To be shocked by how blasé alot of MNers are about abortion

[Nothanksloveimfine]

Yes its healthcare, yes free and safe abortion is completely necessary because the alternative doesn't bare thinking about, yes everybody has a right to choose what's best for them and yes I am pro choice (whilst being explicitly pro life with regards to my own pregnancies)

With all that said and done, I am quite alarmed at how a sizable % of MNers are so blase about abortions. Whenever a poster is talking about being pregnant with an unplanned baby and in a less than perfect situation, I see alot of posters urging her to just have a termination like its a routine stroll through the park.

I've just read a heartbreaking article which is being discussed at the minute and some of the replies on that thread are so cold. It made me cry and I'm wondering how the hell people can read that and not be impacted by it, completely steamrolling over the tragic loss of life by saying things like "that's a rare case" abortion is a good thing bla bla bla.

Does anybody else share my view or am I the odd one out?

It's like people are so determined to bang the "right to abort" drum, they have no regard for the babies whatsoever.

Abortion can be totally necessary but it's also pretty sad IMO.

You can care about the mother without being so cold and dismissive of the baby they were carrying.

Caring about the babies doesn't mean I hate women, I am one.

Yes I've name changed because I don't expect this will go down well here.

The proportion of abortions that are performed at under 10 weeks has continued to increase since 2010. In 2020, 88% of abortions were performed under 10 weeks, increasing from 82% in 2019 and 77% in 2010. In comparison, abortions performed at 10-12 weeks decreased from 9% in 2019 to 6% in 2020. The percentage performed at 20 weeks and over decreased from 2% in 2019 to 1% in 2020. (Table 3a.iii).

The legal limit for a woman having an abortion is 24 weeks gestation. This is the point at which the fetus is viable outside the mother's body. Abortions may be performed after 24 weeks in certain circumstances, for example, if the mother's life is at risk or the child would be born severely disabled. Abortions where gestation is 24 weeks or over account for a very small number of abortions (0.1% of the total). There were 236 such abortions in 2020. (Table 5).

Thisi is from the UK Government statistics, for anyone still spouting the nonsense that people go skipping merrily off to abort a baby at 39+6 or anything over 37 weeks.

www.gov.uk/government/statistics/abortion-statistics-for-england-and-wales-2020/abortion-statistics-england-and-wales-2020#introduction

Each of those 236 cases has a heartbreaking story behind it in all probability.

As for you, OP, yeah we finally got to the crux when you said that people would have told you to abort your son. First of all, if we had the power to actually change physical things via typing into a text box on the internet, the world would be a far more "interesting" place, no? (i do understand that words have power though, and that a vulnerable woman might infer that people telling her that abortion is a choice are actually telling her to get an abortion - that is a whole other discussion)

There are many many reasons a woman might not want to go through with a pregnancy, and there are many many reasons why a woman in exactly the same position would. What we ought to be doing is a) giving both women the information (and yes advice if they can't get it anywhere else) they need and b) making society much more supportive of people who find themselves in difficult situations (including but not restricted to: drug use, poverty, abuse, abandonment by the father etc)

In the meantime, it should still be legal, accessible and free.

I agree @Nothanksloveimfine x
I was horrified to read about the 30 week baby aborted. There are many sad stories like this regarding abortion. A lump of cells is a lot different to a fully formed baby and some people are simply cold. Some countries you can abort even full term and it's horrific!

@MrsTerryPratchett

OP in case this isn't goady, have a Google of the Overton window.

There's an issue when the mainstream discourse is 'abortion is desperately sad' rather than 'abortion is needed healthcare and should be free and available'. Because the window moves and if the mainstream moves, so do the extremes and no one wants to be the American Christian Right. You are moving the window.

The 'cold' women are trying to move it back and preserve women's rights.

^^This.

OP, you're not pro-choice. You're against abortion, but know it's not socially acceptable to say so as a blanket absolute. So you nudge, emotively, to manipulate the norm to where you wish it to be.

Me? I'm on the side of the Earth. Which doesn't need a single added human life. Our species is killing this planet and every living thing on it. I value all those lives. So I'd rather the conversation swing far in the opposite direction to you. Steadfast, undiluted support for the right to choose is a bare minimum for me.

@Thisismynamenow

You say blasé, other people say pro-choice.

No one is every pressuring the OP's I to termination. They're reminded them it's OK to consider it as an option..

It's not a baby until the female decides it is, until then it's an embryo or a fetus, which is essentially a bunch of cells which once fully grown and delivered becomes a baby. Its only referred to as a baby before delivery when the female decides to continue with the pregnancy.

It's not a baby until the female decides it is, until then it's an embryo or a fetus, which is essentially a bunch of cells which once fully grown and delivered becomes a baby. Its only referred to as a baby before delivery when the female decides to continue with the pregnancy

That's got to be the most dodgy and problematic logic I've ever heard.

Some of the responses on this thread are truly dreadful!
@TalkingCat what a dispicable thing to say!

You are adding a foul little drip of judgement to the discussion

Oh judgement you say, like the posters we see on a daily basis who hiss "why would you have children with this man" to an already upset OP.

Or the posters who tell OP's that terminating their pregnancy is the right thing to do and they would be mad to go ahead with it?

As I said I respect a woman's right to choose.

What I don't respect, is a bunch of strangers on the Internet trying to guilt somebody into believing they should have a termination because:

The dads a shit
They don't have an extra bedroom
They're not particularly well off
They were an unwitting OW
(Insert whatever else here)

Are those posters, many of which I assume are on this thread, going to support the OP beyond a flower emoji after the fact, I doubt that very much.

@AskingforaBaskin

To me it would be the same as having a mole removed. A mass of unwanted cells that could or would cause harm if not dealt with.

