Pregnant 'person' emoji, for gender inclusivity.

[Indigofig]

www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-10451689/Apple-adopts-latest-emoji-including-pregnant-MAN.html

I know it is DM, but this has really angered the feminist in me. AIBU to feel like this? Or is it justified?

You can't redefine biology. This is gender appropriation and before anybody comes at me that that's not a thing it should be because this is making a mockery out womanhood.

’The most womanly act possible'?

In that ONLY women can do it. That doesn’t mean that if a woman cannot/does not conceive and bear a child, that she is not a woman.

Just that being pregnant is something ONLY a woman can do.

Personally, I'd rather they addressed race. Thw couple and family emojis are all yellow. Would be good to get that addressed first. I am sure there are alot more black/mixed race families and couples than men with wombs.

@FOJN

I think trans women have their own experiences that cis-women don't.

You are at liberty to describe yourself however you like but do not cis the entire female sex class. It is offensive to add a qualifier to my biological sex in order to validate another person's experience (particularly when I wasn't asked if I minded the re-brand) there are women and transwomen; no space, they are their own thing, not a subset of women, unless you are transphobic and need to erase their transness as if there is something wrong with it.

Cis is used in relation to gender so if you automatically cis gender a woman you may misgender her. I am female, I reject gender, do not cis me.

Fantastic post @FOJN

Thank you

I don't agree with gender neutral toilets as I think openly inviting men into an area we are vulnerable in is safe in the slightest but I also don't exclude trans-women from female toilets.

Goodness me the reality of self ID will be one hell of a shock for you if it becomes law. All a man has to do is say he identifies as a woman to get legal recognition as one, yes even 6 foot 4 Dave with a beard and male pattern baldness, no nail polish or evidence of feminine feels required.

@LaChanticleer

’The most womanly act possible'?

In that ONLY women can do it. That doesn’t mean that if a woman cannot/does not conceive and bear a child, that she is not a woman.

Just that being pregnant is something ONLY a woman can do.

Yes, like having periods. Sick of being referred to as a "menstruator" (in fact I don't even have periods anymore), but come on, I'd rather they used the term "biological female" instead of woman if the W word is so offensive.

I know quite a few trans people and none of them are delusional to think they are not biologically one sex or another, despite identifying with a gender they weren't assigned at birth along with their sex. It's madness.

M to F KNOW they still have a prostate, are still at risk of prostate cancer, still have testicles and are at risk of testicular cancer. F to M KNOW they still have ovaries and a cervix and are at risk of issues with those organs. You cannot ignore your bio sex.

None of the trans people I know have gone through full reassignment surgery, of course.

Yes, this new emoji is obviously Very Important and Needed, not pandering woke nonsense.

@Waitwhat23

I don't agree with gender neutral toilets as I think openly inviting men into an area we are vulnerable in is safe in the slightest but I also don't exclude trans-women from female toilets.

There's an amazing amount of cognitive dissonance in this comment.

And as an aside, the term 'cis' in relation to gender is made up nonsense. Women object to being told that they must refer to themselves by a nonsense term while being threatened with loss of employment for not going along with preferred pronouns.

The problem is gender neutral is used instead of mixed sex.

Its a euphemism.

If we said mixed sex instead of gender neutral at every opportunity, there would be a raising of eye brows.

The problem ultimately is, its deemed political acceptable to support single gender rights. You wouldn't get the same level of support if you said mixed sex.

@PinkyU

Correct, men can’t get pregnant. Transmen can though, that is who (amongst others) is being represented here.

If you avoided the hyperbole it would be much easier to have your views acknowledged, most women don’t feel any impact of inclusive language, acts or laws so when you use words like “write us off, wipe us out” you lose so much traction. You might not care, you might view this as me saying “be nice” but you want people/women to open their eyes, your approach is making us close our ears.

@PinkyU are you saying transmen aren't men? How transphobic. 🤔

I think it’s quite funny. Not sure who they are trying to represent with the hands with bright yellow skin tones that look like the Simpsons; maybe the jaundiced community (if they are somehow meant to be Asian, that’s a lot more racist than ‘inclusive’).

@RedToothBrush yep. Unisex is another term that seems to be used in order to fudge the reality that it is, in reality, mixed sex.

Unisex, mixed gender, gender neutral, genderless...all in reality, mixed sex.

The concept of womanhood has changed throughout history and is different is different cultures and societies

Yet but every women was FEMALE.

Stop trying to shoehorn a subset of men into our sex class.

Womanhood isn't a fucking performance or a special feeling men can have too.

Validating anorexic dysmorphia doesn't have a better outcome for the person. Validating a transperson's dysphoria does

What utter bollocks.

