To ask why having an elective C-Section is so frowned upon?

[Rosesandbutterflys]

I am (hopefully) having an elective C-Section soon. First baby, don't want anymore children after.

I've always had a fear of child birth, which over the past 5 years has been compounded by a lot of people around me having children and the vast majority of these (though I appreciate I'm probably unlucky here) have been pretty traumatic births that have ended in severe tears, forceps and a lot of the time, an emergency section anyway. Granted their experiences have mostly been better on their second birth/ child.

Nothing and I truly mean nothing about natural childbirth/ labour appeals to me. Not the hours of pain, pushing, potential rips/ tears, forcep intervention, epidural (yes I appreciate I'd have one of these for a section), damage of my pelvic floor and the panic and stress of potentially having to be rushed to theatre because it just wasn't going to happen naturally and the baby is in distress or whatever.

Now don't get me wrong, nothing about a c-section appeals to me either, it's absolutely no walk in the park and I'm dreading it, but it has to come out some way and I am a person that likes to plan things and to somewhat be in control/ aware of the plan. I have also had abdominal surgery before (though not as severe as a C-section) and I know recovery is likely to be painful and slower than if I were to have a natural birth. But for me, this is the preferred/ lesser of the 2 evils option.

I have also spent hours pouring over research as to the benefits of a vaginal birth over a c-section and last night came across a NICE/ NHS study/ research that found that actually, for a planned/ elective c-section, the risk to the mother of a c-section compared to a vaginal birth is pretty much the same. It states that the risk of the baby ending up in NICU with a C-section is 13.9% compared to a vaginal birth which is 6.3%, so double the risk, BUT it says the research does not take into account the fact that most c-sections undertaken are for medical reasons and therefore the likelihood of the baby needing NICU attention after it's born is increased anyway.

It then went on to say that the risks of an unplanned, emergency C-Section are a lot higher than a natural birth/ elective/ planned C-Section. So I guess if each woman was guaranteed to have a straightforward, natural birth, then great, but a lot of women do end up needing an emergency c-section so, technically they are more at risk than someone who has chosen an elective.

This now seems like I am bashing natural delivery and I'm not at all I totally admire and respect women that chose that route, I only wish I were that brave.

However, the responses I have had from people my whole pregnancy when I have admitted I am opting for an elective C-section have been ridiculous. Not one person has responded positively, all I've had is 'Oh, really? Are you sure??' and 'Oh, why on earth would you elect to have that?' etc etc. Or just a stony faced, tight smile and 'oh right' making it clear they disapprove but not actually coming out and saying it.

I got told last night that the reason I'm getting these reactions is because a C-section is 'taking the easy way out '😕

If that's the case, why on earth wouldn't you? Why is it that it seems the prerequisite to being a good mother is seemingly having to martyr yourself all the time?

So many of my friends that have had children and also the women in my NCT class who are preparing for their births have all expressed dismay/ distress at having to have any pain relief, they all want it to be as natural as possible and I know my friends that haven't had 'textbook' births still harbour 'guilt' and sadness to this day. Why? If you need gas and air or an epidural, so what? What exactly am I missing? If they ended/end up with forceps or an emergency section, it's not their fault, it's just one of those things. Surely modern medicine has provided these things to make childbirth safer?

Anyway, gone off on a tangent now but if you disapprove of someone having an elective c-section, could you tell me why?

I don't know what hospital would let you go home after 2 days.
Croydon Hospital did after my C section if you want names. I was ready and it was fine.

If only you could know what kind of birth you were going to have!!

Am currently also having to make this decision as there's some risk factors that mean a natural birth may be higher risk.

So much unknown, I don't know how to manage the worry of either choice as until it's over you have no idea if it was the right one or how it's going to go....

Is there an equivalent page on the risks of a vaginal birth I wonder?

Not Croydon, but home 2 days after C-section. I was desperate to get home, I'd been in for much longer before the birth. I think it's pretty standard unless the baby needs longer.

Well, personally I certainly don't subscribe to the whole "natural" blablabla that apparently is so in fashion. Sign me up for all the pain relief available.

