To be so angry with our government treatment of refugees.

[Kendodd]

First Syria
Then Afganistan
Now Ukraine
They see a crisis and put every barrier they can get away with to keep people out.
The first two they pretended 'ooh security ' so many young men, they're all Islamist terrorists.
Well what's their excuse now? This lot are all women and children.
I suspect the truth is this plays well with their bluekip 'they're not coming here' base, that's why they do it.
I'm not even going to bother writing to my Leave supporting Tory MP about this one. No fucking point. I'll just get the Tory HQ lies back about how we're doing more than any other country for refugees (actually heard Johnson say that on the radio yesterday).
I'm ashamed to be British.

Not with no support network! Who will care for their children if housed away from anyone they know?
Firstly, the only people who can come here at the moment are ones with family in the country already.
Secondly, there is an existing Ukrainian diaspora here who are very willing to give a hand.
Thirdly, don't treat them as some poor lost lambs, it is a bit patronising. Many women coming here are successful professionals, and after an initial adjustment period will be quite able to look after themselves and their children. After all, who is looking after British children when their British mums are at work - hmmm, sounds almost like there is a solution already?

There just isn't much support from the general public for Ukrainian (or any other) refugees. Brainwashing by Tories about hostile environments, policing our borders under Brexit (as if that couldn't always be done), an insular mentality that decries the UK's fall from Imperialist grace, so will never be the giver, just the taker. A lying PM, a government that is devoid of morality and that seeps right down. I am sorry but I only have time for those who have NOT voted Tory and voted Remain no matter what their party allegiance. I'm alright Jack, and we reap what we sow.

Apart from a vocal and caring minority, I am sorry to say that most people don't care much, but care for themselves alone. A typical British trait.

Save a penny on the weekly shop, don't have visitors, don't have anyone stay overnight, always phone to say you are calling. Very militaristic way of living. Most people are the same. Think about it.

@Kendodd

To those jumping up at down shouting about being full up etc. Suggest you read the diary of Anne Frank, this government would have absolutely 100% put up every barrier they could to lock the doors on her.

I suggest you read about her father and his attempts to emigrate to the UK and USA. He was a very forward thinking man and tried all sorts of things to keep his family safe. That they fell through was not because of anything done to him but rather what the war did to the Netherlands.

Like many of the assertions, assumptions here, your assertiion re Anne Frank is incorrect., based on limited information.

@HereComesSpringAgain

Also, I assume these visas do allow these refugees to work here?

Awful, just awful, isn't it? For three years only though, and they don't lead to settlement rights compared to the traditional asylum route.

Write to your mp. It’s an important way for them to gauge public opinion. If they think they will lose their seat, they will change their tune or will be more likely to.

We live in a relatively free democracy unlike many people. Use the levers available to you op.

Oh! If you do want to support a Ukranie refugee you cannot do it as a non related individual. It has to be done via a family visa or a sponsorship programme. So you need to look of one of those.

If you want to set one up you need to contact Reset - they teach people how to navigate the Home Office, prepare a resettlement plan, fundraise for costs and source accommodation for the family etc.

Ask me how I know that and I will tell you that the group of charities I work/volunteer for has been asked by the local Ukraine residents to help them set up just sch a programme to help others come here, to our small, rural market town, backwater, sleepy little supposedly racist area of Little England

BeckySharpish
I have a Polish friend whose brother is linking people up from Krakow

So you haven't gone through the official portal route then? Will some refugees be deported if they do not "regularise their position" within 90 days?

www.irishimmigration.ie/the-minister-for-justice-helen-mcentee-td-has-announced-the-immediate-lifting-of-entry-visa-requirements-for-ukrainian-nationals/

www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/almost-2-500-housing-offers-for-ukrainians-as-portal-starts-processing-pledges-1.4820739

There is a completely different culture in ireland. The suspicion of people from other countries that you have in Britain doesn't get much traction here....isn't promoted by our press and government.

