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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be furious mum is alone in hospital?

290 replies

EmmaH2022 · 04/04/2022 00:15

I know I'm not
Mum is in a hospital corridor going into hour 6 after a suspected heart attack
They wouldn't let me go with her
Did they inject everyone with insanity?
She's 83.

I should be worried that she's going to die, but something about dying on a trolley gives me the RAGE. I wish I'd been here. I would never have let them take her to the hospital. I could at least have tried a private one.

No one answers the phone at the hospital obviously.

What happens if i just turn up in the morning?

OP posts:
ElBandito · 04/04/2022 09:57

You state that the NHS has to realise it is there for patients and their families - dear God, it's atitudes like this which lead to violence against staff

Who is the NHS for if not for patients?

Qazwsxefv · 04/04/2022 10:06
  1. Some of this stuff is abuse - stealing wedding rings etc and hopefully those responsible will be prosecuted, my heart breaks for the families
  1. Some of it is lack of infrastructure- hospitals too small, not enough physical beds etc
  1. Some is poor design - modern hospitals with all individual rooms - absolutely no good if you don’t have the staff to check on everyone
  1. A nurse used to be able to nurse. Now they spend half of their time writing down what they have done and the justification in case they are sued. Far too few working computers means plenty of time is spent queuing to use a computer. Some places still using paper notes so everything has to be handwritten and then typed up for the discharge letters.

As an example of this absurdity- So much handwritten duplication. If you want to check a patients blood results- it’s not enough use a computer and check a patients blood results and then act on it.

No first you must wait until there is a free computer (four doctors to one computer in my last job) then you must log off the person on the computer -3min, then log yourself on 5min (data protection means can’t use each other’s log ons - sacking offence) then log onto antiqued results system clicking though a load of pop ups that tell you not to misuse the confidential information. Finally check results. Realise you want to compare them to old results to look for a change - that’s a different computer system so another 5mins gone. Then it’s not legally defendable to have just written “checked blood results - gave antibiotics for infection” you have to write out on paper exactly what the results were or a court will say you didn’t actually look at them.

“Date
dr Blogs GMC 12234556
Grade
Bleep/phone

Blood results date:
Fbc 123
Wcc….
……
….
(Probably about 10 lines of results)

Infection.
No allergies
Abx given in line with infection guidelines 1224.

Signed dr Bloggs”

And god forbid if you need to check if the patient has any allergies because of the patient can’t tell you then you need to check the summary care record which often dosent work so then you need to call the GP to find out and that takes ages (we call the same line patients do so can be on hold for hours)

And then you hand write the drug chart. Copying by hand the medications from the computer system/Gp print out/boxes of meds - this can be 3-4 pages of a4 handwritten

Then if you need to use extra strong antibiotics you need to get permission from the microbiology department so you have to call them and wait on hold for 10-20mins to get a code you handwrite into the notes.

The. You want to order some blood tests for tomorrow to make sure your patient is getting better. That needs a computer- so you have to go find one and repeat the log in rigmaroles. Then you find the printer is broken/missing/never installed so then as well as ordering online you have to go handwrite the blood forms and bottles. Copying by hand the nhs numbers onto multiple tiny bottles - one error means they are rejected so you have to be precise.

So a 5min job when I started medicine is now an hour long one.

And if after all of that your patient gets well enough to be discharged you need to write a discharge letter - again find a computer then type up a summary of the medical notes from the paper records. Transcribe the drug chart.

It all takes so so long and no actual patient care takes place.

  1. Still using pagers to communicate (at least the faxes have stopped). So you need to speak to Dr Jones - so he is paged and then needs to find a free telephone to reply (there is never a free telephone as the others are in use by people waiting for a response to their page). Some places have tried mobiles but the signal is often so bad you can’t get responses and wifi seems beyond the nhs.
  1. There is no where to discharge patients to. Care homes don’t want to take hospital patients as they might have covid (understandable after what happened wave 1). No one wants to be a commmunity home carer because the pay, hours and conditions are rubbish. So people stay in hospital and then get covid/flu/Noro/pneumonia and die
  1. sometimes stuff can’t be cured. Not anyones fault but the Disease. Maybe after stroke number three a 97yr old would prefer to stay at home. That would require someone to nurse them at home tho….
bitemyarsenic · 04/04/2022 10:08

@NOTANUM

These stories!!

Once I ended up in A&E for 7 hours and when I got a patient survey phone call, I gave high marks on the basis of the lovely staff who were working hard in awful circumstances. My friend who is a consultant was furious; he said the staff want patients to say it’s not good enough to management (not the poor staff on the frontline), MPs or whomever will listen. He thinks the knighting the entire service is unhelpful as it is masking serious issues as we are seeing with repeated scandals and stories like those on this thread.

