Is it illegal to kill a wild animal at work?

[SilverDoe]

Posting for traffic. Is illegal/possible to pursue for animal cruelty if someone kills a wild animal in their work place?

I have been googling but I can only find information really regarding livestock and pets.

@derxa

Oh FFS, there’s always one on every bloody thread - the obligatory reminder that we are still ‘IN A PANDEMIC’ 🤣 I'm in the Socialist Republic of Scotland where masks are mandatory. Nicola demands that I stumble around shops wearing steamed up glasses. If a magpie popped into the shop, I'd probably step on it because I can't see a bloody thing.

Weirdly, I'm in Scotland and wear a mask for up to 8 hours per day with no glasses steaming and never see anyone stumbling around.

Weirdly, I'm in Scotland and wear a mask for up to 8 hours per day with no glasses steaming and never see anyone stumbling around. Well done

[quote DrFoxtrot]I think it needs reporting somewhere, there was a case local to me where a McDonalds employee killed a seagull hanging around the bins and he was prosecuted. Maybe speak to the RSPCA for advice.

I've skim read OPs posts and gather there is tension on the thread and questions re hamsters. But sticking to the OP, I agree seek further advice from a body like the RSPCA or council.

www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/news/crime/fleetwood-mcdonalds-worker-killed-seagull-in-violent-attack-because-he-was-sick-of-its-daily-visits-3023746[/quote]
Well, that's a very unpleasant story and the man was quite rightly prosecuted for cruelty to wild animals. However, there was an eyewitness at the time who called the police - unlike in the alleged incident described by OP (and what she-says-her-H-heard could equally turn out to be referring to the manager having called a pest control company who legally despatched the bird as it could to an account of him having killed it himself, perhaps with unnecessary violence).

But the main thing that is concerning about this thread is the number of posters who appear to think that due process is never necessary, that it's fine to 'name and shame' people on the basis of overheard gossip and that WAAA some crimes are so BAWWW hideous that BOOHOO conviction on the grounds of accusation is perfectly acceptable. I have seen this sort of dangerous self-righteousness elsewhere and it is never going to end well for anyone. Particularly when people who are MORE HORRIFIED THAN ANYONE start insisting that even asking about evidence, proper procedures, witnesses etc means you probably commit similar crimes yourself on a daily basis or (most terrible of all sins) you 'don't CAAAAAARE'.

@Wreath21 I haven't had time to read the whole thread, I could tell there were tensions.

I agree that there is a lack of evidence but it's worth OP speaking to a professional body who can advise her further. It might not go anywhere but at least she can feel she went down the correct route.

@Wreath21 but the op hasn't named and shamed him. She's made a report to the company so that they can investigate and search for this evidence that you are so keen on. If she'd plastered his name and alleged crime all over Facebook you might have a point but that isn't what happened.

Based on a reasonable level of suspicion - I.e having heard staff discussing it, the bird being gone etc - do you not think this should be at least looked into? If the guy is proven innocent then it'll work in his favour as he can dispel the rumours with facts. If he's found to have done it then he should be punished accordingly. That's the point in an investigation which the op has asked for.

No idea what the bizarre caps are for in your post...

I’m not sure if you’ll see this comment. I am glad there are people like you around that at least have some compassion.
It says something when posters are more concerned about ‘evidence’, than acknowledging the fact this cruel fucker has killed a defenceless bird.

You can't be serious? Are you genuinely arguing that people should be allowed to accused and report others of "stomping and strangling" animals without any actual evidence? Look at the language you and others are using about the manager; "cruel fucker", "callous bastard", "deserves all he gets", all based the opinion of one person who heard a retelling of a conversation between people who weren't even at the alleged event. It certainly says something about some posters on here, but not what you think.

I might report you to your work for drowning puppies. Why care about 'evidence' when cruel fuckers like you are out killing defenseless animals.

It's not for the OP to provide evidence. If she suspects a crime has been committed then she has every right to report it to have it investigated properly by the people with authority to do so. Those "it's just hearsay" or "none of your business" attitudes is why so many bad people get away with doing bad things for too long.

I would be really upset by this too, OP. You don't deserve a hard time over this. Be kind to yourself.

[quote starsaligned]@Wreath21 but the op hasn't named and shamed him. She's made a report to the company so that they can investigate and search for this evidence that you are so keen on. If she'd plastered his name and alleged crime all over Facebook you might have a point but that isn't what happened.

Based on a reasonable level of suspicion - I.e having heard staff discussing it, the bird being gone etc - do you not think this should be at least looked into? If the guy is proven innocent then it'll work in his favour as he can dispel the rumours with facts. If he's found to have done it then he should be punished accordingly. That's the point in an investigation which the op has asked for.

No idea what the bizarre caps are for in your post...[/quote]
While you're right that OP hasn't identified the man, other posters on this thread have been encouraging her to do so, telling her to go on local social media, phone the papers etc, and it is those posters I am referring to more than OP.

Magpies are a pest, they are wild birds and i certainly wouldnt want one in a shop or near my shoelaces.

If you feel comfortable, maybe casually ask someone who works there what happened to the bird (either play dumb you don't know it's been killed or mention you overheard something about it) and see what else you might be able to find out.
I'm an animal lover too and I've seen some vile ways people have killed rats and such. Personally, I can totally understand your frustration, which would make me want to find out more. Beaten to death with a broom is abit ott but something which may have happened. Wringing it's neck, as far as I'm aware, would be a more humane way (as much of a shame it is to lose an intelligent wild animal 😞)
I'd simply have to know more, from a shop assistant or the manager himself.... '...especially if the kids have been asking where Mr Magpie has gone...' (if you wanted to be subtle about your view kinda thing 😉)

@BadNomad

It's not for the OP to provide evidence. If she suspects a crime has been committed then she has every right to report it to have it investigated properly by the people with authority to do so. Those "it's just hearsay" or "none of your business" attitudes is why so many bad people get away with doing bad things for too long.

