Casual racism or AIBU

[Kooksadooks]

Hello. I have a lot on my mind today but hope you are having a nice New Years Eve…
We (me, DP, MIL, FIL, DS ect) were sat around the TV over Christmas period.
The Channel 5 advert featuring Anne Bolelyn played by black actress Jodie Turner-Smith comes on and MIL starts complaining that she ‘doesn’t understand all this’ and ‘Anne Bolelyn wasn’t black’ and doesn’t understand ‘why white people cannot play black people’…
I bit my tongue, I appreciate that I am surrounded by people who agree with her and there’s no point in arguing with them about what I think, also not wanting to cause drama over Christmas but AIBU to feel uncomfortable at MIL’s comments?
I mentioned it to DP afterwards and he agrees with MIL

@newname12345, I’m curious about your comment. I do think that she could have played Dennis Nielsen, certainly on stage - I played male characters at school, for example, as it was an all-girl school and so half the characters cross-dressed/acted (this was in the ‘70’s and no one batted an eyelid!)
I did think, though, when making my initial comment, that using my argument, might lead to less conflict with family members than insinuations of racism.
Sadly, after I posted my comment though, OP has admitted that it was racist, and shockingly, that her DP agreed with MIL.
So sorry you’ve had to experience this, OP.

@Shade17

I can see both sides to the argument, I couldn’t get into Chernobyl because I just couldn’t get past the English language and British accents, totally jarring and for me unwatchable.

Hmm, we’d have been waiting a long time of we’d waited for The Russians to broadcast any remotely accurate account of Chernobyl.

£The difference is that they’re fictional characters*

Well Bond is obviously, but MacBeth was a real King of Scotland (although Shaky, as with Richard III, took liberties with the story).

@loislovesstewie

Neither was McBeth fictional.

No, but Shakespeare’s account was…

[quote Genderwitched]@doadeer

But Anne Boleyn is not a character like James Bond, she was a real person.[/quote]
Any dramas about her will be historically inaccurate so it doesn't matter who plays her especially as dramas involving the Tudors have been done to death.

In some ways it's a problem in others no. She was acting so in a drama it doesn't matter. It may not have been accurate but perhaps a good point to that would be to highlight it was a story. Sadly many take these sort of dramas as truth.

Perhaps next we get a black princess Di. A white Martin Luther.

@BigFatLiar

In some ways it's a problem in others no. She was acting so in a drama it doesn't matter. It may not have been accurate but perhaps a good point to that would be to highlight it was a story. Sadly many take these sort of dramas as truth.

Perhaps next we get a black princess Di. A white Martin Luther.

Martin Luther WAS white!

@LondonWolf yes, a complete lie as well.

@Lacedwithgrace

It's racist, they wouldn't give half a shit if a white actor played the role of a black person. My ILs are the same, and I'm black 🙃

It’s not racist, it’s a fact. As for the other comment then I’d assume she has been raised where blackface wasn’t a big deal, so rather than biting your tongue perhaps you should have raised the point and helped her understand that in this day and age it’s not acceptable and why

@Shade17

I can see both sides to the argument, I couldn’t get into Chernobyl because I just couldn’t get past the English language and British accents, totally jarring and for me unwatchable.

So you would have preferred it to be in Russian with subtitles? I can see that would be more authentic, but I suspect it would have hit the ratings quite a lot. I really enjoyed Das Boot and also Barbarians where everyone spoke the native language of their character (or a close modern equivalent).

I'm quite happy to have English language used in such dramas as long as it doesn't use the stupid cod accents that you used to hear.

I really enjoyed "The Death of Stalin" for example and I thought that the use of the various English accents and colloquial language was actually quite effective at bringing you closer to the characters. Of course it was a satirical comedy not a supposedly accurate historical drama though.

Also agree with @toddybell and I'm BAME.

I want to see a factually accurate representation if real people are being portrayed.

However, if its fiction, casting should be colourblind unless the story dictates a reason for it not to be (nobody would want to play a black Hitler I'm sure, unless it was a Black Mirror episode!). Bridgerton for example works beautifully, without them doing the "aren't we wonderful for our casting" stuff that you often see.

