To be upset by dd’s behaviour

[Atypicaldancer]

I’ve posted in teenagers but got no replies and I’m feeling a bit upset. This is my problem I think, not dd’s. I just wish I could handle it better. Dd is 15 and autistic. She struggles with social situations and takes a particular dislike to certain people, such as my MIL (DH is dd’s stepdad). MIL was visiting her grandchildren (DH’s two dc) at ours and she had also baked a cake for dd’s birthday.

Dd had just come back from her boyfriend’s house and I asked her if she could say thank you to MIL. Dd didn’t want to, but then she came in, cut a chunk out of the cake, said it was disgusting and told me to fuck off. I’m mortified by her behaviour, but at the same time I know that she will have pressured herself to come in and be sociable, found it too much and lost control.

She finds MIL irritating because she talks a lot and so the issue with the cake will have been about control for Dd.

She’s now shut herself up in her room and has texted me, apologising for not being a good daughter.

I wish I had a better handle on things. She’s autistic, not bad - and I know I shouldn’t worry about how she appears to others. I just wish others could see the kind, funny girl that I can.

I’m not going to push them together. I’ve said that and I’ve acknowledged that this is my fault. I have taken that on board completely already. The flowers are from me.

Maybe a quality over quantity approach to get relationships? I get that we all want our kids to be able to get one with everyone ideally but it's not going to be realistic with your DD. It might be best to just focus on the good relationships she has for the moment.

Autism isn't an excuse for behaving like that.

No it’s not an excuse which is why she apologised.

Hugs and
Nothing useful to add.
You seem to be handling it so well. Learning how to scaffold etc
Are you OK though? In yourself? You have a lot on your plate. Where's your counsellor and your emotional support.

Why did you push them together?

I’m not trying to attack you but it seems like you are in pain but trying to manage the symptoms and not the cause.

MIL doesn’t quite get it.

It's a learning curve for everyone - for DD and for MiL. Don't sweat it, you aren't responsible for how MiL reacts. She'll figure it out or she wont.

You are managing a difficult situation, that doesn't make it your fault when things don't go perfectly.

@Hankunamatata

Hi Op. I'm struggling with my asd child's need to control the whole house, you post struck a chord.

It sounds like you are making fab progress as dd articulated how she was feeling even if it does read like a list of everything she thinks you did wrong - know that feeling well.

I struggle to understand why my asd dc cant just be polite, say thank you and use manners - I know logically I'm being unreasonable to some extent - its a minefield for me.

I think its good that your dd has a healthy relationship with a boyfriend. She has a connection which is good for her mental health. She's taking the pill and you sensibly realise you cant stop her having sex.

I have moments when I'm still like this, and I don't really understand why either. At this point in my life, I'm mostly able to be 'polite' through time and practice, but it takes quite a heavy mental toll to constantly have to remember to say please and thank you, to do things right, to not get angry or anxious around other people. It's so demanding.

I wish I wasn't like this, for everyone involved. Yet at the same time I get angry sometimes at how unfair it is that I have to cultivate an entire fake person just to be able to get through life, whilst others hardly ever try to meet me where I am. The thing with 'just' doing xyz is that there is no 'just'. Everything takes conscious effort, nothing is on autopilot. It's like instead of walking everywhere I constantly have to run at full speed, it's hard to keep up. It might be a bit like you being dropped in France and people asking why you can't just speak French; you might be able to learn, but think of the labour involved. And after a whole day of struggling to speak French, you just want French to piss off and hole up in your room with English telly. Where things make sense.

I'm not trying to be antagonistic or anything here! Just trying to verbalise what it might feel like, because I struggle with that myself.

@bluedodecagon I suppose I just thought MIL was a nice lady and trying to get along with dd, so I wanted her to show appreciation. She’s also here a lot visiting the grandchildren, so it’s easier if Dd can be polite when she’s here. I think I was not really fully understanding or listening to dd when she was telling me she didn’t like her and I thought she would change her view. I feel bad as MIL buys gifts for birthdays etc and I want dd to be welcoming.

I suppose I just thought MIL was a nice lady and trying to get along with dd, so I wanted her to show appreciation.

There is no "just" about showing appreciation. It's a complex skill requiring a lot of self control and modeling of other people's feelings and reactions and finding the right response under stress. Your DD doesn't have that, though with maturity and extra effort (as bluedodecagon explained) more of it will come to her.

