To expect DH to take shared parental leave if he wants a second child

[FeministBadger]

Over the weekend, DH raised the question of when we'd start trying for a second child. DH wants to start trying sooner and I want a bigger gap particularly as I found maternity leave difficult.

I said I'd be happy to have a smaller gap if DH took shared parental leave which he said wouldn't work with his job. However his company is really generous with SPL and he could get full pay for 6 months even if I'd taken 6 months too so the only problem would be the same issues any woman in his role would face. His solution is we could get a nanny.

This has really annoyed me - I accept DH can't share the pregnancy and birth parts but it seems he doesn't want to do anything that could impact on his career even though he is the one wanting a second kid sooner. Aibu to make him taking SPL a requirement for us ttc?

Stick to your guns, OP, and make sure you have all the best contraceptives available and doubled up.

I loathed being on maternity leave so much it left me with depression and had an awful awful time. Lucky i live in a country where my DH could take the 2nd part of leave, 18 months, which covered us until the DCs could both go to nursery. It was brilliant.

I don't think I'll have another child because at the minute I feel how I imagine your DH feels: sure, I would like a bigger family and another child in my life. But I am not prepared to sacrifice more career, go back to the drudgery of a year of childcare, part time hours, all the mental load. I just don't want to do it.

If someone else volunteered to raise my kid for me, say, 70% of the time I'd have a second one right now. Since I'm a woman, I'm unlikely to find a volunteer. Well done OP for not letting your husband push you into it.

YANBU.

Even if you only look at the financial aspects of it, it makes sense for him to take the leave!

@SpinsForGin

Not nice to bring a life into the world when neither of you want to make the sacrifices required to raise it

The issue here is that the OP is expected to make all the sacrifices. That's hardly fair.

I didn't say it was fair. I said neither of them are willing to make the sacrifice which seems as though it's true !

I didn't say it was fair. I said neither of them are willing to make the sacrifice which seems as though it's true !

But the OPs husband is expecting her to make all the sacrifices.... that the point she's making. So of course it's about fairness

I didn't say it was fair. I said neither of them are willing to make the sacrifice which seems as though it's true !

It isn't quite, though.

OP, having already made all the sacrifices the first time around, is willing to make her share of the sacrifices the second time around.

It's her husband who isn't willing to make any sacrifices, but still wants a second baby now.

@collieresponder88 how do you read one parent contemplating pregnancy, birth and 6 months maternity leave, with the other parent considering doing none of these things as neither are prepared to make sacrifices? One parent is, and one parent isn’t. Why you read the woman’s position being as I refuse to do 100% of the work as the same as not prepared to make any sacrifices I can’t imagine- deep seated internal misogyny? If you were moved to a team of 2 at work, and on arrival the other team member said actually I’m not doing any of the work, how would you feel? I went into marriage with an expectation of sharing the family load, if my husband refused it would be a betrayal. It’s very sensible of the op to decide these are not circumstances to have another baby in.

This is crazy - he would literally be working 6 months for free if his company offers it and he doesn’t take it. Does he not take holiday days? What would happen if he got ill and had to go off for a prolonged period of time? What would happen is would go off and come back and all would be fine.

It’s it even like being a woman as the men that go off for 6 months are treated like heroes when they come back!

His stance is rooted in social conditioning not reality. He needs to really think about where his prejudice comes from that’s it’s ok for a woman to take 6 months off but not a man. And if he thinks he would get fired/ not be promoted etc because of 6 months off he must not be very good at his job!

What if you took 6 weeks off. Then got a full time nanny? Would you both be happy with this?

@GabriellaMontez

What if you took 6 weeks off. Then got a full time nanny? Would you both be happy with this?

Childcare for a 6 week old baby and the family unnecessarily spending £3k a month because dad wants a baby without having to do any parenting or impact his career

There is no evidence that taking parental leave does harm men’s careers. There is a huge motherhood penalty. Men actually get paid more when they become fathers. SPL still has appalling take up but you don’t hear men who take it complain about being ‘daddy tracked’.

He’s turning down an extremely generous paid leave policy because he wants to swing his dick around the office instead.

@FeministBadger

Thanks for the input everyone.

I think actually a PP has it right, right now I cannot imagine having a second if it requires the same sacrifices as the first time round.

I had hoped DH would be willing to step up and take on an equal share next time but if that is in doubt I am happy stopping at one.

I am so glad to read your conclusion.

In your situation you should not consider another baby.

I don't think you want one at all, which is your choice.

A toddler and a new baby is relentless, there is no avoiding it.

Your husband is not in it with you if it impacts him at all.

He is quite happy for you, your life and career to take the full load of child bearing.

Not a chance should you even consider it.

An only child sounds just perfect.

Stick to one.

Protect yourself and enjoy what you have.

Childcare for a 6 week old baby and the family unnecessarily spending £3k a month because dad wants a baby without having to do any parenting or impact his career

Many women make this choice and see it as an investment. Even though it costs for a short time. Is that OK? Or should those women be scorned for their choice?

YANBU
But also I would say this is how most men are. They want a child without having to make any sacrifices whatsoever. And let's face it, most of them get away with it too. It doesn't make it right of course.

