Ukraine - it’s nothing to do with us.

[Greyhop]

I don’t often go on Facebook for exactly this reason. A friend had written this post saying Ukraine is nothing to do with us, and slamming Boris for getting involved. I want to reply, I want to articulate a good reply. A kind reply. Or should I just leave it? AIBU to respond to her offensive post?

Its complicated.
What is happening there at the moment while beyond awful for those people it doesnt currently affect us personally right now. I can feel for those people in the same way as i feel for others in war conflicts or without basics like reliable food and water. I can choose to offer aid but how much actually gets through to those who need it. As a country we can help by taking in those needing shelter but most of the UK is against that.
2 ways of looking at it by getring involved we risk putting a target on our back and we are far less able to protect ourselves than ukraine as our armies are not comparable and we are not at all self sugficient in the Uk. We are part of NATO so if NATO becomes involved we are involved regardless but till then it may not be wise to antagonise further. We can still offer aid to anyone fleeing conflicts and first aid to anyone needing it.
the other thought process is this needs stamping out promptly and we should be involved as if Russia our successful in ukraine they will continue across europe.

Some believe that we are currently somewhere between the above. We are poking the bear so putting ourselves at risk but not actually helping ukraine in any meaningful way.

IME those types who are all ‘charity begins at home’ are very rarely in fact contributing to charity at home either.

I’m also seeing a link between those who think this is nobody’s business and the types who absolutely fetishise WWII and ‘the spirit back then’ and who get very narky if anyone’s not wearing a poppy. It’s really interesting to think about what they would have been like has they actually lived through the war they love to glorify.

Leave it, much as on here, you'll rarely change anyones views.

In one sense of course she is wrong but perhaps not quite in the why she thinks.... the West hasn't got involved, least of all the UK.....

Putin takes Ukraine and within months, we all go back to buying Russian wheat, nickel, copper and aluminium.... (we haven't stopped buying their gas)
oh and cheering in Paris when Russian athletes win gold in the Olympics in two years time.

We can't even be bothered to stop them using our banking system (Swift) or take Ukrainian refugees.

So on 2nd thoughts, correct your friend and tell her we are not involved.

Most people can't relate tobor support the people in northern ireland post brexit (or b3fore voting) so this is not surprising:-/

The hesitancy to suspend use of swift is in part because it would instantly create a black market i thought.

Honest to goo op d we are ALREADY involved whether you like it or not. The West and the democracy that we enjoy makes us enemies.

I’m actually bloody proud of our stance so far. Europe will not throw Russia out of Swift as they are terrified of their gas getting cut off. Americas ridiculously weak government does nothing. Russia are killing civilians just like us. Murdering their children. This is not a situation like Syria or Afghanistan where you could kid yourself it’s far enough away to have no real impact. Or you could accept that Muslim extremism is at fault and we don’t align with those ideologies. This is happening in Europe. It affects us, we’re involved.

*god

I couldn't be friends with someone so narrow minded. The fact that she thinks this doesn't affect us is beyond belief.

We’ve encouraged a culture of Britain as an island. And a them and us attitude when it comes to Europe. Calling Ukraine part of Europe doesn’t make the conflict come closer to those people who feel distanced.

I know really little about politics and I’m quite curious to understand if Brexit makes our voice quieter or louder on the world stage?

Even if you remove any element of care for humanity, you still can't say it doesn't affect us - I've watched my pension lose quite a bit this week, we know gas prices are being affected by volatility in the region- every bit of instability affects global markets which hits our pockets. So even if you can't bring yourself to care about those outside our country, it does impact us all and things like fuel prices hit the poorest hardest. It's a totally naive view that we can insulate ourselves from the rest of the world.

I haven’t a clue whether it makes our voice louder on any stage but what it does is give us the independence to have a voice and that’s golden.

We are a tiny island of no real consequence our help would make precious little difference in all reality

I second 'unfollow' if only just the phase out the ignorant and the stupid in your life op.

Anyone who seriously thinks the first war to erupt inside of Europe 'does not affect' them is seriously seriously stupid and does not deserve a place in your life op.

On that basis I would defriend her as well. You have seen her for what she is. It is probably fear talking, but a deep seated ignorance as well.

People are allowed to have different opinions OP. I'd just stick to talking about other stuff for now

It’s probably a bad way of saying we have a lot of problems going on here to sort first .but the invasion of Ukraine the rest of the world need to put a stop to this as imo going to war for the reasons putin is aren’t justified. It will probably effect us too I’m not saying we will be bombed but in other ways business etc . I suspect most businesses have some sort of Russian involvement with customers / suppliers so it will effect us .it’s scary he’s already being compared to hitler when he invaded Poland . This sort of suffering can’t happen again .

I would just unfollow her, it would be a waste of time to try and educate her. She sounds thick and best avoided tbh.

I don't think it is the 'opinions' that are the problem but what sits behind them what is there anyone in Europe or even the world that thinks that this 'does not affect them'

It will have an impact on absolutely everyone in the end. So it is the stupidity of such comments that grate.

Britain has made a habit of joining the US in interfering abroad and then abandoning people and leaving a shitstorm behind. Your friend is possibly reluctant to do this again.

When you say we should be doing something, does that mean you'd be okay with your sons or husband being called up to actively participate. Because that's what you're asking of others.

I think this is more complicated than a straightforward invasion and as things stand European countries don't even want to exclude Russia from Swift. Why should Britain put it's neck out to protect European gas supplies when Europe isn't willing to do anything?

I wouldn’t bother arguing as she sounds so stupid, she wouldn’t be my friend any more.

Just paste Pastor Niemöller's First They Came under her post:

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist
Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist
Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist
Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew
Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

@WhatNoRaisins

People are allowed to have different opinions OP. I'd just stick to talking about other stuff for now

They are, but people are also allowed to gently challenge opinions and open debate. Debate is a dying art in our society. We either cancel or retreat to our echo chambers. That's not healthy and it doesn't create a wise, fair and balanced society.

Never argue with idiots

“Never play chess with a pigeon.
The pigeon just knocks all the pieces over.
Then shits all over the board.
Then struts around like it won.”