Page 20 | To say the NHS should be privatised?

Momijin · 19/02/2022 05:05

Guard the NHS with your life.

TheresOnlyOneWay · 19/02/2022 05:31

The only reason it's the way it is right now, short staffed etc is because it isn't properly funded by this government. Their plan is for it to become such a shambles that they will then privatise it. I dread the day.

I would hate it if was privatised. We don't realise just how much private treatments costs - it's a fortune.
When my dad was having various treatment and operations etc before he died, It was so awful. Emotionally draining and heartbreaking.
But imagining having to pay for that treatment as well? It wouldn't have been possible.
It would have added a huge burden or stress, and we wouldn't have been able to afford it to be honest.

So many people don't realise how lucky we are to have the NHS and really take it for granted.

TheresOnlyOneWay · 19/02/2022 05:32

@Abhannmor

All my American friends are adamant the NHS should keep out private health providers. They speak from bitter experience.

Exactly this. I've heard some horror stories from American friends and they've all said the nhs here is like gold dust.

Flowersandjellybeans · 19/02/2022 05:35

Why does everyone ALWAYS jump to the conclusion the only alternative is the US system? That’s FOR profit, literally the extreme opposite of the NHS.

But there are many, many alternatives in between.

Berniesknittedmittens · 19/02/2022 05:51

@LouiseBelchersBunnyEars

There’s a myriad of different healthcare services in between the NHS and the American model.

They aren’t the only two options.

Other countries such as Canada also have free healthcare.

The problem with the MHS is mismanagement, and poor contracts, which were still paying interest on years after the fact.

I think you're extremely naive if you think we wouldn't have anything other than an American system. I'm sure Sajid Javid work for an American private healthcare firm.

SoNotRainbowRhythms · 19/02/2022 05:58

@SC215

I for one would rather pay more and receive a better quality service.

I'm sure everyone would. But when you find out how much stuff actually costs, you'll probably be a bit shocked.

Better hope you will always be able to afford it.

raspberryjamchicken · 19/02/2022 08:10

@Flowersandjellybeans

Why does everyone ALWAYS jump to the conclusion the only alternative is the US system? That’s FOR profit, literally the extreme opposite of the NHS.

But there are many, many alternatives in between.

True. But most of the ones people cite on here as examples, eg France, Switzerland, Germany are better because their governments spend more money on them than the UK government spends on the NHS. As has been pointed out, healthcare will only improve in this country if it is better funded by the government.

00100001 · 19/02/2022 08:23

@Flowersandjellybeans

Why does everyone ALWAYS jump to the conclusion the only alternative is the US system? That’s FOR profit, literally the extreme opposite of the NHS.

But there are many, many alternatives in between.

Quite. The German system is private and affordable.

Armadeus · 19/02/2022 08:39

I'm a HCP. How would privatising the NHS improve staffing levels and retention ?
I really can't understand why a practising nurse or medic would think that. Cock ups in care often arise from understaffing which then leads to poor communication, errors and corner cutting.I
And fwiw many trusts have implemented a 6 month probation for all staff so it is now much easier to sack incompetent staff.

tiredanddangerous · 19/02/2022 08:40

Boris? Is that you?

Brefugee · 19/02/2022 08:41

I for one would rather pay more and receive a better quality service

I'm sure it will be a thread full of this, but I'm not letting it go: nice to be you, eh?
Wind your neck in and get informed.

peboh · 19/02/2022 08:44

@Flowersandjellybeans

Why does everyone ALWAYS jump to the conclusion the only alternative is the US system? That’s FOR profit, literally the extreme opposite of the NHS.

But there are many, many alternatives in between.

Are people really so fun dim to believe that the moment our government privatise the nhs they wouldn't do it for profit? Of course we'd follow the American standard. They don't give a shit about healthcare, they care about the money. Which model is going to make them the most money.

whiteroseredrose · 19/02/2022 08:45

@Abhannmor

All my American friends are adamant the NHS should keep out private health providers. They speak from bitter experience.

But the American way isn't the only way. PIL are in Spain, there is no NHS but it is a mix of Insurance and state payment.

They don't pay for anything at the time and the care is massively better.

When MIL collapsed the ambulance was there within 5 minutes, all her bloods and tests were done at the hospital straight away and she had a follow up appointment with a Consultant a week later.

On the NHS she would be waiting weeks.

Armadeus · 19/02/2022 08:50

@ABitOfAShitShow you think wages will improve for staff if it was privatised . And that it would attract a 'better' type of medic ? It's already mainly privatised now in any case. Are you aware of how many failing services are provided by the likes of Virgin ? Anyone remember the fiasco surrounding Hinchinbrook hospital ?
And what happens to those of us who are not the poorest but merely poor ? At what point is the cut off because those who are just over it will suffer....

newbiename · 19/02/2022 08:51

@Cheekypeach Or something like, a £10 fee for GP appointments, £15 for consultant appointments, £300 bill for maternity services/birth etc. Everything having a small charge."

