if he is asleep. During the day he just cries, screams, whinges and wants to be all over all the time and only with me. I work part time atm and it is like a holiday.
I do not have a solution - we even had a sleep consultant involved few months ago but there is always something and we cannot have proper sleep training. Just know I think of you and understand your pain and frustration! I also popped off few times on him and felt terrible afterwards, his tears made me feel like worst mother ever and hunt me every day.
Hang in there! We will go through it, we will get the sleep and time for ourselves eventually! (I hope, my weight, appearance and everything else is down the hill atm)

NeverDropYourMooncup · 29/04/2022 11:38

You do sound very depressed - who wouldn't with so little sleep? - and if you are depressed, you're more likely to want to sleep even more than normal, so this is making your depression worse.

The problem is the rage. It's understandable, it's a physical and emotional reaction to continued sleep deprivation and being continually grabbed at, screamed at and generally being got at when you need sleep. BUT it's also putting you at risk of crossing the line physically with the child. So whether you think it's going to work or not, you're going to have to do something about it other than glare at the expensive books that your child isn't reading.

When he is back, your husband has to take him overnight. You pack yourself off to a Travelodge for two nights. Go there before bedtime so he doesn't wake to find you gone, spend the time sleeping, having very long hot showers, eating in a restaurant, nice food, lots of veg, things that are just for you. Switch your phone off overnight so your husband can't call or message because the child isn't sleeping.

Once you feel vaguely more human again, you'll be in a better place to look at it again.

Is the room dark? Some children are kept awake by nightlights and lights on upstairs. You mention TTLs and ambulances. A proper set of black out curtains will help keep that out. Is your room dark? If not, that could be interfering with his sleep when he does come in. Are you switching on the lights (you mention that) and waking him further/disturbing his sleep/ensuring he's wide awake/stopping him from going back to sleep? Is your husband keeping the lights on when he's taken him and therefore made it a pointless exercise?

You could use noise cancelling headphones or good quality ear filters to wear whilst he takes him for the first half of the night. Just to get a block of three hours, because if you get peace until 10.30pm, you can plan it so you get six hours of not being disturbed before you take over at 1-2am and he then gets his sleep afterwards.

As he usually works from home, perhaps he could adjust the hours he actually works so that he starts a bit later so he could do the night time part until about 4am? That would give you longer to sleep & he'd still get sleep himself. If he's coming into you saying 'he won't sleep, he wants you', that's not happening anymore - the only reason he is allowed to in any way disturb you for that period is if the house is on fire or there is a woman eating Tiger coming up the stairs.

If you see the GP and tell them that you are at breaking point, you might be able to get medication to help you and more help with your child. But they can't help if you decide they can't and never ask them in the first place.

Or, there's the nuclear option where you leave and have 50:50 care. You'll get 3-4 nights of sleep a week that way. If you actually want to, that is - you could choose to be an EOW parent.

Eeksteek · 29/04/2022 11:39

Mine is the same. Had to be in constant contact and it’s in no way cute or restful!

Our biggest problem was more with getting to sleep, so melatonin worked well for us. Night waking occurs, but doesn’t bother me nearly as much. We were given slow release melatonin, but it’s a tablet, so I don’t know if you’d get it into a toddler. You could possibly give him melatonin when he wakes at 10.30, though. It doesn’t have to be at bedtime. I do feel for you. I’ve tried EVERYTHING and nothing worked except melatonin. In the end I got her dogs. She still wakes at night, but is usually happy to cuddle the dogs. Dogs don’t care (and have the cushiest lives ever!). I get to sleep (she’s in with me a couple times of week, but it’s better than multiple night waking every night) Everyone’s happy. Sure, the dogs are an extra responsibility for me in the day but if they do the night shift, I’ll take it over crappy sleep any day.

updownleftrightstart · 29/04/2022 11:41

This was me and my DD. It does sound like you're being dismissive of suggestions - which was also exactly like me. When you are that sleep deprived you can't even think straight and it feels like nothing will work and you don't even know where to start.

Sleep training didn't work at first for our DD either, but I tried again at a later date and it did work. She doesn't sleep perfectly now but is so much better, and as a result I feel so much better. There are a lot of different ways to sleep train, a sleep consultant might be able to assess which would work best for you. I know this is quite an expense but at this stage it's worth it if it will improve your mental health.

I understand you can't sleep through the crying, but when your DH is back home can you go and stay somewhere else for a couple of days? Even if it's family or friends that are some distance away. It might help DS settle without you, and hopefully you will have a couple of days to catch up on much needed sleep.

Then you might feel in a bit better place to be able to try some sleep training.

Dixiechickonhols · 29/04/2022 11:43

You need help Op. Ring your Gp and hv today. There’s obviously a lot going on. You sound ready to snap. You can’t be shouting like that at a toddler.
If you went away for a week or into hospital he would sleep. You need to break cycle.
You have a DH. Does he get a block of leave when he’s back? If yes I’d agree plan of action and go away for a few days. If necessary get professional help from a sleep consultant.

tinierclanger · 29/04/2022 11:44

I think OP is past the point of benefitting from tips from people of white noise, CIO, etc. OP specifically needs real life support and someone to walk her through it. Which is why I recommended a sleep consultant, and despite being shouted at for suggesting spending hundreds of pounds on something she has no faith in, I am going to hammer that point. If you have the money, get a recommendation to someone good. They will be your crutch for this as well as giving you the plan. If it works initially and then stops working as well, you get them back in.

I realise you may not be able to afford it but I’m not really getting the vibe that money is the barrier, more just feeling despairing. When I was at this point I would easily have paid money to get a good nights sleep, and that’s effectively what investing in a sleep consultant did.

Dixiechickonhols · 29/04/2022 11:48

I didn’t want to say it but see other posters have gone there. You do sound on brink of getting physical with him eg throwing him on bed or pushing him away. Not saying you’d deliberately hurt him but snapping in the moment. Please get help.
The safest place for him is a cot in his room. Even if he’s crying he’s safe.

bloomtoperish · 29/04/2022 11:55

I really feel for you, sleep deprivation on this level is absolute torture. I'm still in the process of moving my own child into his room at 4 and a half. At the moment I'm on a mattress on the floor next to him in his room. Before that he had a whole double bed to himself with me on a single bed next to him! It's been a very long slow process and for most of it I haven't had to work so I can't imagine doing that with working too. I hope you find some relief soon.

ForTheLoveOfSleep · 29/04/2022 11:59

SlashBeef · 29/04/2022 11:21

Bit much...

Is it though? This is a toddler who has been co-sleeping (whether OP hates it or not) for his whole life. It's all he knows. It's where he is comfortable. It's where he feels safe. Screaming at him is fucking awful.

My daughter has ASD paired with severe developmental delay and learning disabilities. She is 6 but functioning at around 18months of age. She falls asleep EVERY night in between 00:30 - 02:30. I have to be up at 06:00. She has to be up at 07:00 as do my other two children. NEVER have I screamed at her for this.

Unocard · 29/04/2022 12:02

Here’s what you do -

this weekend you book a travelodge from Friday night to Monday morning. You leave your son with your husband, you give your husband instructions to comfort the child only, he does not pick baby up under any circumstances.

you get a couple of days R&R and hopefully your son gets out of this habit.

yes it sounds harsh, but you need to sleep and it needs to be done.