Exactly. NHS staff have been telling you all how terrible it is FOR YEARS!

Put in incident report after report regarding safety.
So what did they do?
Yes blame the staff, again and again.
Management and the government have allowed and encouraged this and smugly shut the door to improvement.
Currently dedicated staff are leaving in droves to get a decent job in the private sector before the NHS finally goes.
Well I hope you are all going to enjoy finding the money for private healthcare on top of your other spiralling bills.
You are getting what you voted for and what you deserve!
You didnt listen to us

RIPWalter · 04/04/2022 10:09

@ElBandito

You state that the NHS has to realise it is there for patients and their families - dear God, it's atitudes like this which lead to violence against staff

Who is the NHS for if not for patients?

None of us signed up to work with these current conditions and rules, the vast majority of staff at every level want to to their best for patients and certainly never to be intentionally cruel. We are all under so much stress, we are human, prone to burn out, and like any other human, there is a decrease in empathy when under stress (demonstrated in multiple studies).

One of the sisters in the A&E I take patients too, is hilariously rude to staff when under too much pressure. I could take it personally or I could remember the times she's been kind when I've had a really horrible job. She is only human. We all are.

Roses1221 · 04/04/2022 10:10

Go and get her and get her the private care if you can. NHS is a shambles, those in charge of spending should hang their heads in shame. The poor staff on the ground are run ragged and forced to hide behind ridiculous ‘rules’. My friend was 10 days post partum and admitted with sepsis after community midwives ignored her very obvious symptoms. On her (first) Mother’s Day her mum visited her in the morning and the ward staff told her that her baby then couldn’t visit in the afternoon. ‘One visitor, same person!’ The world has gone mad, there’s no compassion.

ChiswickFlo · 04/04/2022 10:12

I spent from 4pm Saturday to 7am yesterday (so 15 hours) in an a&e triage area with my 76 year old mum.
She has multiple health issues including copd and cardiomyopathy.
She was left sitting on a chair for those 15 hours and if I hadn't been there to advocate for her would have been without water, pain relief or any observations.
She has been admitted and has sepsis (which I knew at 3pm on Saturday!)
I told them 3 times she was dehydrated but she was not put on a drip until 8am yesterday.
As of 10pm last night she is not responding to the antibiotics and the surgical SHO has told me that if her bowel perforates they won't operate.
It's horrific.
The NHS is not working and some of the staff I've dealt with over the past 48 hours should not be allowed anywhere near vulnerable people.
The wait I can accept (there are no beds) but the dreadful "care" is preventable and sadly the poor attitude of some staff seems systemic.

CityHigh · 04/04/2022 10:12

Very sorry to hear about your Mum, that’s is disgusting.

It is also not a blanket rule in all NHS hospitals. I have just come out of hospital a few days ago and I was allowed visitors. They just had to bring a negative LFT with them. I was only allowed one at a time but that was the only restriction.

MrsLargeEmbodied · 04/04/2022 10:14

best wishes op
please try not to read these dreadful stories

have some faith and hope

ChiswickFlo · 04/04/2022 10:14

Oh, I can visit but I have to book a 1 hour slot and do an lft prior - which is absolutely fine btw - but now that you have to pay will it stop people from being able to visit loved ones?

ChiswickFlo · 04/04/2022 10:17

@MrsLargeEmbodied

best wishes op please try not to read these dreadful stories

have some faith and hope

Yeah Let's just pretend everything is fine! 😡 How dare you?! Have you sat with your elderly mother watching her desperately licking the residue of the oromorph from the vial because she was in so much pain? Faith and hope do very little when confronted by systemic bacterial infection
fUNNYfACE36 · 04/04/2022 10:20

cynically, it must be a lot easier or staff to deal with people who are subdued through pain and illness, when there is no companion there to advocate for them!

Snog · 04/04/2022 10:20

Of course we can criticise the NHS. It's clearly not doing a great job right now in terms of delivering healthcare.
Some individuals within the NHS are doing a great job, some are doing an ok job and others are doing a frankly shit job. The impact of the people doing a shit job is high.

Resources are limited and that's another discussion - but there are so many people not being afforded basic humanity and that is surely an important priority to discuss and address.

BoodleBug51 · 04/04/2022 10:22

I had to wait outside a locked building for an appointment last week, for nearly 35 minutes as the appointment before had run over. It was bitterly cold, with a biting wind and absolutely no shelter. There was a huge sign saying you had to wait to be let into the building. They had also disabled the intercom and there was no phone number. I gritted my teeth and was very glad I'd had the sense to put a warm coat on.