I didn't want a CS because of the harder recovery and I didn't want the scar (my mother's CS scar is pretty ugly).

I don't think it's my place to "approve" or "disapprove" of another person's medical decisions. I might be concerned if it didn't sound like the person was properly informed of the risks of either procedure (I gave birth in a country where ELCS are massively encouraged and one woman who chose this didn't know she could have opted for an epidural to manage the pain).

In your case though, assuming my opinion matters to you, it sounds like you're well informed of the avantages/risks so I wouldn't presume to judge your choice.

If people ask just say you're not sure yet - this way you're not really lying but not having to justify anything.

I was Aberdeen Maternity Hospital. Emergency section at 4.52am Saturday, discharged midday on Sunday.

I don’t agree with elective c sections on the NHS unless they are medically indicated because the NHS rarely offers treatment choices for actual illnesses and injuries so I can’t see why it needs to do it for labour when it’s a choice to be pregnant.

It just doesn’t seem fair to me. In an ideal world we’d all be able to take the medical options that suited us best instead of what was quicker and easier, but we don’t. Choices cost money, so if you want to have an operation instead of giving birth then that’s a fair choice, but pay for it yourself.

@MassiveSalad22

which one?

also it’s not all about what is best for the baby. It’s about what’s best for the woman too. I would choose to prioritise my perineum over the baby’s serenity any day

There doesn’t need to be an equivalent page for vaginal births because once the pregnancy exists, the risks of vaginal birth already exist too. The baby has to come out somehow so risk isn’t being added to anything by ‘choosing’ a vaginal birth. Risk is being added by choosing a c section when there is no physical need for it.

It would be more useful to compare traumatic vaginal births to emergency c sections because of the times it would be better to have the operation instead of extreme tearing/forceps etc and it could be an option offered earlier in labour.

However, the safest option if your a healthy woman/pregnancy/baby is a natural birth..and thats just pure fact.

I mean it’s not literally a fact though due to how many women or babies die in childbirth, never mind how many more would die without ‘unnatural’ modern medicine stepping and getting the baby out via EMCS.

A natural birth is not the safest option for quite a lot of women and babies.

I entirely agree with you @BogRollBOGOF . I couldn’t have explained it better myself

It's not the easy option. I'm 7 days post section and I'm in pieces. The recovery is taking ages and they grazed a nerve putting the spinal in so my legs aren't working great at the moment. I've been put on heavy duty painkillers and had to stop breastfeeding because of them. It's not a walk in the park. This was a planned section as my first was an emergency. No way of giving birth is without pain, just usually a natural birth the pain is upfront and with a section it's in recovery. My actual "birth" was painless, 10 minutes and I had my beautiful boy. I don't subscribe to any shaming of c sections cos they're fucking horrific. As are many natural births. Just as well they are worth it for the end result. That said, never again!

Risk is being added by choosing a c section when there is no physical need for it.

This is a worthless generalisation. Some risks are being added by choosing ELCS and some are being reduced or eradicated altogether. The extent of both will depend on the circumstances.

Choices cost money, so if you want to have an operation instead of giving birth then that’s a fair choice, but pay for it yourself.

What about if you're higher risk and going to need very extensive support in labour, more than would be needed for an ELCS? Should you pay then?

I haven't RTFT but my elective was AMAZING.
I cried, it was beautiful.

Recovery was fine also, I appreciate that's luck & a supportive DH.

Top tips - don't take the codine if you can help it, drink lots of prune juice. First poo after the birth was waaaaay worse than any section problems 😖

I got told last night that the reason I'm getting these reactions is because a C-section is 'taking the easy way out '😕

Don’t tell people your plans. And if they ask, either tell them it’s none of their business or if you’re not confrontational, just avoid the question.

I had an elective C-section. I didn’t tell anyone but my H wen round telling every fucker, and the bloody date. So I got inundated. I nearly killed him.

Anyway, people are judgmental about everything. The best thing to do is adopt serene smile and perfect the act of not giving a fuck. It pisses them off the most.