Think of it in steps. First step might be no outright criticism - which might be possible if you warn DD and if MiL is warned not to push for a response (because she wont get the one she wants!) Then maybe a basic thank you. If you think DD doesn't know what to do then remind her ahead of time, in any case no putting her on the spot and no fuss or comments if she doesn't manage it or if her voice tone sounds like the social lie it is. One step at a time. Then maybe a bit about not criticising presents, acting pleased, etc. And maybe DD can't get ever all the steps in place all the time.

In the meantime if DD could write thankyou letters that will be a big win and it may actually be easier than for her than showing appreciation on the spot.

She’s also here a lot visiting the grandchildren, so it’s easier if Dd can be polite when she’s here.

You expect things to be easy? MiL can decide if she's going to take DD's words to heart or not and how much she wants to visit. Them's the breaks.

I think I was not really fully understanding or listening to dd when she was telling me she didn’t like her and I thought she would change her view.

She might change her view a bit as MiL adapts her own behaviour to be less in her face.Talking a lot may be quite distressing for DD even if that's not a reason that seems sensible to you. (I am not suggesting you say anything to MiL) You could tell MiL (as you would for a younger child) "she needs some quiet time, she'll look at the cake later".

I feel bad as MIL buys gifts for birthdays etc and I want dd to be welcoming.

No need for you to feel bad. You don't really control whether MiL buys presents or whether DD is welcoming or how MiL feels about any of it.

There are a few things you can do - like giving DD enough time and warning so she can moderate her behaviour. But you can't normalize everything and you don't have to feel bad about that.

@AmaryllisNightAndDay that’s a really clear explanation. Thank you. I am disappointed that although I feel I do understand dd most of the time, there are times when I just don’t get it.

The ‘yappy Yorkshire terrier’ description made me chuckle. dd just can’t cope with a lot of talking. I’m wondering how I can convey this to MIL, who is lovely and welcoming and really wants dd to like her. The more she pushes though, the worse it is as dd can’t cope.

It just sounds like a rather unfortunate clash of complex issues erupting. Some times there's just no amount of strategies that will prevent it.

Your DD understands the social expectations.
But the combination of DDs negative feelings towards MIL and MIL bringing the cake to fit in with her grand children's visit was reinforcing her belief. The shouting about it's her cake only and trying to eat massive slice to lessen what anyone else could have was her teetering on thr brink and unfortunately the enjoying cake comment sent her over the threshold.

It's not your fault, it's just not possible to script every scenario in advance. Hindsight is 20-20 and I've definitely experienced some rather difficult situations following a completely innocuous comment I've made.

I think you have DD occasions like her birthday to a controlled guest list, other occasions not.

A full OT assessment including sensory assessment may be helpful for emotional regulation strategies.

But what I really want to say is I think you sound like a great and understanding parent who is doing her absolute best to keep everyone happy.

Yes that is a really good post @ArianaDumbledore. dd feels that everything revolves around MIL’s real gc and she doesn’t have the maturity to handle her birthday not being completely her day. She was taking a huge slice to avoid sharing the cake, because it was for HER birthday. There are a lot of complex feelings there for dd, she’s clearly struggling with the wider blended family, along with the fact that MIL unfortunately irritates her. I’ve learned from the situation and I can mitigate things so it doesn’t happen again.

Just out of interest what's the plan for her after GCSE's? College? Or is she staying on. Remember camhs lasts until they are 18 and they are pushed to adult mental health which is a disaster zone.

I empathise with you. Under a different user name I had a long running thread on here about my ds1. He was sectioned for three years and is autistic. He was very unwell from 11-17. He has now completed a degree and works full time. Still dislikes people mind you and phones to say ' how do I sort this person? Or how I do say this.... without saying it my way'?

What I mean to say is there is hope. Be kind to yourself. I learnt you cannot refrain from addressing or dealing with things because you are frightened of what will happen. They soon catch on they have that power. God I used to feel sick with nerves. I also used to plan fun things to do that everyone hated :( I was desperate for normality.... but I gave up after a while. Let everyone do their own thing.

I have other children- another with autism and he presents differently. Try melatonin (sleep is so inportant) and try not to be afraid (I mean that kindly- I had the worst experiences) Ds3 is more cutting verbally- he refers to me as his ' cancer stricken' mother at the moment. I do have cancer but he reminds me every ten minutes. He then wants to know what's for tea. At the same time everyday. It's just the way he is- he would say factually correct.

Sorry if this is gabby. I do get it though. And it's tough.

