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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To have shouted at MIL for being racist?

189 replies

Eurydice84 · 01/02/2022 09:40

MIL has many annoying habits. One of them (which has been going on for a while) is that she mocks Italian accent and gestures (I am Italian). This could be funny from a friend once in a while, but the way she does it - when talking to DD, whom I am raising bilingual, and in a sneaky way - really upsets me. DH told her more than once that I hate it and she should stop.

Anyway yesterday she was doing it a lot. At first I made some subtle comments it should stop, then DH had a word, but it carried on so I lost it and shouted at her. I said it is disrespectful, borderline racist and if she carries on she is not welcome in my house anymore. She then left without having dinner, after DH also said she was out of order.

I feel I was wrong at shouting, but I felt really violated and needed to stand up for myself. I went through all the alternative options first (DH having a word, etc).

Now it's an incredibly awkward situation as she lives quite close and I am dreading having to see this woman again. She looks after DD once a week.... not sure I can cope with it anymore!

OP posts:
pudcat · 01/02/2022 10:25

I would be very worried about what your MIL is saying when you are not there.

Original poster
Eurydice84 · 01/02/2022 10:25

@BlondeDogLady

At first I made some subtle comments it should stop, then DH had a word, but it carried on so I lost it and shouted at her. I said it is disrespectful, borderline racist and if she carries on she is not welcome in my house anymore

You've taken it way too far, imo. Some things can't be unsaid and you were pretty brutal.

I love an Italian accent. So do most people - it's seen as one of the sexiest accents on the planet.

Your MIL is lonely. And now she will be even more lonely, and upset to boot. I wouldn't be happy with myself if I had done this.

MIL feels lonely sometimes and we invite her for dinner once or twice a week and arranged this childcare day for her so she is happy.

But this does not give her the right to be disrespectful.

OP posts:
AmaryllisNightAndDay · 01/02/2022 10:25

It might be helpful if someone close to you, other than your husband, has a word with her and explains it all to her thoroughly.

It is exactly the OP's husband's role to tell his mother that she cannot insult his wife and expect to be welcome in his house. And that she needs to apologise wholeheartedly to the OP before she can visit again.

And I would not allow anyone who habitually racially insulted me or my spouse to care for my child. I would pay for childcare where that kind of behaviour is illegal.

Tulips21 · 01/02/2022 10:27

Good for you Op.
Don't feel guilty and don't apologise.
I would put my DD in nursery for the extra day, MIL has prooven multiple times , that she is bullying you and in effect, your daughter too.

BitcherOfBlakiven · 01/02/2022 10:28

She’s not just mocking your heritage, she’s mocking her own grandchild. I’d find other childcare.

namethattunein1 · 01/02/2022 10:28

@BlondeDogLady

At first I made some subtle comments it should stop, then DH had a word, but it carried on so I lost it and shouted at her. I said it is disrespectful, borderline racist and if she carries on she is not welcome in my house anymore

You've taken it way too far, imo. Some things can't be unsaid and you were pretty brutal.

I love an Italian accent. So do most people - it's seen as one of the sexiest accents on the planet.

Your MIL is lonely. And now she will be even more lonely, and upset to boot. I wouldn't be happy with myself if I had done this.

"Your MIL is lonely. And now she will be even more lonely, and upset to boot. I wouldn't be happy with myself if I had done this.."

She's lonely because she's a fucking racist bully. I wouldn't let her ANYWHERE near a biracial child. What fucking poison will be giving to the child? If you think mocking Italian accent and gestures is OKAY, I guess if someone mocks an Indian accent and gestures its OKAY or speaks in a West Indian accent and gestures its fucking OKAY?

What planet are you on @BlondeDogLady

SandAndSea · 01/02/2022 10:29

I think you were right to stand up for yourself and that it is now for her to apologise to you.

HaveringWavering · 01/02/2022 10:34

She sounds really thick. Do you by any chance have a few burly Italian brothers who could have a word?

Soul11Soul · 01/02/2022 10:35

You need to get back on an even keel with her for the sake of your husband and your child or life might get very very tricky for you all. How do you want the future to look in terms of your relationship with her? How does that differ from how your husband's sees the relationship going? It is the difference in these two views that are going to cause issues.

