To have a late night / early morning rant about how no sleep is ruining my entire life?

[Notsleepingandnotcoping]

Lying here unable to sleep as have toddler with me. He refuses to go in his cot.

I have a three hour window (you can almost time it to the minute) when he goes to bed where he will sleep. Usually 730-1030. Then he wakes and that’s it.

I can either try to sleep myself then, or get all the other shit done. Either way I’m exhausted but if I sleep I am in chaos. If I don’t I have literally no sleep.

I can’t see friends, have a glass of wine, there is no enjoyment or pleasure in anything at all.

rant and moan and misery, pure misery.

i wish I had never done this.

This is so sad to read.

Your son needs to be just has happy and settled with your DH as you. Often there is a primary carer but as you both work you should both be equal. Your dh needs to spend more time with your son, more time doing bath, story, milk etc.

Right down a sleep plan that you want to try and stick to it strictly every night. Maybe start with a trip to the GP to check there is no medical reason your son can't, or won't sleep without you in the bed.

Nothing will change until something dreadful happens or he suddenly reaches teenage years.

When you are as tired as you are it is really hard to see past the exhaustion but doing nothing means nothing will change. He is older since you last tried something, who knows it might just work. There are so many reasons I could give you for why he might not be sleeping unless you are there but I can guess your reaction.

I am truly sorry for you and sad for your child but we can't help you until you are ready to try something.

Good luck.

Toddlers years are hard. So much emotions wrapped up in their little bodies.

You have had some great advice re. nurseries etc.

The following suggestions are what helped me dealing with my toddlers especially whilst dealing with their new-born siblings! I have parented four toddlers and survived to tell the tale!

Safety Notes For Cosleeping
I sidecar a cot (with side removed) attached to my king size bed. With gap between cot and bed mattress filled with a dense foam bough from a caravan shop and use co sleeping safe cotton blanket etc. We followed all safe sleeping guidelines.

If you can do it, the big advantage of having the cot attached, is that you can gently roll a kicking toddler into the cot and pop a blanket over them without leaving bed. If they wake up, they can crawl back to you.

1. Afternoon. I established a daily 'quiet time' every afternoon. My older kids could play in their room. The baby and toddler would come to my room, which is child safe. Baby and I would nap. Toddler would usually nap for a while and then play on the floor or bed with the book and toys I left there. This can help you get more rest or sleep.
2. Evening. I would try to put toddler to bed in our bed. If it worked great, if not I would take toddler downstairs and bore them to sleep downstairs. AKA The toddler lies down on the sofa with me. Lights dimmed, no tv. I read book or drink wine until toddler falls asleep.
3. Night. Then lights can be increased and normal evening activates. Watch TV or have a friend around for a catch up. When you go to bed carry toddler to bed with you.

It does get better, but not having enough sleep is tortuous. 😊

OP this sounds awful. As a temporary solution to not being able to sleep when your DS is in the same bed, would you be able to get a large drop side cot so that you can arrange it like a larger version of a co-sleeping cot?

Also, I totally understand the not being able to sleep if you can hear your DS screaming when your DH has him.

I deal with this issue by having soft earplugs in, and then Bose quiet comfort over ear earphones playing white noise on top of that. It's not the most comfortable sleeping with over ear earphones, but that combination of noise cancelling headphones playing white noise and earplugs is sufficient to block out my baby screaming on nights when it's DH's turn.

I appreciate that you primarily wanted to vent with your post, so ignore the above suggestions if they are not relevant, or not going to work for you. Just sharing on the off chance that the things that I have done to deal with similar sleep issues turn out be helpful for you.

I hear you op. My first was the same although his only stint without me was half a hour and then when he was in bed with me woke every hour until he was 2 1/2. My second who’s now 14 months is the same maybe a little easier but I’m used to it I suppose! My first is now 4 and barely wants a cuddle now! I do let my 14 month sleep on me and have worked out a way to sleep but obviously it’s not easy for everyone to do that! I hope you find some solution, be kind to yourself ♥️

That's completely ridiculous

No it isn't! We're talking about an innocent 16month old child ffs!

I've had 3 kids all under the age of 3 and sleep depravation is part of being a Mother!

The OP sounds like she has anger issues which are scaring the kid and could be why the child isn't sleeping properly and on edge all the time!

@Notsleepingandnotcoping I’ve read your posts but not everyone else’s so apologies if I’m duplicating. Does he nap during the day?

I’m sorry you’re going through this, I can’t think of much worse.

