Prince Andrew

[Tevion28]

Do you think guilty or innocent

Yes and Maria Farmer's attempts at becoming an artist were blocked, doors were closed to her, she was threatened and in fear.

And her and her sister tried so hard to report Epstein and Maxwell to the FBI years before and were ignored

Just looking at the transcript from the newsnight interview again:

“you have to remember that at the time I was patron of the NSPCC's Full Stop campaign so I was close up with what was going on in those time about getting rid of abuse to children so I knew what the things were to look for but I never saw them.”

“I never saw them. I mean you have to understand that his house, I described it more as almost as a railway station if you know what I mean in the sense that there were people coming in and out of that house all the time.
What they were doing and why they were there I had nothing to do with. So I'm afraid I can't make any comment on that because I really don't know.”

Exactly Merrymouse. Totally incriminating.

@StoneofDestiny

Kate playing the piano the other day was was like the infamous playing of the violin while Rome burned! The Royals are prancing about trying to shove an 'acceptable' yet still highly irrelevant and unproductive face of monarchy at us when the ugly real monarchy is getting away with criminal behaviour. Epstein helped Sarah Ferguson pay off her debts. Epstein and Maxwell - convicted child traffickers and paedophiles were entertained on Royal property at Andrew's invite Andrew was a close friend of Maxwell and Epstein, staying at their properties and flying in their private planes

Wake up!

Brilliant post

@StoneofDestiny

The sheer irony - Sarah Ferguson not allowed at Balmoral because she had her toes sucked by some bloke Paedophiles and Sex Traffickers entertained at Balmoral by her husband Andrew

Couldn't make it up

Looks like the Queen was at Balmoral at the same time (she is sitting outside same cabin).

Or is that journalistic license?

@merrymouse

Just looking at the transcript from the newsnight interview again:

“you have to remember that at the time I was patron of the NSPCC's Full Stop campaign so I was close up with what was going on in those time about getting rid of abuse to children so I knew what the things were to look for but I never saw them.”

“I never saw them. I mean you have to understand that his house, I described it more as almost as a railway station if you know what I mean in the sense that there were people coming in and out of that house all the time.
What they were doing and why they were there I had nothing to do with. So I'm afraid I can't make any comment on that because I really don't know.”

What a pathetic attempt to name drop his patronage of the NSPCC.

Getting rid of abuse to children? Who talks like that. He is so out of touch.

I don’t think emotions or manipulation comes into it, there was never any doubt that The Firm would back one of their own to the hilt.

To a point but you can't defend the indefensible.

The Queen isn’t a cuddly grandmother, she will looking for this to be swept away ASAP.

She is not stupid, the only one stupid enough to think this can be swept under the carpet is Prince Andrew.

He is a nasty piece of work so my suspicion is that he will be doing his utmost to ensure she keeps the cheques coming (because what other option does he have). I don't think she will be doing this all of her own volition.

@Roussette

LockdownBear someone on this thread linked such an interesting article about that photo.

It was fascinating.

Here it is.

www.vanityfair.com/style/2021/12/how-the-only-known-photo-of-prince-andrew-and-the-pedophile-happened/amp

How and why it happened is so interesting

That is fascinating. There is so much more to emerge about Epstein.

Sarah Ferguson is a disgrace to herself as well.

I would have thought that any friends or associates of a Royal family member would have their backgrounds thoroughly checked out before being allowed into the 'inner sanctum.'
If so, it makes these 'friendships' and others (Charles with Savile amongst others) even more questionable.

@Enko

I think he had sex with her but I do not think it ever entered his mind she was not willingly engaging with him. He simply wouldn't have been able to entertain the idea he was not a catch for any woman. I also believe he did not recall who she was originally as I don't think she was important to him as someone to remember.

Legally that would make him not guilty. As I dont think she can prove he knew. I dont think he did as I dont think his entitled self could comprehend she was not wanting him.

Doesn't mean I don't believe she was trafficked just i dont think this case is a black and white situation

^ This exactly I think he is guilty of arrogance and many other things but not sure this allegation is easily provable, especially when (if the papers are to be believed) the lawyers could not use the main accuser in the trial of Ghislaine Maxwell as she has, apparently, given contradictory evidence in different statements

@HoppingPavlova perfectly said. I doubt he's smart enough to realise the girls were trafficked and merely acting interested in him. To me his character does appear nice but dim. He's so arrogant, he probably thinks most women would beg him for it. As previously said , 17 is legal in the UK. A probably forgot to consider country and age limitations as he was too busy getting his kecks off.

@merrymouse

Why? It's was an everyday thing for him. He wasn't 'randy Andy' for no reason.

Because his day job was representing and supporting multiple charities that support abused and deprived children.

Because every year he stood next to the Queen on Remembrance Sunday and represented the armed forces - organisations that ask young people to die for their country.

Because people were (and got all I know still are) expected to bow and curtesy and call him ‘your royal highness’.