In itself, it's a perfectly reasonable thing to say, and in this thread there are black and mixed-race people who agree. A portrayal of someone who lived, should be played by someone of their ethnicity where at all possible. Fictional people, even if their ethnicity was mentioned in the original book, I don't see a problem with casting however one wants.

But of course if there's a back story to these people's attitudes I can see why hackles would rise. I wouldn't choose this comment to pick a fight with them on though.

TV adaptions do have power-and that can change public perception of the historically so radically they become a different person and changes the dynamic.
Catherine of Aragon was a pale English rose. No really. Her portraits and lineage confirm it. She was also very decisive, powerful and strong.
But decades of a dark Spanish looking subservient Catherine have changed her profile in the public consciousness. A great loss, as she was so much more than the long suffering wife.

I agree with your MIL

@jellyxat

Are the people here complaining about a black Anne B also anti-Hamilton?

I was just coming on here to say "wasnt Alexander Hamilton white...and Hamilton is one of the most powerful amazing productions out there...more like this please

Yes, I agree, there have been many magnificent portrayals of Shakespeare's characters by black actors. Characters which are based on white people such as Macbeth and Hamlet. Out of all the colour blind casting this has been the only one that has jarred a bit for me and I think it is probably because Anne Boleyns appearance has always been a quite strong part of her character for me. The sallow skin and black hair, making her such a contrast to Jane Seymour. Agree that her story has been told enough now.

I'm Black. Blackity Black. If a film is about a real person, I don't think someone of a different ethnicity should play that person. So for a Black person: Anne Boleyn? No. James Bond? Yes.

Although I side-eye people spouting "Woke" at any opportunity or those who say things like "what if white people played a black character..."
We all know it's been happening and why: Whitewashing. So that's not the rebuttal some people think it is. It's rightfully being called out.

I loathe that Black people are being shoehorned in history films, playing a different ethnicity, as if doing them a favour. New fictional films can be written (period pieces, etc) with Black people as lead and many black people in the film (not just have one token Black person), if it's truly about diversity and representation. I'm not seeing that yet, so I don't buy these quota-filling gestures.

White actor Ben Kingsley won an Oscar for playing Mahatma Gandhi!

Ben Kingsley's real name is Krishna Pandit Bhanji and he is of Indian descent on his father's side.

I agree with your MIL. It's nonsensical to have a black actress play Anne Boleyn.

Hamilton imo is awful. Awful man, awful show.

Sorry @TrishM80 missed the King - Martin Luther King the minister and rights campaigner

So you would have preferred it to be in Russian with subtitles?

That’s exactly what I’d have preferred. Like Narcos, that would have been terrible if Pablo Escobar had spoken English with an American accent.

@toddybell

I'm black and I agree with your MIL. Anne Boleyn wasn't Black so should be played by someone who factually represented who she was re: ethnicity . I'd feel the same if someone white came along and played Martin Luther King or Mary Jane Seacole or Harriet Seacole or Mahatma Ghandi, etc.

I agree. It's almost reverse racism, like trying too hard. Real black people should be played by black actors, Chinese should be played by Chinese actors, white should be played by white actors. We need more fictional plays, movies, soaps etc that just have different races in them. It's simple. You can almost predict in adverts now, the family will be black dad, white mum and two mixed race children. There's never an Asian Mum and a black man. Or a Chinese couple, or Polish couple yet I know more couples like this!! There are more same sex couples which is good, but even the BT advert depicted them in bed! The world's gone mad

It’s casting a white person with a black actor for the sake of it

[quote Kooksadooks]@Notamaidenname I am concerned about DP. He also shared his views to me about immigration not long after MILs comments and honestly I am shocked, this is the first time he has shared views like this to me and in the past has said the opposite. I am an immigrant myself and I think a pile up of ‘small’ comments has led me to feeling this way.[/quote]
Your issue is a lot more than a single comment about Anne Boleyn, which is why I didn't want to say I agree with your MIL. Besides the single line of 'Anne Boleyn shouldn't be played by a Black woman because she was a real white person', the rest of what she says and the undertone I got from it isn't someone I want to be on the side of. The typical 'anti-woke/anti-pc' brigade. I have no time for such people as they usually have a hidden agenda.

As for your DP, I think it's a day of reckoning for you. You may want to have important conversations and ask important questions to know where you both stand on values. These are things people should know about each other in relationships.