Men should have the right to not want a baby

[user57639206]

NC as I've been shot down a few times in real life for having this opinion.

I find it bizarre that women can decide that they don't want a baby and opt for a termination (just to clarify, I completely agree with this. It's her right to choice) but when a man decides now isn't the right time, right partner or whatever the reason - he's labelled a arsehole, good for nothing or irresponsible.

Surely if a woman has the right to say "no, not right now/not for me" a man should have the same right? Without being labelled or judged!

I've seen it a few times in real life, be it from a one night stand or a not so serious relationship. The woman wants to keep the baby, the man says he doesn't (but doesn't suggest an abortion), and he's thrown under the bus.

I know there is a big difference in some sense because obviously, the woman goes through all the physical changes/trauma of having a baby - but when are men then taken to court for CA or have knives shoved in their backs for not wanting a baby?

AIBU?

@wanttomarryamillionaire

I have witnessed the consequences of a man being forced into parenthood when he didn't want to be. He is extremely resentful of the mother and doesn't want to know his child. He resents having a portion of his pay taken each month for a child he doesn't want. He will not be civil with the childs mother because he feels she forced this situation upon him and I would go as far as to say he actually hates her for it. He will not even acknowledge the child. Surely this is not healthy for anyone? He is full of resentment, the mother is effectively on her own facing a barrage of hatred/resentment and some day soon she is going to have to explain to her dd why she doesn't have a father and what exactly her father thinks of the whole situation. I don't see a happy outcome for anyone in this predicament.

So - again - what is the alternative?

Option A is that men can just abandon the children they bought into the world and be required to provide no financial support at all - meaning the child suffers for having a dickhead dad.

Option B is that men can force women to abort against their will.

RedCandyApple The approach you’re advocating - agreement for fathers to provide no money and have no contact - would not be best for the vast majority of DC.

Nor the taxpayers, since the state would have to pay benefits in the event of the mum no longer being able to afford it alone.

Except where men have been badly abusive, I don’t think mums who don’t pursue financial maintenance from their exes are doing their DC any favours.

@Loopytiles

RedCandyApple The approach you’re advocating - agreement for fathers to provide no money and have no contact - would not be best for the vast majority of DC.

Nor the taxpayers, since the state would have to pay benefits in the event of the mum no longer being able to afford it alone.

Except where men have been badly abusive, I don’t think mums who don’t pursue financial maintenance from their exes are doing their DC any favours.

So you think men should be forced to have contact with a child they don’t want? I already said I don’t judge others for claiming

41wanttomarryamillionaire

What do you think should have happened?

Even if you hate single mothers I don’t really see why the taxpayer should embrace the inevitable expensive of abandoned children with no money just so men don’t have to feel put out

Expense not expensive

@wanttomarryamillionaire

I have witnessed the consequences of a man being forced into parenthood when he didn't want to be. He is extremely resentful of the mother and doesn't want to know his child. He resents having a portion of his pay taken each month for a child he doesn't want. He will not be civil with the childs mother because he feels she forced this situation upon him and I would go as far as to say he actually hates her for it. He will not even acknowledge the child. Surely this is not healthy for anyone? He is full of resentment, the mother is effectively on her own facing a barrage of hatred/resentment and some day soon she is going to have to explain to her dd why she doesn't have a father and what exactly her father thinks of the whole situation. I don't see a happy outcome for anyone in this predicament.

Suspect the outcome of this longterm is the recognition that her Dad is an arse and that her mother did the best she could to ensure her DD was provided for financially.

I don't think that child would be better off emotionally if her mother didn't claim. Just poorer. If you don't want to pay maintenance have your child 50/50 and pay for what they need on your time.

A woman gets pregnant : she doesn't want the pregnancy, she aborts. No one's calling her a arsehole, irresponsible or awful.

There are whole groups crying murder about this, so you're wrong.

And as for saying he should wrap it up, or not have sex. Do you say the same about women who have unplanned pregnancies? That's it's their fault for having sex in the first place and they should have used all the contraception? Pretty sure that's a no.

Yes, and plenty do. I do judge women who do not use contraception and then cry about getting pregnant. That's basic biology.

@cinci

The disdain for single mothers runs so deep, people are arguing a man should be able to scram with no consequences as a punishment.

Feckless, stupid woman. If her and her child are deprived enough, she'll learn. Her fault for not aborting, look how easy it is.