I was thinking this. I think kids sleep better at night if they nap in the day whereas my sister would shout at hers to wake up if they went to sleep in the day and she had problems of them sleeping at night. Unless you think the oposite.

Find a recommended Cranial Osteopath.
It changed my & my DDs life. It was pure misery for us, until literally the 1st appointment, & she was 4 years old when I tried. She screamed, Osteo mad e be go outside, she stopped screaming, he did his magic, she slept in the car on the way home (unusual,) then roughly sleeping through the night from that day on
You may be cynical, but what have you got to lose, other than the fee.

How old is he?

sounds like you may need to do some hardcore sleep training.

Set his room up so there’s nothing he can get or destroy. Tie cupboard handles together/remove toys/etc etc. Put a stair gate on the door. He’ll just have to scream. It’ll take probably a week for him to get it. You need to be strong and not crack. Timed intervals. Comfort him but don’t stay in there or let him in your bed.

This can’t go on - you’ll crack. No sleep can’t be good for either of you.

I was in an horrendous state until we sleep trained our twins at 18 months. I wanted to run away and never come back and regularly nearly keeled over in the day.

I agree with the post above. You’ll just have to let him scream until he falls asleep. It’s not ideal, but it’s better than dying through lack of sleep.

I blame heath visitors with their rubbish advice for all these sleep problems with babies and toddlers. If you want them to sleep, you have to get them into a routine from day one - there’s no other way.

I have only read your posts Notsleepingandnotcoping and you say he wakes if you move him into his own bed but what about leaving him in your bed and either making up a bed on the sofa or a spare bed/mattress in his actual bed room or even make up a mattress next door to your bed, even just a single mattress that you can leave your bed when he thrashes around in his sleep and you go and sleep in the alternative bed
if he comes into your new bed and falls asleep you get up and get into the other bed. It might be a case of musical beds throughout the night but It might help with your sleep

I think sleep deprivation just makes everything 10,000 times worse.

At this stage you are looking for sleep. So when your Dh returns can he do a night or even a day with Ds whilst you book yourself into a local hotel just so you get sleep.

it might be a sticking plaster approach but once you have had the nights sleep you can then tackle the stuff that will take longer

Can you get someone in to clean for a few hours even if it is just bathroom, kitchen and your bedroom and they move the stuff around or pile it up in a corner if it is untidy.

I remember the world tilting after 9 weeks with only 2 hours per day sleep. Then
Dd slept through the night and I remember waking the next morning feeling I could tackle anything after just 1 nights sleep.

Or what if you put ds’s bed by the side of your bed
That way he is close to you , he can reach out and touch you but the thrashing around won’t disturb you

Oh no please dont follow “cry it out” method suggested here. Its just horrible. What signal does this send to your child? He wont understand, he will eventually get used to it and of course survive it but it such an awful way.

When your husband is home go and check into a Premier Inn for a night or two. You can go home in the daytime if you want to but you’ll get some sleep and your son will have to fall asleep without you.

Hi,
So sorry to hear you’re having such a bad time. My children are older now but when they were younger one slept well and one slept badly despite me not doing much differently. I haven’t read all of the posts and it sounds like you have tried everything so feel free to ignore….but I wonder about thinking about your relationship with your toddler more broadly. You are clearly exhausted and very cross… is he picking up on this and feeling insecure as a result? So it becomes a cycle of: insecure toddler > needs mummy > mummy doesn’t sleep > grumpy mum > insecure toddler. I have had many a night being kicked by a wriggling toddler who wanted to be with me - and it was virtually always my youngest who had more of a need for attachment and perhaps felt less secure in that attachment. I know it is crappy right now but can you think about how your exhaustion and unhappiness might be making him feel? Kids pick up on these things. Can you think about breaking the cycle in terms of how you interact with him in the day time? Sorry if you know this already or have thought about it. I hope tonight is better x x

@AnxietyLevelMax - This is the sort of nonsense that causes people to have breakdowns. Do you think it’s better for the kid to have a dead mother?

OP, ignore this rubbish and buy some earplugs. He will scream himself to sleep but then feel a lot better for it. And he will probably never do it again.

I’ve been there and I know how you feel. Just some suggestions:

get a white noise app (for you not your son) to drown out the noise. Or get some noise cancelling headphones. Not hearing his crying will massively reduce your stress levels.

also, I found that all the Ferber, reassurance etc. methods didn’t work either. If my child thought I would come back then that encouraged him, so I stopped doing that and let him cry it out until he went to sleep. It worked, he now sleeps through (most of the time).

