Virginia Guiffre and Andrew settle out of court

[Suzanne999]

From Metro
Prince Andrew and Virginia Giuffre have reached a ‘settlement in principle’ in the civil sex claim filed in the US, court documents show

Does this show his guilt? Water down in some way his actions? I’m sure some will say this proves she was only in it for the money. I think she and a lot of underage girls were abused but because of the wealth involved those guilty will never face justice. Can’t understand why I feel sad about this outcome.

Despite all the public rhetoric about trial and not settling this settlement must have been negotiated over several weeks - the size of payment and legal arguments over every word in the statement would have needed a lot of proposals and counterproposals, possibly with oversight by the Queen's advisors as well. The fact that the chalet was sold suggests preparation was early for the settlement. It all suggests both sides were willing to settle rather than risk the trial.

@ButterMeTimbers

Rousette, yeah, me too. I really love history and have an interest in royal history so, in theory, should be a royal fan because they are a continuation of it. But I'm not. The whole house of cards needs to tumble now. It belongs to a bygone age and, in my opinion, causes us more harm in holding us back in the dark ages, than it helps. The UK desperately needs to become a modern country, freed from the bloat of tradition, the over-reach of rich men and the pervasive influence that their corruption is having.

I have heard of that book and will admit to be too cowardly to read it. So much about the abuse of politics and power angers me, I'm not sure I need any more amunititon.

@ButterMeTimbers - I was over at my parents the other day and my stepdad (Irish) was going on about RF and various other titles families with estates (Duke of Westminster etc) who own huge swathes of land and their inherited wealth.

Stepdad thought all the land should be shared by the common people - which is a nice idea in theory.

I used to be a Royalist years ago but no more. I actually feel sorry for Meghan (not so much Harry) and I disliked her when all the hoo-ha about them was in the news.

Diana was bumped off no question about it etc...

Funny thing was years ago on DM's side my great however many times grandfather was a baron owning a vigneron in SW France (we think Dijon) - which is where our family name comes from, there's a picture of 3 swans on a pond/lake as the shield. They eventually had to leave France due to nobles being guillotined which is part of the reason I'm in England!

I've read a few of Ian Mortimer's books about land, nobles and other people who won battles got land, how villeins were unfree until they could buy their freedom etc and to be honest although most of us are free now - it still goes back to tradition and who owns what - e.g. Duke of Westminster, Bedford etc

Anyway all outdated and I think RF should go.

This woman has fought to raise awareness of the abuse and exploitation of young women by men in power. The power structures are against her... she does not have true freedom to bring these men to justice and has no reasonable expectation that Prince Andrew will stand up, make a public apology for the harm inflicted upon her and others. Please do not say.. 'It was all about the money'.. the decision to settle will have been made under pressure from lawyers, both those working on behalf of Prince Andrew, the cogs of the system that do not work in favour of women and those who are paid to represent her.. they will still be subject to the pressure of the system and those around them to settle this case and will have brought this pressure to bear on her.

PA was never going to testify. I'm amazed anyone would think he would. PA is not a sympathetic figure so whatever he said, it would look bad. No one is going to open themselves to that and possible questions asked to him about his mother. If people on here were being sued and defending themselves meant exposing parts of their life they wanted to protect, eg your children, I bet if they had the money, they too would settle. We've already has a royal court case where someone had to apologise for giving wrong information which opened them up to certain sectors of the media and the public accusing them of lying. Having a trial is a very dangerous game because courts are unpredictable.

Diana was bumped off, no question
This again? Dear lord.
She was in a speeding car with an intoxicated driver and she wasn't wearing a seatbelt. If she'd worn one, she probably would have survived.

Yup. So tedious.

Diana was bumped off no question about it etc...
🤔 By whom?

no-one needs to be embarrassed or disgusted for me thanks.

A civil case is 100% about money, either in her own pockets, or her charities.. it serves no other purpose.

Do i think Andrew did it, yes i do.. doesn't mean i see the point in her bringing a civil case. IMHO she should have dragged his ass through the criminal courts, so he could be punished properly.

I have a feeling that I read somewhere that her Dad dropped her off

I mean who would do that?

Just leave a teenager to go & massage a middle aged man

She wasn't qualified-and that didn't ring alarm bells to him?

Basically, if it's too good to be true...

I didn't realise VG had reunited with her father, apparently he worked at Mar-a-Lago. He got her a job there and that is where she met Maxwell. So:
a) It is not quite how you make it sound; and
b) VG had by that time been in various foster homes, sexually abused and had lived on the streets. Add in to that mix the absence of good parenting in her life and you have a young person ripe for grooming.

At the age of 14, Giuffre reunited with her father and returned to live with him. Her father worked as a maintenance manager at theMar-a-Lagoproperty owned byDonald Trump, and also helped Giuffre obtain a job there.[11]

Association with Epstein (2000–2002)

In the summer of 2000,[21][22]Giuffre first metGhislaine Maxwellwhen working as a spa attendant at Donald Trump's private Mar-a-Lago club while reading a book about massage therapy.[16]

Sorry didn't mean to cut and paste that from wiki.

IMHO she should have dragged his ass through the criminal courts, so he could be punished properly

It would have been up to the equivalent of the crown prosecution service to take time to criminal courts.
They would have needed evidence, and the ability to "prove beyond all reasonable doubt" that he had sex with her, and he knew she was trafficked and the pressure on her.
Did she say No or stop at any point?

The lawyers would have made her feel like shit. How many men did she sleep with, before an outwith Epstein, why did she recruit others?