Exactly!

sorry, meant to post this from the WHO

Key facts
--Abortion is a common health intervention. It is safe when carried out using a method recommended by WHO, appropriate to the pregnancy duration and by someone with the necessary skills.

• Six out of 10 of all unintended pregnancies end in an induced abortion.
• Around 45% of all abortions are unsafe, of which 97% take place in developing countries.
• Unsafe abortion is a leading – but preventable – cause of maternal deaths and morbidities. It can lead to physical and mental health complications and social and financial burdens for women, communities and health systems.
• Lack of access to safe, timely, affordable and respectful abortion care is a critical public health and human rights issue.

Just adding another voice - not everyone is sad about an abortion. Not everyone sees an embryo as 'a baby'.

You're welcome to feel sad about it, but you can keep your emotive stuff to yourself - nobody is required to view it through the same lens as you.

I think its a good thing people can openly suggest abortion. Its not something to be ashamed of and kept secret anymore which is great and if more people who had no money, no room, in abusive relationships etc had abortions the world would be a better place and we're all more aware of things like that, instead of 'aww a baby' .

Ok got it. Many of you are only pro-choice if no one ever talks about it or reminds a woman that she has options and the right to have control over her body and her life.

What I don't respect, is a bunch of strangers on the Internet trying to guilt somebody into believing they should have a termination because:

The dads a shit
They don't have an extra bedroom
They're not particularly well off
They were an unwitting OW
(Insert whatever else here)

Are those posters, many of which I assume are on this thread, going to support the OP beyond a flower emoji after the fact, I doubt that very much

Well said op!

You know what, OP, I actually judge you more than anyone else.

You think of this as a baby, a child, and you're happy for someone to have the choice to terminate that life, as long as it provokes an emotional reaction? That's pretty sick.

Someone who does not consider it anything other than cells, I can understand how they're pro-choice.

I am pro choice. I'd not heard the experience until now - early as possible, late as needed, but that exactly sums up my view.

The idea that women should feel sadness to be going about it the "right" way? They may feel desolate, but that's not your call.

@bluebellsandcustard

From my perspective it's because people are so sickened by cases of child cruelty and avoidable deaths that they'd rather the women have a choice to terminate the pregnancy if it's not wanted.

I can't bear the thought of an unwanted child!

People who don’t want to keep their full term baby give up their full term baby. People who are monsters choose to keep, raise, and abuse their child because it gives them a sense of power or even a sick thrill. These people enjoy showing off their kid on social media etc

They are not victims that couldn’t access abortion. They are the worst of humanity and their actions do not justify posters frivolous attitudes towards safe healthcare for women. Women would be having safer abortion with more psychological support if garbage like this wasn’t brought into the debate

@Nothanksloveimfine, if you seriously think women trot off and have an abortion - nay, do anything - because some faceless randoms on the internet told them to, you are deluded.

We can all see this thread for exactly what it is.

There is so much emotive language about abortion, and strong feelings about how terrible it must be to have to have one, that it's a nice respite to have some people discuss it as a straight forward option. I can see how it could be perceived as "cold", but I think some women will be wanting permission to consider it and it is more likely they will give themselves that permission if its discussed in a non-emotive straight choice manner.

Plus - what difference does it make? Person X has an abortion and feels it was the right choice but is traumatised by it. Person B has one and views it as a necessary medical procedure. Same outcome, but one has a load of extra suffering!

Abortion needs to be more normalised. Theres nothing wrong with choosing abortion. Why are we supposed to find it traumatic

@Nothanksloveimfine

You are adding a foul little drip of judgement to the discussion

Oh judgement you say, like the posters we see on a daily basis who hiss "why would you have children with this man" to an already upset OP.

Or the posters who tell OP's that terminating their pregnancy is the right thing to do and they would be mad to go ahead with it?

As I said I respect a woman's right to choose.

What I don't respect, is a bunch of strangers on the Internet trying to guilt somebody into believing they should have a termination because:

The dads a shit
They don't have an extra bedroom
They're not particularly well off
They were an unwitting OW
(Insert whatever else here)

Are those posters, many of which I assume are on this thread, going to support the OP beyond a flower emoji after the fact, I doubt that very much.

To be honest I think far less of the people who encourage women to proceed with a pregnancy in these circumstances than I do of those who remind a woman she has options.

I don’t think you’re pro-choice at all OP. I think you’re a goady pro-lifer who enjoys putting women down and in their place.

Just because you say you’re pro-choice doesn’t mean you really are!

It’s be a whole lot sadder if women couldn’t get rid of unwanted pregnancies.

Why are we supposed to find it traumatic

Exactly.

It’s not traumatic for many (most) women who have one.

It’s the means of profound relief for them.

Exactly, @TalkingCat! Who knows what the future holds?

@lborgia

You know what, OP, I actually judge you more than anyone else.

You think of this as a baby, a child, and you're happy for someone to have the choice to terminate that life, as long as it provokes an emotional reaction? That's pretty sick.

Someone who does not consider it anything other than cells, I can understand how they're pro-choice.

I am pro choice. I'd not heard the experience until now - early as possible, late as needed, but that exactly sums up my view.

The idea that women should feel sadness to be going about it the "right" way? They may feel desolate, but that's not your call.

Surly the woman’s health should be the top priority in all cases. Giving birth alone in toilet to a baby that struggles on for four days doesn’t sound like great heal care to me and was no doubt deeply traumatising.

Abortions SHOULD be as accessible as other treatments.

We SHOULD be able to talk about them as though it's like going to the dentist to get a tooth pulled or going to get a mole removed.

We SHOULD always know it's a choice.