Caused upset!

[Mellowyellow222]

We had a family gathering on Boxing Day.

We have a cousin who has recently reconnected with the family. He is my mums cousin, and we don’t really know him. This was the first time meeting his wife. They are in their early sixties and have recently married.

He introduced himself to my two nieces as their uncle Fred, and couple used the term aunt and uncle repeatedly to all the children there. They hadn’t met any of the children before so didn’t know their names - or if they were even in the family. One Niece asked me quietly afterwards who he was and if he was really her uncle.

I explained that he was a type of cousin so no not really an uncle but some people use that term for wider family members - we don’t in our family and only parents siblings are called aunt and uncle. But I explained he was just being friendly.

This mans wife overheard and they have now made a big deal about not be made to feel welcome and how we don’t accept them as family? My parents think I should apologise.

This is bonkers right? He isn’t her uncle - how else was I supposed to explain this? I am not sure what I am apologising for so I have refused.

It sounds like he is a first cousin once removed (from you) and twice removed from your niece.

I do think we don't have good names for these relations in the English language. Cousin Sally doesn't sound as warm as Aunt Sally.

Anyway, they sound bonkers.

@Cocomarine really, in Ireland? Maybe a regional thing then. I'm way way rural South, (falling off the end!) and would not be the done thing here

When my children were young in the 80s my next door neighbour would refer to herself as 'auntie Joan' when talking to them, used to annoy the hell out of me.

I always just used her name when talking to them about her, she wasn't their aunt.

Likewise this man isn't your nieces uncle and his wife is most definitely not your nieces aunt.

I think your answer was absolutely fine.

Absolutely do not apologise.

@BusterGonad

I get a bit creeped out when adults are referred to as 'uncles/aunties' when they quite clearly are not. Its too familiar for my liking and gives them too much authority over young children.

Absolutely agree with this x

@itsgettingweird

I'd ask the person asking you to apologise to clarify that

"You want me to apologise for saying he's a cousin (truth), not an uncle in the sense niece understands (truth), and some families use aunt and uncle for elder relatives - but we generally don't (truth)"

This.

I'd be very wary of someone that I hadn't seen in 30 years kicking up a fuss like that.

Very strange.

Great excuse to avoid them.

They reek of drama.

@Mellowyellow222

I had wondered if it was a cultural issue. She is from Wales - we are in Ireland.

But manners are universal and it seems odd to create such a fuss over such a little thing the first time you meet people.

I’m of African heritage, it’s normal to call anyone who is your parents age uncle/aunty, your grandparents age grandma/grandpa, anyone your age is your cousin, and younger would be your niece/nephew. We just find it easier that way. My daughter has just had a baby, and has asked me what he is in relation to her cousins, and I had to look it up! Maybe that’s how your extended family member and his wife were brought up?

This topic has come up before and an awful lot of MNers are very literal about the use of ‘aunt’ and ‘uncle’ being reserved specifically for the siblings of parents and their spouses only.

I grew up in north-west England with family across the region and in north Wales. It was considered very normal to address any older family member, regardless of specific relationships, as ‘auntie’ and ‘uncle’, as well as close family friends. I went to a preschool where the children addressed the staff as ‘Auntie X’ and it was so long-established that the preschool was universally known as ‘Auntie June’s.’ It implies a degree of respect and trust. It would have been considered overfamiliar to address those adults by their name only. It would always be initiated by our parents and it was a tacit signal that this was a trustworthy adult.

All of which is secondary to your OP! You’ve done nothing wrong and like you I would be very wary of a virtual stranger trying to crowbar himself and his wife into the family like this.

We called our more distant cousins (some of whom were 70 years older than us, lot of generational shifts) "Cousin (firstname)". Some friends of parents had the honorific "aunty/uncle" and it can be a nice thing, but the difference being it was never self awarded and certainly not on first contact.

I don't think you've done anything to apologise for and would be avoiding further contact with Uncle and Aunty Drama Llama.

@ThanksItHasPockets

This topic has come up before and an awful lot of MNers are very literal about the use of ‘aunt’ and ‘uncle’ being reserved specifically for the siblings of parents and their spouses only.

I grew up in north-west England with family across the region and in north Wales. It was considered very normal to address any older family member, regardless of specific relationships, as ‘auntie’ and ‘uncle’, as well as close family friends. I went to a preschool where the children addressed the staff as ‘Auntie X’ and it was so long-established that the preschool was universally known as ‘Auntie June’s.’ It implies a degree of respect and trust. It would have been considered overfamiliar to address those adults by their name only. It would always be initiated by our parents and it was a tacit signal that this was a trustworthy adult.

