Casual racism or AIBU

[Kooksadooks]

Hello. I have a lot on my mind today but hope you are having a nice New Years Eve…
We (me, DP, MIL, FIL, DS ect) were sat around the TV over Christmas period.
The Channel 5 advert featuring Anne Bolelyn played by black actress Jodie Turner-Smith comes on and MIL starts complaining that she ‘doesn’t understand all this’ and ‘Anne Bolelyn wasn’t black’ and doesn’t understand ‘why white people cannot play black people’…
I bit my tongue, I appreciate that I am surrounded by people who agree with her and there’s no point in arguing with them about what I think, also not wanting to cause drama over Christmas but AIBU to feel uncomfortable at MIL’s comments?
I mentioned it to DP afterwards and he agrees with MIL

Mixed race Ben Kingsley (born Krishna Pandit Bhanji) won an Oscar for playing Gandhi is i believe a more accurate description.

Would be more concerned with DP.

It’s embarrassing that people feel a black actor can’t play a white fictional or non fictional character. We are not so bothered if their nationality, religion, hair or eye colour are different, even the facial features of that person are clearly not the same as the actual person, we all accept that it is an actor playing in a fictional retelling, not the ‘real’ person in a reality programme. Often historical programs get lots of things wrong about dress, architecture etc too. But if the actors are black that is where we draw the line?

@TrishM80

Google Ben Kingsley real name. To correct your incorrect assumption.

I’d just say, “It’s been done in theatre for years!” and move on.

I know that it’s theoretically possible but I’ve never heard someone start off like this and, if given the chance to expand on their thoughts, not end up spouting unarguably racist crap that would slide right into the Daily Fail comments section. Usually with reference to ‘political correctness gone mad’, ‘woke’, ‘snowflakes’ and ‘the Muslims.’

Oops. I missed ‘virtue signalling’.

@Notamaidenname I am concerned about DP. He also shared his views to me about immigration not long after MILs comments and honestly I am shocked, this is the first time he has shared views like this to me and in the past has said the opposite. I am an immigrant myself and I think a pile up of ‘small’ comments has led me to feeling this way.

@Notjustanymum

Your MIL’s argument falls down on the point that the actor playing Anne Boleyn is acting! I’m pretty sure that one of the requirements for David Tennant to play Dennis Nielsen WASN’T that he had actually lived as a serial killer for a while…

On that basis maybe Jodie Turner-Smith should have played the part of Dennis Nielsen instead of David Tennant?

Being annoyed when tv shows aren’t historically accurate isn’t racist on its own (though I think it’s much more realistic to enjoy these kind of shows as a kind of historically inspired fiction).

But if it’s part of a wider pattern of behaviour of course it should be called out.

Have you seen Maxine Peake’s Hamlet?

Ben Kingsley may be British but he is not white. And I think we can all dredge up instances of white people playing black people in the past.

Times have changed now and I think a blatant one rule for one and not for the other in this instance is not a good idea.

White actor Ben Kingsley won an Oscar for playing Mahatma Gandhi!

@TrishM80- Ben Kingsley is mixed-race and was born Krishna Pandit Bhanji to a father with Gujarati Indian roots. He played Gandhi spectacularly (even though they did bronze him up quite heavily (Asian face?) for my liking) and was more believable as Gandhi because of his heritage than say Daniel Craig or Benedict Cumberbatch would've been.

I think black people deserve their own stories to be told instead of casting a black actor for a role in a movie about a white woman who’s story has been told numerous times already.

I'm black and would also point out as others have said racism can't be "casual".

I would also say that maybe you should re-evaluate your rship with your DP, because clearly he has no respect for you in the comments you've mentioned here.
Those are his views, you can't change that, however they are inconsiderate and don't align with you as his partner.

Are the people here complaining about a black Anne B also anti-Hamilton?

@WhatScratch

Have you seen Maxine Peake’s Hamlet?

Yeah, but Shakespeare's Hamlet isn't an actual historical person.

The problem is with historical dramas that a lot of people don't know history beyond them.
Anne Boleyn was both a user of and a victim of the political, religious and class shifts at the time she lived. Her being the daughter of a merchant, as opposed to a princess meant she was beheaded instead of divorced and paid off.
If you make the character black it looks like it was all motivated by racism, but this wasn't a factor in her fate.
She's a real person so I think her story deserves to be told within a reasonable degree of accuracy. There are also lots of exciting stories that centre historical black people but they don't get made as much which is a shame.
The dynamic would be ok with an all black cast, but just her is virtue signalling and shock value.

@TrishM80 you don’t know much about Ben Kingsley, do you?

@doadeer

But Anne Boleyn is not a character like James Bond, she was a real person.

My apologies, I wasn't aware of Kingsley's Indian heritage! As a pp said though, they did bronze him up for the role. Still a great movie though.

I totally agree with LaBellina.

I agree with your MIL.

However I hear Denzel Washington is playing MacBeth and I cannot wait to see it. Supremely talented and one of my favourite actors in my favourite Shakespeare play, just brilliant. I also think that Idris Elba would have been a fantastic Bond too. The difference is that they’re fictional characters and anyone can and should play them..

I agree with your MIL in that Anne Boleyn's ethnicity - and quite a lot about her appearance - is known. Accuracy in historical writing/depiction matters to me, as far as it is possible.

I am autistic which may be a factor; my obsessive interest is early modern history. I did my degree in it and have written a couple of historical novels. I have wasted spent huge amounts of time researching all the portraits and sketches of Anne Boleyn (and various other figures) and trying to work out which is the most accurate. I have Holbein and Hilliard portraits on my walls. I didn't like The Tudors either, because Jonathan Rhys-Meyers is all wrong for Henry VIII (and not just in his appearance). I don't like The Other Boleyn Girl, because it's so cavalier with the facts that it might as well be a completely fictional story that just borrows names from history.

I suspect there are a LOT of people who wince at the casting in this drama but wouldn't say so IRL, because they don't want to be considered racist.

[quote Genderwitched]@doadeer

But Anne Boleyn is not a character like James Bond, she was a real person.[/quote]
Yes I understand this. I actually have a Masters in Early Modern History 🤣

For me... If an adaptation has been done to death like the Tudors have been... Having a different interpretation that is historically inaccurate is fine. Look at how many black actors do Shakespeare plays at the Globe. It's an adaptation. Most series or films about the period are littered with inaccuracies anyway! From costumes to accents - it's entertainment not a documentary.

I can see both sides to the argument, I couldn’t get into Chernobyl because I just couldn’t get past the English language and British accents, totally jarring and for me unwatchable.

Neither was McBeth fictional.