Also I had an elective as I too wanted no part of natural childbirth. It was textbook and while not quite a walk in the park, it was so straightforward. I was driving after a couple of weeks and forgot about it soon after.

What about if you're higher risk and going to need very extensive support in labour, more than would be needed for an ELCS? Should you pay then?

If you’re high risk then then there’s a physical, medical reason to have an ELCS, so no, of course you shouldn’t pay.

Although I do think there’s an argument for the NHS charging a flat rate to parents for every live birth, but that’s a whole other thread.

It’s the Labours of Eve. The belief that women are born to suffer.

I had a VB with my eldest and an ELCS for my second. My VB definitely cost the taxpayer much more than my ELCS - several surgical repairs, a year of physiotherapy, countless gynae appointments. My ELCS was so much easier and the recovery was a walk in the park, particularly in comparison to my VB. My second child was a far happier and more settled baby too, which may be coincidence of course.

I felt there was an unspoken (and sometimes spoken) sentiment from all the medical professionals - and other people - I spoke to about it second time round that I’d somehow ‘earned’ my Caesarean section. I’d suffered enough and they could let me off second time.

Just to be clear, I was asking about higher risk women who choose to attempt vaginal birth, even in the knowledge that it'll be very resource intensive.

The NHS rarely offers treatment choices? Bullshit. They do, all the time, where there are two appropriate options. For my vaginal birth induced prolapse (which obviously who cares about because birth injuries are just something women should shut up about lest they cost the NHS money), I was offered various treatments, one of which was surgery. There were a range of suitable options and the NHS tries to treat patients with respect and autonomy, so discussed them with me.

a caesarean only isn’t “medically indicated” if you believe that women suffering catastrophic birth injuries with a lasting impact on their health is unimportant. This whole “it isn’t medically indicated” is part of the misogynistic bullshit which tried to undermine women’s birth choices and led to the tragedies we see in the Ockenden report, as well as countless more women whose babies thankfully were born alive but they were left with distressing injuries and other after effects.

The fact you don’t think the NHS needs to provide info on the risks of vaginal birth speaks volumes, as does your view that you “can’t see why” women’s autonomy, health and well-being matters. Your views on this are repugnant.

My pregnancy complication comes with a heightened risk of still birth. Last time I was induced at 38+2 and she wasn’t ready, failed induction resulting in an emergency section.

same thing has happened this time so you can bet your life I’m taking the elective. Why would I risk a natural delivery and losing my baby?

people are just rude for no apparent reason.

Although I do think there’s an argument for the NHS charging a flat rate to parents for every live birth, but that’s a whole other thread.

Please start that thread - I would really like to hear this argument.

Be happy with your own decision OP and fuck anyone else's shitty judgements.
I think it's great that women get more of a choice these days and if some choose elective CS then good for them. It shouldn't matter how a baby makes their entrance in the world and certainly not looked down on.
I've given birth vaginally 4x no problems with the actual births, no forceps, stitches etc....I was very very lucky but it's still quite a traumatising experience and often brutal!
IF I was to have another baby some 20 odd years after the birth of my last full term child never happening then I would be tempted to consider an ECS. The biggest thing that may put me off would be recovery time but, that said, I couldn't guarantee another good vaginal birth so still could be in for a longer recovery after delivering my hypothetical baby.
My sister needed an EmCS with her 1st and was quite unwell afterwards during her healing. She had a vaginal birth the 2nd time and swears if she ever had another she'd prefer a section.

So yeah, hold your head up high OP. Other people's opinions don't matter.
Hope you have a lovely birth.

I don’t think elective c-sections should be available on the NHS…your body is designed to give birth. If there’s medical reason, sure, but it’s a big cop out and waste of resources to allow people elective c-sections. Probably an unpopular opinion, sure, but if you’re scared of childbirth, don’t have children.

My child would potentially have died without an elective c section and so could I. Elective doesn't mean chosen for a jolly.

you surely can’t be so dumb as to actually mean that?

placenta previa, breech, multiples, pph risk, previous 3rd and 4th degree tears, pre eclampsia, the list goes on…

You think they should ALL have to have a natural birth?