Totally irrelevant

Why do people keep wrongly saying what he has been accused of?

Andrew it's described as as low hanging fruit, or a mouse to epsteien cobra

So it was Fergies spending and debt that brought him to us knees!

Merryweather80 "A probably forgot to consider country and age limitations as he was too busy getting his kecks off."

... which is exactly why this is not a defence in cases of the abuse and rape of children and young people who have been trafficked.

and as PP said (on this, or on another related thread):

Andrew might be thick but he isn't blind

There are multiple instances of him being around very young girls in multiple locations allegedly with pornographic imagery and photos of young girls all around.

If he hadn't tried to find every loophole going to avoid being served papers and face the authorities I may have believed him, despite not liking him very much. His behaviour makes him look very, very guilty though and I'd be surprised if he is cleared now (out of court settlements aside).

That interview he did revealed so much. Thinking of when he said Epstein's behaviour was "unbecoming". It makes you wonder if he even remotely understands the impact of such crimes on the victims. Almost like he doesn't think it was that bad?

@merrymouse

winning the case could be a Pyrrhic victory as there will be no money

No, because it could lead to a criminal case, and whether she wins or loses, the case has highlighted that Andrew clearly sold the respectability of Royal association to Epstein, and this gave him cover that enabled abuse.

I disagree that this will be forgotten, even if she loses the civil case.

He might not see the inside of a prison cell, but there will be consequences.

I don’t think anything will happen

If VG wins she will be left with a huge legal bill and an award by the US civil court which she won’t see a penny of because the court has no jurisdiction in the U.K.

If PA says nothing then there will be no criminal case either.

So what is it all for.
Is it worth spending everything you have, every moment of your life on something that is going to get nowhere.

I think in 20 years time VG will look back and see so much wasted time. So much wasted money.

The only ones who are going to come out of this with everything they expect are the lawyers.

I really can’t believe she is spending her own money on legal representation

Whilst it is admirable that you want to bring someone to justice and shine a light on wrong doing sometimes it can do you more harm than good and you would be better to spend a fraction of the money on therapy

I am probably old and cynical but I don’t see any good coming out of this.

@Newyearoldyou - no, it was his inability to live on £300k+ per year that did him in, along with stupidity, a sense of entitlement, and a complete lack of common sense.

@SecretSpAD I’m so sorry what a sad story.

If VG wins she will be left with a huge legal bill and an award by the US civil court which she won’t see a penny of because the court has no jurisdiction in the U.K.

Au contraire, any judgement in her favour can and will be enforced in any country in the world where there exists the rule of law.

He is obliged to respond to motions and discovery in the NY court.

He is obliged to do so regardless of the fact that VG was not underage under UK law at the time she was lent out to him.

He has to abide by the verdict.

And if the verdict goes against her, you can bet he will be crowing about vindication in a court of law.

If Andrew could simply ignore a verdict, then anyone rich enough to run off to another country could effectively thumb their nose at any court and at their victims.

To those saying VG was smiling in the photos.

I have a photo taken of me and my exhusband at my sisters wedding. I’m smiling broadly but he had just whispered to me I was the ugliest cunt of a bridesmaid he had ever seen.

So smiling means fuck all.

LuluBlakey1

Roussette

LockdownBear someone on this thread linked such an interesting article about that photo.

It was fascinating.

Here it is.

<a class="break-all" href="//www.vanityfair.com/style/2021/12/how-the-only-known-photo-of-prince-andrew-and-the-pedophile-happened/amp" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.vanityfair.com/style/2021/12/how-the-only-known-photo-of-prince-andrew-and-the-pedophile-happened/amp</a>

How and why it happened is so interesting

That is fascinating. There is so much more to emerge about Epstein.

Sarah Ferguson is a disgrace to herself as well.

I had been wondering about where Epstein got his money so the Vanity Fair articles are enlightning - he basically Uriah Heeped it. And like Dickens's Uriah Heep wanted to pull others into his corrupt schemes. They also show that he did what he did becuase he enjoyed it and the coercion of young vulnerable teenagers was a big part of that pleasure. He thought it was natural and it seems was on a life long quest to find others who shared his tastes and lack of morals.

I agree about Sarah Ferguson - why did she imagine rich people wanted to give her and Andrew money? For their (limited) ability to playact being an English Lady and 'Gentleman' as she is on record as considering PA?

When you know the person who raped you is out there, free, enjoying their life, not giving you a moment’s thought, except perhaps during a wank fantasy where he’s holding you down.

Yes, it’s worth the money if you have it. No amount of therapy takes those memories away.

Yes, he was arrogant. And still is, because he thinks he’s above the law. Which is being enabled by his mother.

Don’t fucking say going after your abuser isn’t worth it.

The most interesting thing of all this is that this thread is still standing. 🤨

I wouldn't tar all the RF with the same brush, so to speak. Like any family, (or on a larger scale, society) there are the "good" and the "bad" members.