Um, not really. People self-importantly 'reporting crimes' that they didn't witness, on the basis that they were told someone said something to someone else about it, waste police time and resources and often cause trouble for people who have done nothing wrong. If you hear something second or third hand which concerns you, the best you can do is mind your business. If you know one of the people supposedly involved (or indeed hurt) in the incident you could, perhaps, offer to support them in making a complaint as that might be helpful.

@Thebestwaytoscareatory

*I’m not sure if you’ll see this comment. I am glad there are people like you around that at least have some compassion. It says something when posters are more concerned about ‘evidence’, than acknowledging the fact this cruel fucker has killed a defenceless bird.*

You can't be serious? Are you genuinely arguing that people should be allowed to accused and report others of "stomping and strangling" animals without any actual evidence? Look at the language you and others are using about the manager; "cruel fucker", "callous bastard", "deserves all he gets", all based the opinion of one person who heard a retelling of a conversation between people who weren't even at the alleged event. It certainly says something about some posters on here, but not what you think.

I might report you to your work for drowning puppies. Why care about 'evidence' when cruel fuckers like you are out killing defenseless animals.

The staff said the manager killed the magpie. You do know that in some cases where a crime has taken place, it’s difficult to obtain actual evidence which is why witnesses are used in many cases.

And yes, OP clearly has way more compassion than many of you that are so focused on the actual evidence than the cruel act instead.

To the OP. Please ignore all those who are scoffing at you. I would have definitely complained about this and would follow up if I didn’t receive a response from the company. I would also notify the RSPCA, RSPB and anyone else I could think of. There is never any reason to be cruel to any creature, and the manager is a despicable individual if he killed that magpie because it hopped into his shop.

@Wreath21
Um, not really. People self-importantly 'reporting crimes' that they didn't witness, on the basis that they were told someone said something to someone else about it, waste police time and resources and often cause trouble for people who have done nothing wrong.
If you hear something second or third hand which concerns you, the best you can do is mind your business. If you know one of the people supposedly involved (or indeed hurt) in the incident you could, perhaps, offer to support them in making a complaint as that might be helpful.

Is this your opinion about all crimes or just animal cruelty? Because if I heard something from someone else that a 3rd person had abused a child or buried a body somewhere, I would report it. I think most people would. If the person is innocent then they'll still be innocent after being investigated.

[quote BadNomad]@Wreath21
Um, not really. People self-importantly 'reporting crimes' that they didn't witness, on the basis that they were told someone said something to someone else about it, waste police time and resources and often cause trouble for people who have done nothing wrong.
If you hear something second or third hand which concerns you, the best you can do is mind your business. If you know one of the people supposedly involved (or indeed hurt) in the incident you could, perhaps, offer to support them in making a complaint as that might be helpful.

Is this your opinion about all crimes or just animal cruelty? Because if I heard something from someone else that a 3rd person had abused a child or buried a body somewhere, I would report it. I think most people would. If the person is innocent then they'll still be innocent after being investigated.[/quote]
Do you genuinely think that the police would spring into action if you trotted into the nick and said 'Mr So&so has done this awful thing, some woman at the bus stop told me alllll about it'?
Do you also not understand that for some people, being 'investigated' is life-ruining?

Yeah. Mrs so and so at the co op says yer man kills magpies.

It’s the text book definition of hearsay.

The OP’s husband heard the exchange of words.

When my husband tells me what he has heard, I don’t think of it as ‘hearsay’.

So no, I don’t think this is a text book definition of it.

@SilverDoe

Oh I do hope I end up in court, I really do.

I do not have a habit of this at all, but unsurprisingly to everyone but you, when innocent, intelligent little animals are killed for no good reason, I do have the ability to be angry and feel it should be addressed.

Op you do not want to end up in court. If you do it won’t be for the court to hear your opinion on what happened, but will probably be because you have been charged with slander or something else! I am not trying to get at you, as I am as horrified as you are that a poor bird has apparently been cruelly killed.

I really hope the manager is charged with Cruelty to Animals. However Court cases deal with fact and are not interested in third hand information. They won’t be interested in how you are upset and have contacted the shop’s head office because your husband told you he had heard someone shouting at the staff, who then said that someone else had killed a bird. You didn’t see the bird being killed so you do not have any information (and neither has your dh), that would actually be relevant in this case.

Unfortunately, at the moment there is nothing you can do about this, except refuse to give this store your custom, which is what I would do in your situation! If the manager is found guilty of cruelty, then you could campaign for him to lose his job, but I expect that may happen anyway if he is found guilty!

Tell the local newspaper

@Ceramide

Tell the local newspaper

Please don't. What if you have put 2 and 2 together and made a dozen? You really don't know the situation. This is why we have the notion of innocent until proven guilty and wby vigilantism is frowned upon.

You could end up ruining this man's life and then find out you got the wrong end of the stick.

Magpies are pests and will raid the nests of anything they can and kill and eat the babies. If it kept going into the shop, I don’t blame him for killing it.

How do you know if he actually killed it, all you know is someone was shouting at him. I would just leave it.

@ScrollingLeaves

The OP’s husband heard the exchange of words.

When my husband tells me what he has heard, I don’t think of it as ‘hearsay’.

So no, I don’t think this is a text book definition of it.

It's still the legal definition, mate.

@ScrollingLeaves

The OP’s husband heard the exchange of words.

When my husband tells me what he has heard, I don’t think of it as ‘hearsay’.

So no, I don’t think this is a text book definition of it.

You may not think so, but it is.