In your shoes I would be tempted to apologise for shouting BUT I would be very clear about your boundaries. She is not to mock your accent or gestures again because you find it hurtful and inappropriate. You also can not imagine that she would deliberate hurt her grandchild, but by mocking her mother that is exactly what she is doing and you can't allow that to happen.

TopsieGreenwood · 01/02/2022 10:35

Agree she sounds really thick

AllOfUsAreDead · 01/02/2022 10:36

Do not feel guilty, you aren't allowed to. She deserved what she got. She was completely out of line, always has been. Maybe thats why she is lonely, she's a bitch and no one wants to be her friend. Can't blame them.

To those defending her, you're racist too. Can't believe you'd actually defend someone doing this it's disgusting. How about you lot tell us what your accent is and we just make a thread taking the piss out of you? Post your picture too, jokes are fine apparently, let's mock how you look too. Hmm Horrible behaviour, no wonder Britain is going downhill. Full of racist knob heads who think they are funny.

ChangingLife · 01/02/2022 10:37

Well I disagree that you've taken way too far.

I've had similar issues iwth my own parents and I've told them how hurtful it was.
Yes it will ackward but SHE created the situation when she refused to listen to both you and your DH, her own son.
She wasn't lovely.
It's not lovely to mock somene else accent.
It's not lovely to mock your own DIL for her accent.
It's not lovely to mock the mother of grand daughter.

That's down right xenophobic.

It's reminding that person that they are not 'one of us'. It's putting people back in their place in the same way that you would ask someone who is not white 'but where are you REALLY from?'.

I would hope that it would help her see the issue but I doubt it will, at lkeast from my nw experiuence with my parents. However, you can agree that some subjects have to be avoided, including any comments on accent whatever way they are made.
I'd also leave the room/house with your dd whenever she doesn't stop despite been told to stop (one reminder will be enough too).
And I would review your arrangemnet for 'childcare'. I wouldn't want someone who is mocking me/my origins to my child doing any childcare unsupervised tbh.

DisforDarkChocolate · 01/02/2022 10:37

This isn't borderline racist, it is racist.

honeyrider · 01/02/2022 10:37

You gave her so many chances yet she continued horrible.

I'm not surprised she's lonely as most decent people would keep away from such a bully.

I wouldn't trust her with her looking after your little one, she'd only drip her poison and undermine you.

Do not apologies, she's the one that owes you an apology.

Original poster
Eurydice84 · 01/02/2022 10:37

@HaveringWavering

She sounds really thick. Do you by any chance have a few burly Italian brothers who could have a word?
I have an Italian brother, he's quite thin and slender though Grin
OP posts:
5zeds · 01/02/2022 10:40

Stand your ground OP. I put up with a lot of low level racism from my family about my husbands background for a long time. I deeply regret it and wish I’d been more direct. Expect unconditional support from your husband and I hope he gives it harder and faster than I did. Remember that when she is rude about your origins she is also attacking your child’s. She’s been asked politely and refused to comply now you have asked impolitely and she has removed herself. Either she changes her behaviour or she can’t be around abusing you and her grandchildren’s heritage.

You did the right thing.

namethattunein1 · 01/02/2022 10:41

@Dguu6u

She’s being awful (and xenophobic, not racist, but just as bad), well done for standing up to her.
Racism is when a person is treated worse, excluded, disadvantaged, harassed, bullied, humiliated or degraded because of their race or ethnicity.

Would it be xenophobic if a white or black person took the piss out of an Indian accent and perceived body gestures? No, it would be racist.

Italians are an ethnic group, regardless where they live or their nationality. The MIL is humiliating her based on her ethnicity.

ChangingLife · 01/02/2022 10:41

@Soul11Soul

You need to get back on an even keel with her for the sake of your husband and your child or life might get very very tricky for you all. How do you want the future to look in terms of your relationship with her? How does that differ from how your husband's sees the relationship going? It is the difference in these two views that are going to cause issues.

In your shoes I would be tempted to apologise for shouting BUT I would be very clear about your boundaries. She is not to mock your accent or gestures again because you find it hurtful and inappropriate. You also can not imagine that she would deliberate hurt her grandchild, but by mocking her mother that is exactly what she is doing and you can't allow that to happen.

Yes her DH has a role to play there.

But I disagree about the aplogy. If anyone shoud aplogize, it's the MIL to have taken such a xenophobic attitude. This is not OK and should never be OK.