Funny, because any of us could end up in a situation where the man is abusive or cheats, or leaves, or you have an unplanned pregnancy.

I'm certain you'll be singing a very different tune.

Don't procreate with deadbeats

@Nemorth

You see, men have it in their power to stop 100% of abortions/pregnancies in the future.

Really.

They absolutely could.

They could simply stop having penetrative sex with a fertile female

Ta-da

100% of abortions/pregnancies prevented immediately.

Spermjacking does happen. Also false paternity claims aren't uncommon.

You’ve got paternity tests for the false paternity and as for spermjacking I sincerely doubt the average man is in danger of that

Nice attitude @User135644

'Don't get into a relationship with someone who might choose to leave'. Helpful advice to women everywhere, you've just solved all the worlds problems!

@user57639206

I seriously want to clarify I am not saying a woman should be forced into anything. The complete opposite, there are a million and one reasons to abort or continue any pregnancy and each is so unique, so relative and completely down to the woman.

I'm just saying I think men should be able to walk away from an unplanned/unwanted pregnancy but everyone jumps down their throat.

As they should.

A child deserves the support of both parents, end of.

If you're a man, you take the chance of having a child to support if you engage in sex without ensuring you cannot get anyone pregnant.

I'm just saying I think men should be able to walk away from an unplanned/unwanted pregnancy but everyone jumps down their throat.

But in order for them to do that either you compromise the child's right to support from both parents or the woman's right to autonomy over her own body.

Which is it?

Don't procreate with deadbeats

You realise that many “deadbeats” aren’t like meds where they list their risks and side effects on their foreheads right so people know what they may be dealing with?

Would be nice though.

There is a huge amount of idealism and, dare I say, naivety on this thread.

I have been pregnant when I categorically did not want to be. It is the worst feeling in the world.

It happens to a lot of women. Thankfully we have options. Thank God we do - because being pregnant when you do not want to be is untenable.

A child deserves the support of both parents, end of.

I couldn’t agree with you more. It’s why I had an abortion when I wasn’t ready to make that commitment to a child.

If you're a man, you take the chance of having a child to support if you engage in sex without ensuring you cannot get anyone pregnant.

But what with us all - men and women - being mere humans - it just doesn’t work out like that. Does it?

We know it doesn’t.

So men who categorically are not ready to be - and do not want to be - fathers have the option of walking away. Many of them take that option.

Any women who finds herself with an unplanned pregnancy and decides to keep the baby knows that this is a possibility. She can hope the man will step up and want the baby, too.

But she can’t mind-think him in to doing it. Anymore than anyone could have persuaded me to keep the pregnancy I terminated.

@wanttomarryamillionaire

I have witnessed the consequences of a man being forced into parenthood when he didn't want to be. He is extremely resentful of the mother and doesn't want to know his child. He resents having a portion of his pay taken each month for a child he doesn't want. He will not be civil with the childs mother because he feels she forced this situation upon him and I would go as far as to say he actually hates her for it. He will not even acknowledge the child. Surely this is not healthy for anyone? He is full of resentment, the mother is effectively on her own facing a barrage of hatred/resentment and some day soon she is going to have to explain to her dd why she doesn't have a father and what exactly her father thinks of the whole situation. I don't see a happy outcome for anyone in this predicament.

It's okay, she'll grow up to know that men can't be trusted and to remain independent even if she chooses to have a relationship or children with one. Oh and she won't be one of these hand wringing handmaidens fretting about poor men having to wear condoms to have safe sex.

@user57639206

Again to clarify, I do not endorse forced abortions or pregnancy on any woman.

I'm say why can a man not just walk away without stigma???

How many women walk away without stigma if they have a baby but decide motherhood is not for them. A tiny minority.

My partner fell pregnant while she had the implant, so precautions were took but pregnancy still occurred - who's to blame here?

There are plenty of mothers out there who have left their child from birth and child has been raised by dad. I wouldn't be soo quick to pont the finger and judge these people, there are lots of different reasons and scenarios as to why this might happen. Perhaps abortion was too hard for that person didn't want to stop a life but wasn't ready for motherhood and knew that would be worse for the child. Should this person be labeled a dead beat or an arsehole? I don't believe so, so why should it be any different for a man?