This offer doesn't sound very generous and open to me;

16 August 2021
The [Irish] Government confirmed that Ireland will accept 195 refugees from Afghanistan after the Taliban seized control of the country.
www.thejournal.ie/irish-nationals-refugees-afghanistan-5524006-Aug2021/

At least 16,500 people were airlifted from Afghanistan to the UK.

A vocal and caring minority? What is caring about expecting thousands upon thousands of Ukranian refugees to come 2000 miles from home to the UK? Has no one thought about what those people want? Or are they just being dehumanised into the latest bandwagon virtue-signalling tool on social media for the little Englanders who like to whinge about how the UK is the worst in the world? It's like people are all woohoo, let's go and grab some refugees and fly plane loads of them over here, it'll make me feel great. Ukraine is their home.

@forinborin

Not with no support network! Who will care for their children if housed away from anyone they know? Firstly, the only people who can come here at the moment are ones with family in the country already. Secondly, there is an existing Ukrainian diaspora here who are very willing to give a hand. Thirdly, don't treat them as some poor lost lambs, it is a bit patronising. Many women coming here are successful professionals, and after an initial adjustment period will be quite able to look after themselves and their children. After all, who is looking after British children when their British mums are at work - hmmm, sounds almost like there is a solution already?

It's not patronising. It's a valid point actually. We have a poster upthread taking some. People in
stop looking for offence where none is intended fgs, that's the attitude that gets these threads deleted

@Crankley

How many refugees have you taken into your home in the past OP, and how many Ukranian refugees are you planning on housing? Or perhaps you're aware of hundreds of empty properties just waiting for the refugees to arrive?

I also would like to know if OP would be willing to give up her children's places at school and GP surgery to provide for refugees. I guess not.

@Alltheprettyseahorses

A vocal and caring minority? What is caring about expecting thousands upon thousands of Ukranian refugees to come 2000 miles from home to the UK? Has no one thought about what those people want? Or are they just being dehumanised into the latest bandwagon virtue-signalling tool on social media for the little Englanders who like to whinge about how the UK is the worst in the world? It's like people are all woohoo, let's go and grab some refugees and fly plane loads of them over here, it'll make me feel great. Ukraine is their home.

Yes I do agree that people often presume or assume what people want. Yes somewhere safe, but there are ways to support that other than coming this far from home and probably away from support networks. I think a lot are thinking along the lines of who cares about their quality of life as long as they're safe, which although true, the reality of underfunded and depleted public services that cannot cope already is important to consider.

It's not patronising. It's a valid point actually. We have a poster upthread taking some. People in
stop looking for offence where none is intended fgs, that's the attitude that gets these threads deleted
For the avoidance of doubt, I am not offended, I am just surprised with how you see Ukrainian women. Remember, the absolute majority of them did participate in the workforce in a modern economy just two weeks ago, many were breadwinners for their families, most of younger ones will have some level of fluency in English too. They won't have significantly more difficulties integrating than, say, a Polish or a Lithuanian woman who came to work under the EU freedom of movement a few years ago.

@forinborin

Are we automatically enrolling children into schools? Are the government making school or pre school childcare spaces available? Because if they're not they simply can't work. Why not? Note the discussion is about people who are already coming to join family, there's no general refugee scheme open at the moment. Ukrainian families are usually very close-knit (and their families settled in the UK are also more likely to be highly qualified / high earners), it would be very unusual for a woman to rely on the generosity of strangers or the government rather than her own family. And why do you think childcare places need to be provided by the government, and not just paid by the woman? Last two people who I helped with the documentation and admin were a database architect and a vet, it is unlikely that they will just sit on their arses and wait for handouts or for someone to address their needs, no matter what country they end up in.

Many people who come here to join their families will be joining families who work too, though.

How's a woman going to pay childcare costs before she's paid from any new job that she does get?

I think we should be offering free school/childcare places. What's the point in housing children if we're going to fail them in terms of an education or standard of living.

