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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

If there was an election tomorrow, who would you vote for?

590 replies

SecretKeeper1 · 12/01/2022 19:23

Obviously the Tories are a complete shitshow, but Labour aren’t a lot better and I couldn’t hand on heart vote for either in good conscience right now.

So… IF a snap election was called, like in December 2019, who would you vote for? Would it make a difference to you if Boris was replaced as Tory leader? Would you even bother voting or maybe go for a totally different national or local party?

Just curious!

OP posts:
AssignedBlobbyAtBirth · 13/01/2022 15:56

If a transwoman is in a female space it is not single sex
A transwoman will never need a smear test, pregnancy care, any gynaecological care or anything connected to what makes me a woman- female biology
Including any male in female statistics renders them useless. The only thing that connects me with every other woman on the planet is our shared biology.

BashStreetKid · 13/01/2022 15:59

People who would vote Tory because of Self ID are the absolute epitome of anti-feminism. If you seriously think the Conservative party supports women's rights, you are absolutely deluded. Voting them in again would effectively give them carte blanche to cut down or get rid of maternity leave and maternity rights, and when they revise the Equality Act as they want, such women's equality rights as might be left will be severely weakened.

Welliesandpyjamas · 13/01/2022 16:04

To answer OP, not the conservatives. No way. No more.

If no party sorts out the self ID issue...spoiled ballot 🤷🏻‍♀️ tricky one that needs thinking about

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 13/01/2022 16:04

@OhdearOhdearOhdearIndeed

Anything but not Tory.

I hate voted for all 3 major parties at one point. I can't get behind the Tories now after Brexit, austerity, rising poverty and the rampant corruption. Ever again. The last 10 years have been awful for the country and we have gone backwards.

I would love a coalition most of all. I'm aware of the drawbacks of this, but I think we need it to progress and I do think Keir Starmer is getting better. Haven't heard enough about Lib Dems of late, which is a shame as I don't know what they stand for.

Self-ID is an issue for me too, but If it is between self-ID being an issue, or corruption, incompetence, increasing poverty, lack of progression, increasing inequality and blatant lying, I think I would be happy to accept the self-ID problem over those issues. We can do something about that, but if there is a shitty attitude to the general public and our leading politicians are only in it for what they can get out of the system and think their voters are all idiots, I can't foresee any positive change in the future.

^ I agree with most of this, despite never having voted Tory.
WorriedMumsDontSleep · 13/01/2022 16:05

My friend gave birth
Well that's one massive factor that women alone shoulder the burden for.
Can't protect maternity rights, discrimination against child bearing age women if we are suddenly in a category with men who will never be discriminated against for that.

You are letting the fact that you know a person who has a mental health problem/and or a political position cloud your acknowledgement that naming some men as women is a gift to the men's rights movement.

It's already playing havoc with women on the receiving end. Men stealing sports places, men incarcerated with women, men winning women's awards and positive discrimination places.

That you know a person who wants to identify out of their sex does not justify shafting the women on the sharp end of this.

StoneofDestiny · 13/01/2022 16:36

SNP

Sabire9 · 13/01/2022 16:40

"My friend gave birth
Well that's one massive factor that women alone shoulder the burden for.
Can't protect maternity rights, discrimination against child bearing age women if we are suddenly in a category with men who will never be discriminated against for that."

I work in maternity.

The biggest issue women are facing right now that's negatively affecting their safety & their experience of birth is a shortage of midwives. I know quite a few midwives and none of them have an issue with caring for pregnant trans men. Firstly because these parents only make up a vanishingly small percentage of patients, but mainly because most midwives are deeply compassionate people who only want to help women & birthing people to have a safe and happy experience of pregnancy & birth.

"You are letting the fact that you know a person who has a mental health problem"

They don't have a problem. They're not depressed or ill, they're functioning extremely well in their career and have happy relationships with family, partner & friends.

"It's already playing havoc with women on the receiving end. Men stealing sports places"

Is this a really big problem? Can you put a figure on it? Only a minuscule percentage of the population are trans, and only a minuscule percentage of trans people are involved in competitive sport.

"men incarcerated with women"

Where do you think the very tiny number of incarcerated trans women should be held?

"That you know a person who wants to identify out of their sex does not justify shafting the women on the sharp end of this".

Have you got any non-hypothetical examples of where this is happening?

Original poster
SecretKeeper1 · 13/01/2022 16:47

Erm… this wasn’t meant to turn into a trans rights debate.

Thanks to all those who appear to be as politically homeless as I am, without writing essays on the matter.

Good job there isn’t going to be a snap election tomorrow is all I can say, seems a lot of us would be in a right pickle Grin

OP posts:
AssignedBlobbyAtBirth · 13/01/2022 16:50

Why should vulnerable women have to accommodate males in prison with them?
Giving up single sex categories and spaces only harms women. If you really do work in maternity services think it's tragic how little thought you give to women

Puzzledandpissedoff · 13/01/2022 16:54

None of them

I've never not voted in 47 years, but right now I couldn't support any of them

WorriedMumsDontSleep · 13/01/2022 16:58

That it's a miniscule amount of people makes it all the more shocking. Every Lia Thomas and Laurel Hubbard means a woman has lost out. One woman too many.

