To not feel sorry for Amber Heard even in light of evidence

[Wheresmywoolyjumpers]

I always loved Johnny Depp. Was really wanting to take his side, but the evidence being presented is making that impossible for me. But as much as I want to support women, I cannot warm to Amber Heard. is it patriarchal brainwashing? Is it that they both seem spoiled and behaving badly? Or something else?

And every grown woman knows better than to deliberately bait a nasty drunk.

yep always the woman’s fault eh?! Poor menz cannot be held account for their actions can they? She deserved what was coming to her. Blah blah. Do some people actually think like this?!! FFS!!

Probably some truth from both, some exaggeration or twisting the truth from both. It just all seems very tragic and a shame they couldn't just walk away as there seems fault on both sides and they were obviously poison to each other.

Of course he might not be admitting to physical abuse as he might not have done it but he certainly doesn't look like he'd be easy to live with but then she was goading him. Hard to work out what went on.

I can't say I warm to either of them, I've heard of him but wouldn't have recognised him before this and I'd never even heard of her. Is she an actress?

I don't think we will ever know.

He must have real proof and probably his own dialogue of texts from Amber heard which will come out when it's her turn to be interviewed to have taken it this far.

his libel case against the Mail didn't go in his favour, so I'm not sure I'd be so confident about this

But do we know he hit her? Is there actual evidence? I don't think I'd automatically believe either of them without evidence, they are so caught up in hate and proving they are right I wouldn't truth what they said.

I’ve been watching the case since last week (I know I need it get a life😅) and spotted something on Johnny’s psychological diagnostic papers. The man is suffering from BPD and most likely has been since youth as it stems from psychological abuse at a young age. Whilst they certainly can have multiple psychotic episodes if under a lot of stress, people who have BPD are not monsters, they require gentle treatments in relationships and gentle conflict solutions. If Amber had any care for Johnny she would’ve called his psychologist during that breakdown that we heard the recording of at the end. The things that she was saying in the recording might make sense to a person who has never lived with someone with BPD but hearing it, I know it was just fuelling the fire, you can even tell it was. She was purposely taking advantage of the breakdown “loop” he was stuck in instead of taking action to end the episode.

it absolutely isn’t ANYONES job to take care of anyone, but she married him - which means that she KNEW that this was a part of him and they most likely had multiple conversations about how to deal in breakdown situations.

(coming from someone who’s happily in a relationship with BPD person, you can’t cure anyone’s BPD but it’s certainly VERY possible to live a normal, happy and calm life together with a few conflict approach adjustments and plenty of communication)

I was called "evil" the other day for expressing an opinion to this post on sm -
^"Women abuse men too.
This person is absolutely evil.
I hope she gets everything she deserves"^

The above was written by an apparent survivor of DA, which I am too. My opinion is there's abuse on both sides (AH + JD) and they've both behaved horribly. Then told that my feminism is getting in the way of me seeing clearly. And told I was thick. Basically, if I'm not joining in with the two minutes hate for AH then I'm evil + stupid.

The media seems hell-bent on manufacturing hatred for women atm (even more than usual) and everybody's thinking has become so blinkered. We're encouraged to ostricise/shame those who question the media's narrative. Western society's become frighteningly intolerent and totalitarian.

She's proven what a bad actor she is.

Dreadful woman.

See, I'm no armchair psychologist. I just saw violent behaviour like what my ex dispalyed when drunk or high.
Silly me to have been scared - if I'd have cared for him I would have rung his psychologist.
I mean....wtf?🙄

@GeidiPrimes

I totally agree with everything you say here. Being called evil for not joining in this hate compaign towards AH is despicable.

Sending solidarity to you

@AndAsIfByMagic

And he isn’t??

Didn't Vanessa Paradis come out and say that he was a good guy in the London libel case? I feel sorry for her, and her kids.

My understanding of the whole lawsuit against her is they both signed a NDA when they signed off on the divorce saying they wouldn't talk about the other. She has breached this by writing the op-ed in Washington Post therefore defamed his character. Whether its true or not she still breeched the agreement why do we need to go through all the mudslinging it just makes a mockery of the whole thing!

They are both awful and in need of significant therapy.

The ‘mutual abuse’ line… yuk.

The thread was about Amber Heard. I responded. Start one about Johnny Depp and I may respond to that.

Whataboutery at its finest.

The media seems hell-bent on manufacturing hatred for women atm (even more than usual) and everybody's thinking has become so blinkered. We're encouraged to ostricise/shame those who question the media's narrative. Western society's become frighteningly intolerent and totalitarian.

100%

@Lesperance

Thats means nothing. Just because he was a “good guy” to her, doesn’t mean he was a good guy to Amber. Bit like in the same way a rapist doesn’t rape every woman he comes across.

@AndAsIfByMagic

its not whataboutery at all. It’s the simple fact that in this instance it’s very difficult to talk about one without talking about the other. Since their relationship and behaviour towards each other is what this is all about.

