To be considering rehoming my dog?

[GuiltRiddenDilema]

Don’t want to go into too much detail but she’s a 3 year old Dobermann. Had her since 8 weeks old. Was conned by the breeder (the adult dobies I met were not her parents, her parents it turns out … were too aggressive to meet). I did everything by the book, obedience classes, socialisation classes … she just got more and more aggressive. I got a 1-1 trainer … didn’t help. Tried a different 1-1 trainer - helped in the short term but soon went backwards, tried behaviourist who said the dog was fear aggressive and would never be able to be around other dogs or children. I travelled across the country with her for a Dobermann expert who said she’s bright as a button but will always be unpredictable and temperamental.
The area we live in is the worst possible area for her temperament. Lots of offlead dogs running around, lots of small children - I’m terrified she will escape the garden or something. I can’t walk her without being constantly on edge that she’ll hurt someone/something.
I’ve tried for 2.5 years to get her through this but she’s just the same as she always was. We have good days and bad days. I train her daily, I’ve put so much time and money into her training and see nothing for it.

Problem is I love the dog dearly and she’s obsessed with me. The guilt is eating away at me. In the meantime I’m terrified and alienating all the human relationships I have as nobody will come to my house anymore. I can’t even have my grandchild over.
She needs an experienced owner, one that can actually give her some kind of a life.
I’d contact a breed specific rescue and keep her until they could find a suitable experienced owner. I don’t want her going into kennels and I’m not interested in money. I just want to save her 😢

I just don’t know what to do anymore. My own adult children will no longer visit 😔

You are the owner of a potentially very dangerous and unpredictable dog. Why would you want to pass this dog on to somebody else. It isn't logical.

I don’t there are huge lists of landowners who want aggressive dogs living with them. So it isn’t an easy option. Also, the dog would be very upset at being separated from their owner. PTS is the kindest option.

[quote anditgoesonandon]@CovidCorvid I'm sorry that you have to live with the guilt of having your dog killed because you chose not to seek alternative environments that would have been more suited. It must be a very heavy burden to bear.

I'm not sure why you are trying to encourage others to do the same, others would want to know they did all they could for their pet and not jump at the easiest solution for them, which happens to be the worst possible outcome for the dog who no longer has a chance of life.[/quote]
Nice passive aggressive pop at me. Thanks for that.

But I did seek alternative environments. Did you miss the Bit where I said I contacted several charities and they turned me down? The dogs trust said no, the breed rescue said no, the person who ran the breed rescue said my dog needed to be pts. Other rescues said no. The dog went to a recommended boarding place and this had no effect. They said it wasn’t treatable.

I still soldiered on hoping things would improve. We got another dog hoping a friendly dog would model good behaviour. He was a small dog so i felt the situation was more manageable than if it had been a Doberman. One day dh bent down to pick a tissue off the floor, dh was the other side of the room from the dog and the dog charged over and ripped his eyebrow off his face. I know I made the right decision to pts. So while I feel sad, no it isn’t a heavy burden to bear.

I think the OP should contact a breed rescue if she wants to. But I think she needs to be prepared for not getting much help. I think she needs to be aware that passing the problem onto someone else is not necessarily the best solution. What do you think they will do that she hasn’t done?

I don’t have any advice but just sending love to you from one animal lover to another. I think you are amazing for persevering and trying to do the best for your dog, it’s clear you love her very much. Hugs

Please ignore all those calling for your dog to be PTS. I’d recommend you contact a breed specific rescue or one focusing on guardian breeds. Be 100% open with them about your dogs current issues and offer up your time to settle her with them or new owners.
100% you can get an agreement that if things don’t work out she can come back to you. Get them to do an assessment on her, it might be that they do say there is nothing to be done, but at least then you have it from experts who have met the dog, rather than keyboard warriors on mumsnet who have read 8 lines on the dogs behaviour.
I think a lot of the residential trainers are a bit overwhelmed at the moment with a lot of two or three year old lockdown dogs with some issues to unpick.

@MrsWinters - did you read the original post where the OP says all the things she has done? Including travelling to meet an expert?

“To the PP who said that if their family couldn’t visit then so be it, that is probably one of the most ridiculous things I’ve ever read on here. So basically you would be prepared to give up your family, have them go NC with you and all for the sake of a dog who will be dead in ten years time anyway. Okayyyy.”

Eh no. Not being able to visit her house is absolutely not giving up your family and going NC. I’m sure the dog has no objections to OP visiting family at their homes, speaking to them on the phone and meeting them for coffee and lunch.

Personally I'd go back to the highly experienced Doberman expert and be guided by him. Ask his opinion on what to do. You can trust this person, he's been straight with you. Ask him outright, should I PTS or consider rehoming? If he says rehome then ask for some personal recommendations. Any random breed rehoming centres you approach, you should grill them thoroughly. Don't just accept the fact that they're alleged experts and can therefore make better decision than you concerning your own animal.

It's a heartbreaking situation especially as you have a close bond with the dog but you have to look at the bigger picture. You're really isolating yourself from friends and family, always on high alert, presumably you can never go on holiday or leave your home for any amount of time. This is no way to live!

@downwhichoflate of course I did. But none of those trainers were approached as a last ditch attempt, and OP doesn’t say that those experts said that the only thing to be done was to PTS.
There’s a real difference in the conversation of can you help my dog, compared to I can no longer cope so what are the options from here. I think that those conversations need to happen with an expert, rather than on mumsnet.

I'm sorry you are experiencing this. You have to look at how you'd feel if your dog killed someone else's dog or hurt a child. After lots of intervention that didn't work I had my aggressive dog PTS and have never regretted it for a day (she did kill my friend's dog).