A prisoner took the moj to court because they were assaulted by a man who claimed to be trans that they were housed with.
Trans men should be housed in the male estate, with other vulnerable males. If they have particular needs that can't be met there a trans wing is not beyond the realms of possibly. Funny isn't it that the moj absolutely don't allow trans men in the male estate. It's like they understand males are a threat to female people.

Your 'I'm a midwife' speech is bizarre. No one is saying that there are not issues in midwifery. I'm allowed to be concerned about more than one thing at once.

By the way, my midwife ignored my request for the male trainee doctors not to come in and giggle whilst I was shitting myself. So as a bloody midwife you should be more sensitive to the dignity of women.

You should also know that however they identify only women get pregnant and have the various issues that go along with that.

If you don't know that I think you are in the wrong job.

Check out fairplayforwomen if you want stats.
Educate yourself.

WorriedMumsDontSleep · 13/01/2022 17:02

Meant trans women (males) in male estate. Women not a human shield.
Shows how important facts(Lammy thinks men can grow a cervix) and simple language (Starrmer thinks women is a dirty word) are when it is difficult to put across a simple fact like no male rapists in women's prisons.

Lolamento · 13/01/2022 17:25

Conservatives. I do not care I know the other are much worse. Think BJ as Mayor ( bad) Sadiq Khan ( terrible and a waste of space) unfortunately LIB DEMOCRATS are just like Labour.

Terfydactyl · 13/01/2022 18:50

@Sabire9

JulesJules - how many trans sex offenders have been housed in women's prisons?
How many would be too many?
Coronado2 · 13/01/2022 18:52

I think all those saying none or split ballot should consider that they would likely be helping the conservatives secure a win.

Coronado2 · 13/01/2022 18:52

*spoilt

GreenNewDealNow · 13/01/2022 18:55

Jeremy Corbyn.

PlanetNormal · 13/01/2022 18:57

It’s interesting how many people are claiming they would spoil their ballot. In my experience as a Labour activist the number of people who can actually be bothered to get off their arse, go out to the polling station, queue up to vote then intentionally spoil their paper is negligible.

In reality, the vast majority of people who can’t bring themselves to vote for any of the candidates just don’t vote at all.

Tootiredforallthis · 13/01/2022 18:58

Labour

WorriedMumsDontSleep · 13/01/2022 18:59

@Coronado2

I think all those saying none or split ballot should consider that they would likely be helping the conservatives secure a win.
And ...? A vote for the shitshow that is labour will ensure they plough on the way they are without change.

Labour need to get over this polarising, vote for us it's your moral duty bull. They show absolute contempt and disdain for their traditional voting base and enough is enough.

Terfydactyl · 13/01/2022 19:10

@Sabire9

"A thousand and one things that have only and will only ever effect women, the cunty type, will now be shared with "women"

Can you give me an example of things you don't think we should share with trans women?

Single sex spaces.

As in sex not gender?
Do you think your daughter if you have one should shower naked next to a man?
Are you ok being treated by a male person doing a rape kit on you after you have been raped?
Are you ok if you go to prison to be locked up with a man?

When I said shared with "women" I meant stats.
So figures plucked from thin air.
20% of women suffer with endometriosis
Or
10% of people suffer with endometriosis, haven't we done well curing so much endometriosis in the last 5 months.

Sabire9 · 13/01/2022 19:11

What Labour policies do you object to Worried?

Terfydactyl · 13/01/2022 19:13

@BashStreetKid

People who would vote Tory because of Self ID are the absolute epitome of anti-feminism. If you seriously think the Conservative party supports women's rights, you are absolutely deluded. Voting them in again would effectively give them carte blanche to cut down or get rid of maternity leave and maternity rights, and when they revise the Equality Act as they want, such women's equality rights as might be left will be severely weakened.
Absolutely do not believe that torys even like women at all. But they damn well know who is one. And that matters.
Sabire9 · 13/01/2022 19:20

Terf - my 22 year old daughter was herself was a victim of a serious sexual assault by an adult man when she was 14, and was victim of a violent assault by a different man (resulting in a criminal conviction) at 17. I asked her how she'd feel about showering next to a trans woman and she shrugged. She accepts people for who they are - most young people do.

My sons (16 & 18) are the same. My 18 year old has two friends who are non-binary. My son is happy to use their preferred pronouns and has asked me to do the same. I'm so proud of him - his maturity and his kindness and respect for others.

I think the issue here is that you're very obsessed with sex and gender and not very interested in people's humanity.

Sabire9 · 13/01/2022 19:23

"But they damn well know who is one. And that matters."

Why?