Most teens with dysphoria grow out of it. Disproving the whole innate feeling narrative, so why would you affirm something that is obviously false?

All this does is stop the issues causing the dysphoria from being dealt with and does not help in the long term. It simply masks the underlying issues which won't helped with drugs and surgery.

Lying to children will not make them mentally healthy adults.

YANBU, others have put it much better than I could, but it is ridiculous.

What I actually want to say I cant, cos it'd probably be deleted.

I just worry for my kids. It feels like they are being indoctrinated.

When I was younger I didnt realise only women got pregnant. I thought women had baby girls and men had baby boys. Obviously I worked it out as I got older.

Its just going to be a lot harder for our kids.

Also just a “woman” here and find “cis” offensive.

@Porfre

What I actually want to say I cant, cos it'd probably be deleted.

I just worry for my kids. It feels like they are being indoctrinated.

When I was younger I didnt realise only women got pregnant. I thought women had baby girls and men had baby boys. Obviously I worked it out as I got older.

Its just going to be a lot harder for our kids.

Sounds like your biology teacher was woke and would fit in nicely these days!

@1Week

harrystylestaylorswift How do you square all that with the fact that MtF people retain the same pattern of criminal and sexual violence as men? How would you propose we deal with predators adopting a trans identity for the purposes of peeping, say, in single sex spaces, all the way up to rape?

I'm trying to find some recent evidence on this but can't, that is why I haven't addressed it. But even without statistics, you cannot seriously think that trans women are anywhere near as much of a threat in everyday life to women as men are. Every single woman has a story to tell about horrible men, from 'minor' harrassment like a wolf-whistle or objectifying comment that we're meant to brush off as flattering, to sexual assault, DV, and murder in the worst case scenarios. Of course there are criminals of all races, religions, sexual orientations and identities. However men are predatory without needing to adopt a trans identity. I agree that if someone who was convicted of a crime as a man suddenly decides that they identify as a woman to be placed in a women's prison, that isn't safe and the situation needs to be thoroughly assessed to ensure that the women prisoners' safety is paramount. I do not think that these waste-of-space low lives are representative of the majority of trans women who just want to live a peaceful life in the body they feel comfortable in. I agree that if you simply identify as a woman but have the testosterone levels of a man, biology is not on your side and it is unfair to compete in sports competitions as a woman because sporting ability is based on biology, not pronouns. I am from the UK so I would be interested on any recent statistics that show that MtF trans people commit crimes against women at the same rate that men do in this country (obviously I know it would be proportional as there are a lot more men than trans women). I can't speak for everyone but not a single one of my friends has ever had a bad experience with a MtF transgender person, nor have I. We have however had countless horrible experiences with actual men.

@HTH1

Also just a “woman” here and find “cis” offensive.

Why do you find it offensive? It literally just means that your sex and gender align. Nobody is saying you aren't a woman.

harrystylestaylorswift

Why do you find it offensive? It literally just means that your sex and gender align.

Explained at length at 21.34. Who are you to assume anything about someone else's gender and whether they have one?

Cis is a Latin prefix which means 'on this side of' and is used (correctly) in scientific research to refer to chemical bonds. It was co-opted (incorrectly) as an antonym for trans in around 1994 and is a nonsense, made up term being used to make women a sub set of their sex class.

Women are saying 'no, I don't want to be referred to as cis as its nonsense' but are being told 'tough and if you object, you will be told you are being ridiculous/hysterical/transphobic ect etc.'

No.

Why do you find it offensive? It literally just means that your sex and gender align. Nobody is saying you aren't a woman.

I wouldn't say it's offensive really (to me, pp does), but people don't like it. Somebody said it's like a religious person calling you a sinner.

Regardless what the justification is (we're all sinners/Cis is just a word) they don't want it, and it's their preference.

I don't like how people try and slyly sneak it into everyday language and try and give it validity. Because as soon as one uses that word, your already assuming the gender stuff is the truth belief, likewise with the religion analogy.

It’s another example of the coastal erosion that is misogyny in my view. So pervasive that it underpins and informs a cynical narrative that rotates around the reorientation of gender for some men.

Makes me feel ill and angry
When will the ironic obliteration of identity for many to appease a few stop?

@harrystylestaylorswift
There is already a word that describes me and it is woman.

No extra description is necessary. You know nothing of my gender or whether I even have one.

And what @FOJN said. It's hypocritical for those who say 'don't assume' to then assume what others are or believe in. You've got to check someone is cis beforehand.

Somebody said it's like a religious person calling you a sinner.

I'd say it goes further than that. It's more like a religious person making you refer to yourself as a sinner.