[quote anditgoesonandon]@LuckySantangelo35

Any animal that the charity is unsure of will be thoroughly assessed by a qualified behaviorist and evaluated before they even consider rehoming.

Are you a qualified behaviorist or do you just think you know more than one? [/quote]
How many ‘expert’ opinions does the OP have to accrue in order to make an informed decision in your view then?

@GuiltRiddenDilema

Thank you for the responses. I have reported the breeders and last I heard they had sold up and moved house and are no longer advertising on Champ Dogs.

I couldn’t have her PTS, I just wouldn’t be able to do it. The guilt would be too much but @CovidCorvid I do understand your decision and I’m so sorry you had to go through that.

With me she’s the most loving sweetheart. Affectionate and loyal. I KNOW she has good in her.

Anyone know if I could set up an agreement with the rescue that if things didn’t work out with new owners she’d come back to me?

A responsible rescue would not rehouse an aggressive dog ,the reasons for her aggression are irrelevant to a rescue- she is a liability . It could be catastrophic if she were rehoused and the true facts of her behaviour weren't passed on . I imagine she must feel very stressed and not happy , not the life of the average family dog. You talk about what you can't do , but its not about you , no matter how hard it may be as dog owners we must always do the best thing for the dog , however difficult and hard it may be at the time. I work with dogs every day and some , thankfully a minority can not be 'fixed', they are no fun , hard work and cause a lot of stress for the owner , not what they signed up for when becoming a dog owner. But primarily the dog itself is miserable , it must be awful living a constantly stressed life. As previous posters in this and other threads have said -there are much worse things than euthanasia.

[quote MrsWinters]@downwhichoflate of course I did. But none of those trainers were approached as a last ditch attempt, and OP doesn’t say that those experts said that the only thing to be done was to PTS.
There’s a real difference in the conversation of can you help my dog, compared to I can no longer cope so what are the options from here. I think that those conversations need to happen with an expert, rather than on mumsnet.[/quote]
I do agree that this conversation would be a good one to have if it hasn’t already happened. Even if they can’t help at least you know you’ve tried.

Yes find out the best way to re-home

I know someone who had the same problem with a cockerpoo and they tried everything . It even bit the behavioural trainer . Plus it never gave any warning when it would attack . In the end it bit an adult in the face . So it had to go and that was after about 3 years of trying everything.

You are doing the right thing . Honestly .

Op, I think you have likely already given your dog the best chance of the best outcome. She has had the benefit of a committed owner who is prepared to spend time and money on the problem, and to whom she is closely bonded. I'm not sure how a rescue can improve on this to get a better result. In my experience rescues are usually run by dedicated individuals but often with limited funds and access to no better behaviourists than a private individual can consult.

It may be that PTS is the ultimate outcome here and I feel, as others have said, it is not the worst thing to happen to a dog.

If you do not feel that point has been reached perhaps consider an appointment with a veterinary surgeon who has additional qualifications in behaviour and who would be able to prescribe medications if they considered it appropriate. findavet.rcvs.org.uk/find-a-vet-surgeon/by-specialist/behavioural-medicine/

Above all else obviously continue to prioritise everyone's safety whilst you formulate a plan. All the best.

I am really sorry and I can feel your heartbreak in every post, but I think she will have to be PTS.

The wider issue is dogs like this shouldn't be rehomed.
They are not safe and moving them around doesn't improve things.
My dog was attacked by an aggressive rescue dog that should never have been put in that situation.
She escaped her lead while being tied up and went straight for my dog. Luckily after antibiotics and lots of more recent positive experiences with other dogs, my Ddog is OK.
However it was avoidable, aggressive dogs shouldn't be rehomed.

aggressive dogs shouldn't be rehomed Sadly I agree.

There needs to be a serious look at breeding, training, rehoming and general treatment of dogs.

@CovidCorvid please ignore that hidous post aimed at you, that was one of the lowest things I've read on here and that's saying something. They didn't even deserve your response quite frankly.
I have so much admiration for people who make the right choice for the animal they are responsible for, when that choice is a hard one.
It's the ultimate loving act, ensuring they will never suffer.

@trumpisagit it is worth considering though that not every rescue rehome every dog to a domestic environment, so specialist ones may rehome to working environments which may be more suited. There was a story recently about an ‘untrainable’ dog with extreme resource guarding issues that wasn’t suitable to a home but has been retrained into a search and rescue dog. It’s not always possible, but sometimes it is an option.

Eh no. Not being able to visit her house is absolutely not giving up your family and going NC. I’m sure the dog has no objections to OP visiting family at their homes, speaking to them on the phone and meeting them for coffee and lunch. the family might though. If my mother said I couldn’t visit due to the fact her dog is too aggressive, and that she couldn’t ever have an independent relationship with my children, never babysit them at her house etc because her dog is too aggressive I’d tell her not to bother then. If she put a dog ahead of me and my children I would walk away.

I think you should rehome but YABU for taking on that breed of dog. They are well known to be good guard dogs, so they are likely to be quite protective and aggressive regardless of the parents.

The wider issue is dogs like this shouldn't be rehomed. agree. In fact I think that it should be a legal requirement that they be destroyed by any rescue.

Honestly I think you are going to struggle to re-home her and there is a high likelihood that any rescue would euthanise breed specialist or not as they can’t ethically re-home an aggressive animal. From what you say you have gone to pretty extensive lengths even seeing a breed expert and put in a lot of time and effort with little improvement so I doubt anyone else could do much for her that you haven’t already tried.

I agree with others that there are worse things than euthanasia and its probably kinder to her if its done with you there providing love and comfort than by an almost stranger a few months down the line when they also try and fail to rehabilitate her.

I’m sorry you are in this situation.

Shooting it would be a kindness. Same with horses, if they are going to be shunted from home to home because they are unsuitable it isn't good for anyone let alone the animal.