Lots of it would be her word vs his. And impossible to prove. The chances of it being proven in a criminal court is incredibly low.

IMHO she should have dragged his ass through the criminal courts, so he could be punished properly

How could she have done that? Civilians do not decide on who does or doesn't get prosecuted. Also I think the USA's Statute of Limitations applied to this case, but I may be wrong on that.

@ClaudineClare

I have a feeling that I read somewhere that her Dad dropped her off

I mean who would do that?

Just leave a teenager to go & massage a middle aged man

She wasn't qualified-and that didn't ring alarm bells to him?

Basically, if it's too good to be true...

I didn't realise VG had reunited with her father, apparently he worked at Mar-a-Lago. He got her a job there and that is where she met Maxwell. So:
a) It is not quite how you make it sound; and
b) VG had by that time been in various foster homes, sexually abused and had lived on the streets. Add in to that mix the absence of good parenting in her life and you have a young person ripe for grooming.

At the age of 14, Giuffre reunited with her father and returned to live with him. Her father worked as a maintenance manager at theMar-a-Lagoproperty owned byDonald Trump, and also helped Giuffre obtain a job there.[11]

Association with Epstein (2000–2002)

In the summer of 2000,[21][22]Giuffre first metGhislaine Maxwellwhen working as a spa attendant at Donald Trump's private Mar-a-Lago club while reading a book about massage therapy.[16]

Isn't this how they were able to be so successful at abusing young women? I'm sure a lot of people at the time considered GM and JE to be very respectable people (mixing with royalty, presidents etc) and would have assumed that they had no reason to question or fear an offer of work in a spa for a young woman who showed an interest in massage therapy. It must have been very easy for GM to dress this up as wanting to help a disadvantaged person. Add to that selecting a victim with a history of abuse and family problems- so they are more less likely to challenge when their boundaries are pushed and more likely to fear what will happen if they speak out.

As a pp mentioned, this is all strikingly similar to the methods used by the Rochdale gangs etc. Other than GM/JE were better funded and surrounded by the sort of people that a young, vulnerable woman would have expected to protect her.

Why so many comments blaming anyone except the men who raped trafficked teenagers?

At the end of the day this settlement just means that he is innocent and can get on with his life. It's often better for someone who has been falsely accused of something to pay a settlement rather than win in court; court cases are incredibly expensive and personal details get shared publicly even if you are eventually found not guilty.

Everyone should be happy with this outcome, the claimant has got the payout she was always looking for and all parties can move on.

@Roussette

Yep. It is ridiculous. For me Andrew is the final nail in the coffin for the RF going forward. This is obviously some sort of deal agreed by Charles and William... let Camilla be Queen and I'll okay all this dosh being paid out. All I'll say is... Charles is gonna have a helluva uphill struggle to rehabilitate the RF. For me anyway.

Nail. Head.

Oh come on! You want us to believe that innocent men pay out millions of pounds to their accusers.
And yes personal details of other wrongdoing do often come out in these sorts of trials.

the claimant has got the payout she was always looking for and all parties can move on

@MorningStarling

At the end of the day this settlement just means that he is innocent and can get on with his life. It's often better for someone who has been falsely accused of something to pay a settlement rather than win in court; court cases are incredibly expensive and personal details get shared publicly even if you are eventually found not guilty.

Everyone should be happy with this outcome, the claimant has got the payout she was always looking for and all parties can move on.

The settlement does not mean Prince Andrew is innocent.

Very good explanation on Americast podcast today. They described this as completely expected given the US legal system, and it’s about the best that both parties could expect

At the end of the day this settlement just means that he is innocent

Course it does.

@Gonnagetgoing

and now VG is silenced until later in the year so the Queen can have her jubilee celebrations.

This country makes me sick.

No wonder the French had a revolution and the guillotine.

I emphatically agree. It makes me sick, too.

Women are not responsible for the abusive behaviour of men and it's not his mother's fault that he chose to associate with traffickers like Epstein and Maxwell. But consider this outcome and her part in it. Whether her input is merely monetary or in terms of the caveat protecting her precious jubilee, it far from covers her in glory, either. Add to that the retaining of his numerous honorary titles and patronages (whilst immediately stripping her grandson of his on a far less serious pretext), continuing to keep him in his pointless trade ambassador role AFTER he'd been seen and photographed with the then-convicted Epstein, not to mention shielding him whilst he engaged in the farcical pantomime of ducking and diving and avoiding service of the papers. She's a disgrace.

I'm not buying for one instant that his family didn't know precisely what he was. Some parents unfortunately believe their darling boys are entitled to take exactly what they like, and Andrew shows every trait of having been raised in this particular mould. His mother - who some people uncomprehendingly revere - has been complicit throughout.

Even in the face of this thoroughly shameful episode people still persist in this baffling, misguided loyalty to dear old queenie, gawd bless 'er. Bad news: the establishment is rotten to the core and Elizabeth Windsor is exactly the same as the rest of them.

@ButterMeTimbers

At the end of the day this settlement just means that he is innocent

Course it does.

Is that you Fergie showing your understanding of the US legal system?

Some shameful shit here. I used to support the RF but not any more. It's the same disgusting story of older men taking what they want from younger women. If the Queen pays a penny of the settlement it will be a total outrage. They are an extremely dysfunctional family and I don't see why they should live lives of insane privilege partly on the taxpayers expense. It's time to abolish all of them into the obscurity they deserve.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks I too refuse to believe the Queen had no idea what Andrew was up to.