So Ambers case against Johnny so far seems to be that he was abusive towards her. I have no doubt he was a shitty partner.

Her side: He is a man that has called her a cunt and said horrible things about her to other people, this is not in any way proof that he did abuse her, he has a dick behind her back with no intention of her ever hearing but it could be implied that he was likely to say it to her face if he said if behind her back. A video of her walking through a room where Johnny was having a drunken breakdown, she sets up the camera and he’s hitting things and being aggressive, then she walks out of the room after he’s seen the camera and snorts a little. Also lots of evidence of him being on drugs/cocaine. As well as an audio of him throwing up during rehab. The last thing they presented was a garbled audio of her telling him not to cut himself and mumbling from him.

His side: She has admitted to hitting him. He and other witnesses claim that she threw a bottle at him and it sliced/crushed his finger off. She has also admitted to throwing bottles towards him. There are photos of shit on the bed with claims that it’s hers.

A lot of what I have heard from ambers side is audio recording at times where you just wouldn’t record. Like him throwing up or him about to cut himself. Who does that? Honestly that’s why Depps side I think is so much more believable. His behaviour lines up with his story: he was an addict, he had a shit upbringing and stayed because his dad did that as a child. Much of the ‘evidence’ from amber proves nothing, even the texts are not proof. The worst thing is the recording of him kicking cabinets where he never touched her. Similarly, Depp has not shown all that much evidence against amber it’s almost all speculation. Which is why depp has a case against her. She broke the agreement to keep quiet and didn’t have any justification for it. They were both terrible in this relationship and it should never have happened. He would have let the ‘I hit you’ tape disappear and the severed finger incident go away.

They probably both feel like the victim here, and it’s not all that unjustified.

Thank you @SafeMove

It's sometimes easier to accuse a person you disagree with of victim-blaming than to accept the complicated reality of life, which I suspect is where Nippy was going with her pass-agg "oh dear" ...

My abuser was never physical (which made the threat to kill me even more frightening, in an odd & hard to explain way). It's been 15 years since I escaped with an injunction & my life. I'm no shrinking violet, but had the misfortune to accidentally hear his voice on the other end of my DD's phone call with him over xmas - I had to leave so I could cope with the instant plummet back into the fear & misery response outside, & not distress DD with it.

If someone had been beating you black & blusher blue - the last thing you'd do is film them as you challenged their morning booze consumption. Or wind them up by sneering at their masculinity, or shit in their bed. These are not the actions of the long-term DV victim - their strength tends to lie elsewhere - in coping, deflecting, minimising, & facilitating 'peace' at all costs.

That doesn't mean I don't think Depp was never violent. I'm pretty sure he was - see everything @Midlifemusings wrote - but maybe no more so than Heard. Which is still no excuse, because he could have seriously damaged or killed that waif-like person in 5 seconds flat, wheareas her violence was less likely to present immediate danger to him.

Interestingly (although very unpleasant for its OP) there's another thread today, where the OP is being stalked & harrassed by a man who has chosen to intimidate her by staring at her house for 10 minutes every day. Because the police (wrongly) told her no crime had been committed & refused to help, she spoke to them about getting evidence herself. She planned to approach him with her phone ready, & ask him why he was staring at her house every day & would he please stop, while she filmed his response.
The police didn't just rubbish her, the fuckers totally DARVO'd her - saying that she couldn't possibly be scared if she was prepared to talk to the man, so was obviously looking to goad him & was attention-seeking by reporting him.
(Shockingly, it was a WPC doing the DARVO'ing.)

So there's no way I'm saying that filming a dispute = the filmer is guilty & the disputing party automatically innocent. In this stalker incident, the OP is clearly an innocent victim (& I hope very soon a relieved survivor).
In Heard's case ... not so much. Because she's a victim AND a perpetrator. Shit happens.

Comments like "she doesn't strike me as a victim", "I can't warm to her", and "she's an awful person" illustrate the point, though

I agree. It reminds me of a guy on my counselling course who told me the man he had seen in his voluntary placement, didn’t seem like a criminal. I asked him what criminals ‘seem’ like? It’s irrelevant how people look, how they come across or how likeable they might be, when it comes to abuse. Or anything else really. It’s hard to know who is an abuser just from what we read in the papers. I guess the jury will be able to come to the right verdict . They both sound like total nightmares but without knowing the full details I can’t work out if one of them was the instigator.

I listened to tapes yearscago and thought she was just yelling at him. She had point. Just rage. So even before he sued for defamation, i thought she was a rageful narc.

Not sure if his character has been defamed by her and her alone tho. He took drugs, left a loyal partner of 2 decades+ for a much younger woman. And married her! Not on a par with abuse of course but he contributed to his own worsening image

I didnt know she p000d in his bed. Wow.

I just don't believe anything she says.

She is disgusting. The video she took of him she was baring him for a reaction and knew exactly what she wanted. Obviously didn’t get what she really wanted from it.
the two of them are toxic but she is absolutely disgusting. Not mentally stable at all.

They both seem horrendous to be honest.

Bating him