Even small amounts are unaffordable for some people.

What if you haven't got £10 for a GP appointment the day you need one ?

Would you be happy for people to be turned away at the door of AE if they didn't have £15 ?

You're diabetic- diabetics die in the USA because they can't afford insulin.

Alexandra2001 · 19/02/2022 08:56

Preferably only partially, but still. I was talking about this with DH yesterday who is adamant it should stay as it is. I said I don’t think it can survive in its current form, and I for one would rather pay more and receive a better quality service

The NHS already is partially privatised and as we can all see, it hasn't worked, pre CV we had 3m waiting for treatment, now its 6m, Javid thinks it will go up to 12m and wont reduce until 2025 :(

The social care system is completely privatised and that is a disaster, poor moral, v low wages, 150k staff vacancies...

So, i'm not entirely sure why you want more of a failed model?

We need to fund the NHS properly, recruit more staff, scrap tuition fees and do far more on preventative health.
Social Care needs to put back into the public sector, shouldn't be a "for profit" business.

Armadeus · 19/02/2022 08:57

@whiteroseredrose if she collapsed and needed an ambulance in the UK she would be taken to hospital and emergency care given, including bloods, ecgs etc.
The folk clamouring for a private insurance system forget that wages in Germany for example are higher, the housing and rental market is not as crazy, standard of life cheaper and better. Fine if you are healthy and well paid, not so much if you are not.

Original poster

Cheekypeach · 19/02/2022 08:59

@newbiename are you aware that the USA isn’t the only other country in the world? Genuinely?

OP posts:

FloBot7 · 19/02/2022 09:05

The disaster with the PPE contracts has already shown that those in government will allow their friends to profit massively at the expense of the public. Anyone who thinks privatisation means following the European way is naive. As soon as the service is private they'll claim they can't interfere with a private business. Look at what they haven't done to help with train prices, insurance premiums, energy prices and petrol. A season train ticket in France costs a tiny fraction of what it does here but we don't see the UK government trying to emulate that service either.

Armadeus · 19/02/2022 09:07

We are trying to say that with the current shower in government, raging free marketeers and linked with private health companies in the US, they are not going to look to european systems are they ? You are presuming they actually care about us....

Original poster

Cheekypeach · 19/02/2022 09:09

@Armadeus

We are trying to say that with the current shower in government, raging free marketeers and linked with private health companies in the US, they are not going to look to european systems are they ? You are presuming they actually care about us....

I never said I thought the tories should enact this, in fact I don’t want that at all as I know what you said is correct.

My question was stupidly worded

It should’ve been

‘Would you rather have a European-style healthcare system than the one we have now?’

OP posts:

DrBlackbird · 19/02/2022 09:09

Are people really so fun dim to believe that the moment our government privatise the nhs they wouldn't do it for profit? Of course we'd follow the American standard. They don't give a shit about healthcare, they care about the money. Which model is going to make them the most money

This ^ With bells on.

God it is so disheartening to read PP’s going on about other countries health care systems, which are embedded in different national cultures and different political parties, and different sets of checks and balances. As if any of these will be replicated here. You want those health care systems, then go live in those countries. Oh wait, because of another brilliant idea of this current Tory government, none of us can do that anymore (unless you’re a millionaire).

To those who voted 20% that the OP is NBU, do you just not care about the last two (10, more?) years of chumocracy mixed in with ineptitude, if not a bit of out and out seemingly corruption thrown in that’s been demonstrated by our Tory government?

Are you wilfully blind to the lies that are told and repeated ad nauseum? On training nurses and doctors, on building "new" hospitals? On that additional £350million a week promised for the NHS on the side of a bus.

Original poster

Cheekypeach · 19/02/2022 09:10

For fucks sake @DrBlackbird NOT THE TORIES I can’t say it anymore times

OP posts:

NannyOggsWhiskyStash · 19/02/2022 09:10

@VerbenaGirl

Have you seen the total dogs dinner resulting when small parts of it have been privatised? It needs collaboration and proper funding, not division.

This! The Tories have been underfunding the NHS for years, with the aim of selling it off, it's a fantastic resource and should be protected. I live in a country where it's all privatised and it is extortionate and certainly no better than the NHS.

Theluggage15 · 19/02/2022 09:13

People always say that the only other system the U.K. would move to is the US one, because they don’t want the shambolic NHS to change. It’s a way of trying to frighten people away from reform and shut down any discussion. Sad that they wish the U.K. to carry on receiving poor care and worse outcomes than European countries, but for them the NHS is a cult. They literally can’t discuss the NHS unless it’s to agree with them.