Also, there are well over a million second homes in the UK. Not rented - second or holiday homes
I never understand this sort of comment - these second homes belong to real people (who pay the mortgages and bills), they're not government-owned community assets that can be handed over to whoever. If these owners want to offer them up as refugee accommodation then that's down to them not you. And no, we don't own one.

How's a woman going to pay childcare costs before she's paid from any new job that she does get?
Why do you assume that they come with absolute zero assets at all? Everyone I know who is on the run now carries a good amount of cash with them, or moved their savings into crypto to be accessible anywhere. Or, in the absense of that, that their families won't help out financially?

@forinborin

How's a woman going to pay childcare costs before she's paid from any new job that she does get? Why do you assume that they come with absolute zero assets at all? Everyone I know who is on the run now carries a good amount of cash with them, or moved their savings into crypto to be accessible anywhere. Or, in the absense of that, that their families won't help out financially?

I'm not assuming that. But I'm assuming some people will have almost nothing. They're spending a lot of money to get here from Ukraine. They left Ukraine with next to nothing material-wise.

I think weshouldbe offering free school/childcare places. What's the point in housing children if we're going to fail them in terms of an education or standard of living.

Well yes exactly, but many areas don't have many school places at all and childcare spaces can be limited following the closure of many after covid. As the government has been content to decimate early years and education over the past decade or whatever I don't see their appetite for investing much in it as they have been happy for people to be priced out of childcare, children having to attend poorly funded schools miles away for years now.

I'm not assuming that. But I'm assuming some people will have almost nothing. They're spending a lot of money to get here from Ukraine. They left Ukraine with next to nothing material-wise.
Some, yes, but I expect the settled Ukrainian community to take good care of them - there are already plenty of offers of accommodation / help / work opportunities for the potential newcomers in local expat groups. As I said upthread, it is a much less individualistic culture compared to the West (absolutely not saying it with a sense of superiority - there are massive downsides to it too), and it is seen as a duty of care.

@Alltheprettyseahorses

A vocal and caring minority? What is caring about expecting thousands upon thousands of Ukranian refugees to come 2000 miles from home to the UK? Has no one thought about what those people want? Or are they just being dehumanised into the latest bandwagon virtue-signalling tool on social media for the little Englanders who like to whinge about how the UK is the worst in the world? It's like people are all woohoo, let's go and grab some refugees and fly plane loads of them over here, it'll make me feel great. Ukraine is their home.

There are over 17000 ukrainians that have applied for visas for the UK, they applied, that is what they want right now when their home is unsafe? I understand that you want to be right on but you are off the mark here. No one is suggesting shuttling them off to where ever we want but the UK is cutting them off with red tape when they do want to go to the UK which is a stark contrast to the EU that is saying you are welcome if you like, you can have benefits, schooling, the right to work etc and is following through on that promise to the best of it's ability

@BeckySharpish well little xenophobic of you isn't it

@RoastedFerret so 17000 have applied so not put off by the red tape then, also how many have actually gone to another eu country yet other than the bordering countries ? We simply can't take in hundreds of thousands ( agree we need to take in more than we have though) and I bet many eu countries will end up taking hardly any due to language difficulties etc

@stupidandconcearned what? It's xenophobic to say your PM is corrupt and repulsive and that he is emboldening a horrible element of your society? No it isn't

@BeckySharpish it wasn't what you said about the pm you grouped the whole of Britain together for one

[quote stupidandconcearned]@RoastedFerret so 17000 have applied so not put off by the red tape then, also how many have actually gone to another eu country yet other than the bordering countries ? We simply can't take in hundreds of thousands ( agree we need to take in more than we have though) and I bet many eu countries will end up taking hardly any due to language difficulties etc [/quote]
17000 that applied are close family members (as in: children, parents, brothers and sisters) of British citizens and long-term residents. No one else can apply right now. It is not as if a bunch of completely random people are coming over.