If you can afford a sick day off work then take one to get some sleep. Or perhaps you could get the doctor to sign you off for a week. It does sound like this is causing you to break down and mental health is a reason to take time off work.

I've been there. Boring advice: sleep training. Not 'I tried it for a couple of nights and it didn't work so I gave up' sleep training, but actual '1-2 week long, strict regime, if one method doesn't work try another' sleep training. I'd have lost my mind without it.

But screaming at a 1yo and hating them night after night is fine? FFS.

@EYProvider it is not a nonsense. I get you dont agree but it is definitely not a nonsense. I am in the same boat as OP. I was also in contact with few sleep consultants and all of them said this is the worst method (which I knew already).
she can leave DS with DH and get some rest but do not follow cry it out method as a method to teach anything or to sleep train! Awful

didnt read everything but do you work op? Does ur child go to the nursery or somewhere? Maybe just take a day or two off and stay home while ur kid is at the nursery and take care of urself, sleep.

@Bornsloppy of course not!

I’m in the same boat but my son is 12 this year! He has autism and is non verbal, he sleeps for 2 hours and will not go back to sleep unless he gets in with me. His doctor has just prescribed Slenyto, it’s a slow release melatonin to help keep him asleep. It’s helped a bit, but he still gets up after 2 hours. I’m going to buy 2 single beds for his room and try sleeping in the same room as him, just to try and get him used to being in bed alone, then once he’s sleeping better, I hope to be able to return to my bed.

Sleep deprivation is all-consuming and horrific. My child now sleeps through but is 7 and I still haven't recovered my own sleep patterns after 4 years of disruption so I massively sympathise.

Turns out a big part of his problem was his ears. Deep-seated infections that he just didn't seem to be bothered by but that meant his hearing was shit and there was a lot of pressure inside his head. So he did exactly what your son does. Went to bed like a dream for a few hours and then was up all fxxing night. Even if he slept, he had to be on top of me and didn't stop moving.

He didn't always have temperatures. He didn't act ill. He was often relentlessly cheerful.

I shouted a lot and cried and hated myself for it. No sleep training worked. He wasn't my first child and all of the others had different techniques that worked for them so this wasn't my first rodeo and i wasn't blinkered in to thinking there was just one solution.

There was just NO SOLUTION.

Until we finally got a referral for his ears and they realised how bad it actually was.

Grommets sorted him out and the change was instant. We still had the usual odd nights like a normal child but it was instant.

Get him checked out if you can, and insist they refer him for stomach/ear/anything. Just get to someone who will work out if there's something physical going on.

Good luck and i am sorry you are going through hell.

Oh @Notsleepingandnotcoping I get you! Our toddlers sound very similar. Mine has woken every 2/3 hours without fail since birth, regularly much more frequently than that. It has been absolutely awful, sleep deprivation has taken me to some very dark places, and why wouldn't it, its basic biology - we need sleep to function. We are under the sleep specialists, have tried every form of training etc going (bar cry it out) but still he wakes. I won't patronise you with advice but here's some things that make it a tad more bareable:

• Cutting his nap so he goes to sleep around 6.30/7pm, I get ready for bed same.time as him so I can go straight to sleep myself as soon as he's down.

• he sleeps on a single mattress so I can get in with him to settle him, then I roll away, either to another single bed in his room or my own bed if I'm feeling brave

• next to his bed I've set up a 'nest' where I sit to settle him if I don't get in so at least I'm warm and comfortable

• take it in turns with DH to be responsible for him from 5am so at least there's a block of sleep 5-7am (later on a weekend) I can cling on to regardless of how hard the night has been.

-on a really bad night DH and I take 2 hourly shifts to sit up with him, we take a cup of tea and I scroll Mumsnet, I find this easier to deal with than trying to sleep but not being able to. I also scroll photos of him so I don't get into a negative headspace towards him

It's rough, sending hugs x

I understand when you say sleep training doesn't work. With my DD there was no way she was sleeping without me from day 1. It didn't matter what I did she would not sleep in her cot. She ended up sleeping with me in my bed until 4 years old. She would pinch my nipples all night :/. Then she moved into her own bed one night at 4 years old and sleeps through like a dream. It is so hard though.

It does sound like he is missing you at nursery all day and that could be a reason for his clinginess at night, especially if he feels you pushing him away. Could you try spending some intense one on one time with him in an evening after nursery? Even if its only 15 mins / half an hour? Doing an activity where he has your full undivided attention every day may give him that reassurance to not be so clingy. If you resign yourself to sleeping in bed with him for now until he settles is there a way to make this more comfortable for you both so you get some sleep?