Many women make this choice and see it as an investment. Even though it costs for a short time. Is that OK? Or should those women be scorned for their choice?

Nobody is criticising women (families) for making that choice. However, in this case the Op doesn't want to do that and it makes absolutely no financial sense for them to do this when her DH could get 6 months paid parental leave.

@PenguinPup

YANBU But also I would say this is how most men are. They want a child without having to make any sacrifices whatsoever. And let's face it, most of them get away with it too. It doesn't make it right of course.

Women need to stop having such low standards in men to help move things along.

@GabriellaMontez

Childcare for a 6 week old baby and the family unnecessarily spending £3k a month because dad wants a baby without having to do any parenting or impact his career

Many women make this choice and see it as an investment. Even though it costs for a short time. Is that OK? Or should those women be scorned for their choice?

To be factual, not many in the uk do. It’s not that easy to find childcare for babies under 6mo and even harder for 6 week olds. This means it’s a nanny which is expensive so limited to those who can afford it. (or family but looking after a 6 week old is a full time job, and we are talking about where it’s an investment). Going back to work and paying for childcare is very common, going back sooner than 6mo not so common and going back within a month or two very rare. I have a 4.5 week old, have always gone back to work full time after mat leave and will be doing so again, but couldn’t contemplate leaving my precious baby to go to work in less than two weeks.

@glowingcandle

You're definitely in the right on this one.

Why is it always men who have jobs which mean they can't take paternity leave/shared parental leave, can't do nursery/school pick up, can't request to go part time etc etc. It gets very boring.

It always is this way. And none of these workplaces ever have any women who work there and no woman has ever worked the same type of job the man does and they never have any children.

No matter what job he has, he couldn't possibly take parental leave.

@GabriellaMontez

Childcare for a 6 week old baby and the family unnecessarily spending £3k a month because dad wants a baby without having to do any parenting or impact his career

Many women make this choice and see it as an investment. Even though it costs for a short time. Is that OK? Or should those women be scorned for their choice?

If a woman started a thread saying: “I like the idea of having a second baby but although my work gives me 6 months fully paid, I just don’t want to look after a newborn! Plus it might impact on my career. I’m planning to take 2 weeks off then get a full time nanny.”

I think she would get plenty of scorn too

@FeministBadger how old is your DS? It sounds like he's quite little.

To be factual, not many in the uk do. It’s not that easy to find childcare for babies under 6mo and even harder for 6 week olds. This means it’s a nanny which is expensive so limited to those who can afford it. (or family but looking after a 6 week old is a full time job, and we are talking about where it’s an investment). Going back to work and paying for childcare is very common, going back sooner than 6mo not so common and going back within a month or two very rare. I have a 4.5 week old, have always gone back to work full time after mat leave and will be doing so again, but couldn’t contemplate leaving my precious baby to go to work in less than two weeks

Not my experience. Most nurseries have a baby room and take babies from 6 weeks. I've no idea what % take this up. Do you?

I know that the baby staff ratio is higher and the baby rooms have smaller numbers in them. I know that when I was looking in north london at nurseries, 6mo was the age threshold for a lot and 3mo for quite a few of the ones that had babies. I know that in my decade and a half of consulting, working in a large professional services firm and running projects in various large banks, where the typical staff member is career oriented and can afford childcare, as a woman I noticed the women I worked with and their leave times and only ever knew one woman to return before their child was 6mo. They returned when their baby was 4mo, they would bring the nanny with them on work travel. I remember it because it stood out as a different approach to every other woman I’d met. (I do know of one woman returning.with a 2mo also, never met her but someone in her area told me about her.)

I agree with you. He wants you to take a hit on your career when he's not prepared to take one himself... for something that he wants. YANBU.

Just an update - DH brought this up again yesterday after speaking to a colleague (let's call him Adam) whose wife took six months maternity leave and then got a nanny because she's trying to make partner at a law firm.

Now I don't know this woman so maybe she wanted to take the mat leave but I do know that Adam is junior to DH and definitely in a less senior and less well paid role than both me and his wife.

Anyway, DH had clearly brought this up as proof that more senior women could do it, so it could work for me. Whereas to me it's blatant proof that even when a woman is the primary earner her husband will still refuse to take a career hit because "reasons".

So yeah, thoughts of a second or indeed any sex with DH right now, are waaay off the table.

@FeministBadger

Just an update - DH brought this up again yesterday after speaking to a colleague (let's call him Adam) whose wife took six months maternity leave and then got a nanny because she's trying to make partner at a law firm.

Now I don't know this woman so maybe she wanted to take the mat leave but I do know that Adam is junior to DH and definitely in a less senior and less well paid role than both me and his wife.

Anyway, DH had clearly brought this up as proof that more senior women could do it, so it could work for me. Whereas to me it's blatant proof that even when a woman is the primary earner her husband will still refuse to take a career hit because "reasons".

So yeah, thoughts of a second or indeed any sex with DH right now, are waaay off the table.

I would say to him it doesnt matter what anyone else does - these are my reasons and my boundaries for having another baby.

But I am angry on your behalf