You also can not imagine that she would deliberate hurt her grandchild, but by mocking her mother that is exactly what she is doing and you can't allow that to happen.

And this is the exact reason why she shouldnt be allowed unsupervised access to the child.

Fwiw I've raised my dcs in a similar position. They are likely going to get some commenst from their peers about their mum not being british. My dcs certainly have throughout their school years. They are STILL not seen as fully british (despite having a british father and having never lived anywhere but the small town where they were born). The OP's dd really doesnt need to have a grandmother who is reinforcing the idea that she doesnt really belong here.

Subbaxeo · 01/02/2022 10:42

She talks in a fake Italian accent to you? That is so bad-I think you’ve been very restrained. Would she do that to a work colleague who came from another country? Don’t apologise for your reaction-people need to know in no uncertain terms about their upsetting behaviour if more diplomatic means haven’t worked.

Ozanj · 01/02/2022 10:42

I think you did the right thing. But I do think you need to do the right thing in all situations when it comes to stereotyping not just the easy target of an elderly woman - that means calling it out every single time your friends do it (it’s never for fun - they’re taking the piss out of you) and in Italy, if your friends / family do the same for an English accent you absolutely need to do the same. I think as your DP I’d be really pissed off if you yelled at my mum for being racist but then let similar comments slide if they came from others.

saygeronimo · 01/02/2022 10:42

@BlondeDogLady

At first I made some subtle comments it should stop, then DH had a word, but it carried on so I lost it and shouted at her. I said it is disrespectful, borderline racist and if she carries on she is not welcome in my house anymore

You've taken it way too far, imo. Some things can't be unsaid and you were pretty brutal.

I love an Italian accent. So do most people - it's seen as one of the sexiest accents on the planet.

Your MIL is lonely. And now she will be even more lonely, and upset to boot. I wouldn't be happy with myself if I had done this.

Dear God, how many chances should the MIL get when she's been clearly told her behaviour is just downright rude and offensive to her DIL and DGD?! If she's lonely and wants her family to want her around, then she needs to sort her behaviour out!

OP I think you did the right thing. If she's offended by what you said and won't apologist, then shes made her bed and will just have to bloody lie in it.

Lalliella · 01/02/2022 10:43

@HaveringWavering

She sounds really thick. Do you by any chance have a few burly Italian brothers who could have a word?
I don’t think OP needs any brothers or any other men to help her out. She’s dealt with the situation very well on her own.
TrashyPanda · 01/02/2022 10:43

@BlondeDogLady

At first I made some subtle comments it should stop, then DH had a word, but it carried on so I lost it and shouted at her. I said it is disrespectful, borderline racist and if she carries on she is not welcome in my house anymore

You've taken it way too far, imo. Some things can't be unsaid and you were pretty brutal.

I love an Italian accent. So do most people - it's seen as one of the sexiest accents on the planet.

Your MIL is lonely. And now she will be even more lonely, and upset to boot. I wouldn't be happy with myself if I had done this.

Some things can’t be unsaid- how very true. Like mocking someone’s accent and therefore their heritage. And doing it repeatedly is even worse. And continuing to do it when you have been told you are racist/xenophobic is just pure nastiness And still doing it when you know it upsets the person - at this point, you deserve to be told exactly how out of line you are, that you are an ignorant, stupid person and that until you can educate yourself and show you have learnt your lesson, then you are not welcome.

OP did not say anything brutal. She spoke the truth.
And anyone belittling that is tacitly condoning MILs racism/xenophobia

diddl · 01/02/2022 10:44

She mocks you to your daughter?

What the hell goes on when she does childcare?

Protect your daughter from her!

Lalliella · 01/02/2022 10:45

@BlondeDogLady

At first I made some subtle comments it should stop, then DH had a word, but it carried on so I lost it and shouted at her. I said it is disrespectful, borderline racist and if she carries on she is not welcome in my house anymore

You've taken it way too far, imo. Some things can't be unsaid and you were pretty brutal.

I love an Italian accent. So do most people - it's seen as one of the sexiest accents on the planet.

Your MIL is lonely. And now she will be even more lonely, and upset to boot. I wouldn't be happy with myself if I had done this.

What on earth? OP didn’t take it too far at all. MIL had it coming. She’s a xenophobic bully. It’s hardly surprising she’s lonely, she deserves to be.