She isn’t under CAMHS- they discharged her and we have now gone privately rather than go through CAMHS again. She’s got a place at college to do hairdressing. I’m not sure she’ll cope with hairdressing, but dd will have to learn that for herself. Perhaps she could cope with very part time/mobile work rather than a busy salon. I’m of the belief that dd will learn from her own choices in the outside world. She won’t be told what to do by me, so the therapy and support will hopefully enable her to choose wisely. I’m not sure she’ll even manage regular college attendance- she certainly can’t cope with mainstream school. But we will see.

Thank you so much for the supportive post - it helps to know I’m not alone.

I’m wondering how I can convey this to MIL, who is lovely and welcoming and really wants dd to like her. The more she pushes though, the worse it is as dd can’t cope.

How about just saying "DD needs a lot of space"? Or compare her to a cat - you have to wait for cats to come to you? I have a joky but quite realistic book somewhere called "All cats have Asperger's Syndrome"

College is very different and more ad hoc. Ds1 was desperate to go but hated and luckily I was a teacher at the time and managed to get him into the sixth form. He was testy at times and could be a pain but they overlooked a lot and he got his a levels.

All this from a boy they said would spend the rest of his life in hospital. Under section.

That’s amazing @Stomacharmeleon. That gives me hope. DD definitely isn’t academic enough for A levels - but I’m hopeful there will be a path for her. She’s desperate to work in the future.

She is definitely like a cat. That might be a good way to explain things to MIL. If I’m completely honest, although I like MIL, I also find her irritating. I guess it’s just intolerable for dd and she can’t hide it like I can.

@Justilou1

Hi *@Atypicaldancer*… my DD1 has also been newly diagnosed. (Although I have suspected for ages, it took a lot of fighting with DH who had head in the sand syndrome.) Like your DD, she is angry at the world as a result of her diagnosis and does not want this “difference”, but her response is only showcasing her symptoms. She does not feel safe or secure with her identity, but she needs to know that this diagnosis does not change who she is, or how you feel. It changes how she needs to learn to behave if she wants to live as an independent adult. You need to help her with this, and it’s hard work. You need to step up your boundaries, not compensate for her behaviour. She is going to have to learn to live in the real world, which will not accommodate for rudeness. You need to call her on this - calmly and in the moment, and there must be consistent, meaningful consequences (which will be painful to you until she knows it’s going to keep happening). “That was really rude. You deliberately hurt X’s feelings and embarrassed me. I know you are aware of this. I am taking your phone for 24hrs and you are not seeing BF this weekend. I expect you to apologize and moderate your behaviour. If you escalate, I will keep the phone for a week and you will not be seeing BF for a month. Do you understand?”

That approach would never work in a million years with my DS. I would never be that disrespectful to him either, it would feel so wrong. I agree about boundaries but not about trying to force your child to follow them by being horrible to them. In my experience autistic people just see straight through that kind of bull shit.

@Justilou1 - I appreciate you are doing your best with your DC. I'm not trying to directly attack you but that is my very honest opinion.

@bluedodecagon

I understand that you’re upset but it seems like you’re not really taking anyone’s advice. I completely agree that there are ignorant people here who don’t understand about autism but this isn’t really about autism, it’s about the family dynamics and the relationship between your DD and step grandmother.

I think you are not really acknowledging that you are anxiously trying to force the relationship between them and it’s backfiring. You basically caused this entire incident and completely set your daughter up to fail.

What you don’t seem willing to interrogate is why. Why do you need MIL to be close to DD? Why are you pushing them together? Even the flowers and gift to me seem like a bad idea. Over apologising doesn’t help MIL understand DD’s condition and reinforces the idea that she is just behaving badly which is not true.

Tbf, I think the OP has taken this advice on board. In fact she acknowledged it herself in her OP. I don't get the impression that she is trying to force them together atall. GM came round with a cake for DD and in the moment OP felt the social pressure for DD to thank her for it. It is as simple as that.

Yep there’s no way that would work with Dd either. It would escalate very quickly. She once took an overdose because she was so distressed at losing her phone (back in the days when I didn’t know she was autistic and I didn’t know how to handle her behaviour). She will run away, hurt herself or become angry and distressed. She can’t regulate her emotions at all, so she needs a very calm neutral face and proportionate responses.

I don’t think dd is angry about her diagnosis either.

@Stomacharmeleon

College is very different and more ad hoc. Ds1 was desperate to go but hated and luckily I was a teacher at the time and managed to get him into the sixth form. He was testy at times and could be a pain but they overlooked a lot and he got his a levels.

All this from a boy they said would spend the rest of his life in hospital. Under section.

Wow. That's great. I can't imagine hearing that about my DC. Well done to all of you!