Then two elderly patients arrived as well. Both were shivering in the cold, and trying desperately to bang on the door to see if someone would let them in. When eventually someone came to let me through, they were going to leave these people stood outside....... and weren't happy that I insisted that they were let in.

Is that how we treat the elderly these days? It's cruel, inhuman and they deserve better.

oakleaffy · 04/04/2022 10:25

Covid and all it’s “ Variants” are here to stay, by the looks of it.
Much as Norovirus and flu are.

It’s like the Govt has washed it’s hands of Covid.

TabithaTittlemouse · 04/04/2022 10:26

I’m so sorry op. It’s not good enough.

sunshinesupermum · 04/04/2022 10:27

So sorry OP. Your elderly mother should not be treated like this. Here is a handhold to you both.

Can you name and shame the hospital? I am also in London BTW and am terrified I or my other half will need in-hospital treatment at any time (we are in our 70s.) I am partially deaf and any medical appointment sends me into a panic as I cannot hear and need someone with me to let me know what is happening.

I do hope your mum is on a ward now and being properly assessed as well as you being allowed to be with her. Flowers

TabithaTittlemouse · 04/04/2022 10:28

@fUNNYfACE36

cynically, it must be a lot easier or staff to deal with people who are subdued through pain and illness, when there is no companion there to advocate for them!
It’s not, it’s heartbreaking. We want the patients to have their loved ones with them.
oakleaffy · 04/04/2022 10:28

@fUNNYfACE36

cynically, it must be a lot easier or staff to deal with people who are subdued through pain and illness, when there is no companion there to advocate for them!
Yes! Absolutely.
MrsLargeEmbodied · 04/04/2022 10:28

@ChiswickFlo

i am simply trying to be supportive to op
i am sorry for others experiences

PlainJaneEyre · 04/04/2022 10:29

You do realise that the NHS is the best place for her if she has had a heart attack? Take her out and you delay any possible treatment .A private hospital will not deal with an emergency situation . Yes a private hospital will do procedures like angiograms but that is a different thing.It's tough with these increased rules again but they are there for a reason. Hope you get some concrete info today.

KittenKins · 04/04/2022 10:30

In my (then) local hospital where I spent over four months last year I wasn't allowed any visitors, which made a happy Xmas, & new year & birthday for me. However, I understood.

Patients who could transfer to a chair could leave to see visitors, either in the coffee shop or just outside the ward door.

Of the four whom I witnessed dying, two were alone, one had
a visitor everyday for weeks, another just for the last 24hours.

It was heartbreaking.

However, I so watched so many staff get sick, the ward on chaos & staff missing breaks to make sure everyone got care. Allowing visitors means even more staff off, then what do you do?

I'm so sorry about your mum, for everyone going through this.

Firstshoes · 04/04/2022 10:32

So NHS staff don't go out and about in their free time maskless to pubs, restaurants, busy shops etc. yet the rules won't allow one loved one wearing a mask to be with their elderly ill relative in case they infect the staff. Crazy

PlainJaneEyre · 04/04/2022 10:32

@ChiswickFlo

I spent from 4pm Saturday to 7am yesterday (so 15 hours) in an a&e triage area with my 76 year old mum. She has multiple health issues including copd and cardiomyopathy. She was left sitting on a chair for those 15 hours and if I hadn't been there to advocate for her would have been without water, pain relief or any observations. She has been admitted and has sepsis (which I knew at 3pm on Saturday!) I told them 3 times she was dehydrated but she was not put on a drip until 8am yesterday. As of 10pm last night she is not responding to the antibiotics and the surgical SHO has told me that if her bowel perforates they won't operate. It's horrific. The NHS is not working and some of the staff I've dealt with over the past 48 hours should not be allowed anywhere near vulnerable people. The wait I can accept (there are no beds) but the dreadful "care" is preventable and sadly the poor attitude of some staff seems systemic.
I would be putting in a formal complaint about that. Poor lady.
PlainJaneEyre · 04/04/2022 10:33

@Firstshoes

So NHS staff don't go out and about in their free time maskless to pubs, restaurants, busy shops etc. yet the rules won't allow one loved one wearing a mask to be with their elderly ill relative in case they infect the staff. Crazy
and all the other patients? Staff are testing all the time.
Rosehugger · 04/04/2022 10:35

I can't believe people who are frail are not allowed anyone to accompany them! Completely inhumane.

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