Perhaps people are stuck in the past and believe that all dads are deadbeats because their old man wasn't around (mine wasn't) but that just isn't the case anymore. Times have changed but when it comes to fathers and their rights this has not changed very much at all and as fathers we are very much at the mercy of our baby mothers for contact and a general support network that should run both ways.

Women deliberately get pregnant to trap men (puncturing condoms, not taking their pill[this happened to me].) are the men who smelt a rat and moved on arseholes aswell?

I'm a father of two and am a massive part of my children's lives, however I don't judge people who aren't. My father was never around but I feel more fortunate that some of my friends whose father was around but awful because they didn't want to be there.

It's too easy to point and judge when you're stuck in your own little world without realising that there are soo many different scenarios to consider.

At the end of the day it should be a level playing field for both men and women, men have the choice to be there or not and women have the choice to keep or get rid, I don't feel anyone is in the wrong it balls down to what you want out of life and just because you had sex which everyone does shouldn't leave you at the mercy of someone

@Rdsdadmum

My partner fell pregnant while she had the implant, so precautions were took but pregnancy still occurred - who's to blame here?

There are plenty of mothers out there who have left their child from birth and child has been raised by dad. I wouldn't be soo quick to pont the finger and judge these people, there are lots of different reasons and scenarios as to why this might happen. Perhaps abortion was too hard for that person didn't want to stop a life but wasn't ready for motherhood and knew that would be worse for the child. Should this person be labeled a dead beat or an arsehole? I don't believe so, so why should it be any different for a man?

Perhaps people are stuck in the past and believe that all dads are deadbeats because their old man wasn't around (mine wasn't) but that just isn't the case anymore. Times have changed but when it comes to fathers and their rights this has not changed very much at all and as fathers we are very much at the mercy of our baby mothers for contact and a general support network that should run both ways.

Women deliberately get pregnant to trap men (puncturing condoms, not taking their pill[this happened to me].) are the men who smelt a rat and moved on arseholes aswell?

I'm a father of two and am a massive part of my children's lives, however I don't judge people who aren't. My father was never around but I feel more fortunate that some of my friends whose father was around but awful because they didn't want to be there.

It's too easy to point and judge when you're stuck in your own little world without realising that there are soo many different scenarios to consider.

At the end of the day it should be a level playing field for both men and women, men have the choice to be there or not and women have the choice to keep or get rid, I don't feel anyone is in the wrong it balls down to what you want out of life and just because you had sex which everyone does shouldn't leave you at the mercy of someone

What about the children? Does their right to be supported by both parents not count?

@Rdsdadmum great post, unfortunately you will get shot down in flames just for being a man and daring to have sex EVER.

Don't procreate with deadbeats

Yes, let us not seek to change the behaviour of the Deadbeats, they all wear a badge after all and never, ever lie about their intentions or change their minds after the fact.
Let them just continue safe in the knowledge that they shall not be held to any account for what they do and that their ability to reproduce is actually the woman's responsibility to deal with, and to bear the blame of the results.
The fact that this already happens in enough number and with enough regularity that the government pay benefits to single parents to ensure children have some support because so many men do not, in no way indicates that this is a problem and enables men to get away from their responsibility knowing they won't even be judged because the benefit scrounging single mum will be, never mind know that if they don't want to pay then they don't have to, and don't even have to be particularly imaginative about how to avoid it.

Nope, let's not seek to change that, let's seek to change the women's behaviour - maybe we'll all come to the conclusion that it's not worth having sex or relationships with men at all and the men will have to invest in some Kleenex instead.

At the end of the day it should be a level playing field for both men and women, men have the choice to be there or not and women have the choice to keep or get rid

Abortion is not contraception. Abortion is legal because it would be barbaric and inhumane to force a woman to carry a pregnancy she does not want. Pregnancy can result it disability, mental illness, life long health issues and even death. Abortion also comes with its own risks to health and mental health. Is it fair that all that falls upon the woman?

@Katie2017 @Rdsdadmum Do you have a limit to how many children a father should be able to wash his hands of? 10? 30? Unlimited?

@Rdsdadmum

You 'don't judge' men who aren't involved (deadbeats, then) but insist all women are out here poking holes in condoms? Or at least significantly more of these women than just plain old useless men?

Sabotaging contraception is sexual assault imo, but if you're using this as a blanket argument against men paying maintenance, this is very stupid. Like banning all abortions because some people misuse it (like for sec selection). Not really fair, is it.