All of which is secondary to your OP! You’ve done nothing wrong and like you I would be very wary of a virtual stranger trying to crowbar himself and his wife into the family like this.

All of this. There are big regional and (though we are never supposed to mention this on MN) class differences in what families consider normal. But there isn't a right or wrong, there is just the norm for your family - which is what the OP told her DD.

What was wrong - and weird - was the reaction.

They sound like the kind of people who likely get offended over everything.

I have lots of “aunts and uncles” who are exactly the term we are using here, not actually aunts and uncles but extended relatives and family friends considered as family.

You’re explanation was correct but clearly was misinterpreted or taken to heart. I wouldn’t apologise as such, but maybe just clarify what you were saying and if they still take offence and get upset then step back and leave them to have a whinge because sadly some people are just like that.

“ Fred and wife, I realise you are upset about something said to niece. I apologise if you’ve interpreted what I said to mean we don’t think you are family. I was explaining to niece that in the literal sense, you are not an uncle, but that it’s a term many use for extended family because it’s much easier than saying “second cousin Fred 8 times removed” or whatever. Also by saying we don’t tend to use it in the family, again this wasn’t implying anything to you, it was simply a factual term - until now, we havn’t. If we do from now on that’s fine. Of course you are family, you are just newly reunited and niece was curious. No offence or implications were meant at all. You are back in our lives, let’s move on.”

They sound like people who like to cause dissension in a group, so they can worm themselves closer by playing victim.

Were you the only one to have this reaction to them OP? Did any one else mention the uncle/aunty thing before your conversation with your niece?

What a twat.

@Shinychestnuts

A few red flags here op.

First that they were over-familiar and insisting on being called Aunt & Uncle when they are not. Second that they are making you feel guilty for not playing along. Third that they complained to your parents about it. I'd be wary. There may be a very good reason he was a "distant" cousin in the first place.

I think you have hit the nail on the head op. Your mum's cousin has probably over-played his connection to your family in order to impress his new wife and is trying to be something he isn't ; "I come from a large and loving family etc" and she believed him. So she's shooting the messenger and he doesn't enjoy being called out.

Your parents should have defended you! I would have been cross with them for not doing so.

I am really not a red flag ite but this went through my head too.....Be wary OP.....also its not up to people, especially strangers, to decide what they will be called by YOUR children. When I was a child and dinosaurs roamed the earth, I had an aunt and an uncle who were my mother's cousin and her husband and yes it was the done thing then....but even then it was done by agreement and not foisted on the family.

In my (very extended) family, Auntie and Uncle are affectionate terms, but also a mark of respect. I have several nephews who I'm not genetically related to and who are also older than me. I am also Auntie to their children. It fills me with joy to be accepted into a huge extended family in this way, particularly when the family I am genetically related to is tiny and often not very nice.

Your daughter has clearly said that these people make her feel uncomfortable.

They make you feel uncomfortable.

They haven't been a part of the family for decades and perhaps there is a reason for that?

I'd suggest to your parents that no apology is necessary and they should be alert to the motivations for this couple coming back on the scene.

I also called my godparents anutie/uncle even though none of them were related to my parents.

The issue as many are picking up on is that they suddenly decided they had the right to decide they wanted the titles of "Auntie and Uncle" - that's not on. Your parents are in the wrong supporting them to do so.

What can you do OP? Can you talk to your parents again? You've done nothing wrong, but red flag city Arizona how new "cousin" has manipulated the situation to make YOU the bad guy when in fact they were acting entitled and over-familiar.

@TroublesomeTrucks

In my (very extended) family, Auntie and Uncle are affectionate terms, but also a mark of respect. I have several nephews who I'm not genetically related to and who are also older than me. I am also Auntie to their children. It fills me with joy to be accepted into a huge extended family in this way, particularly when the family I am genetically related to is tiny and often not very nice.

yes indeed but that's what you do in your family/culture. Its neither right nor wrong, but it IS wrong for someone to unilaterally expect it regardless of the wishes of the parents.

I only called my parents siblings and their spouses Aunt or Uncle, along with my maternal grandma's siblings (didn't know any siblings of other grandparents) and their spouses (who were my great - aunts and uncles). Cousins, close friends or other relations of my parents were just called by their first names. Our DC do the same - which is easy as I have no siblings and DH only has a sister and she is married.

I have 4 god-children who call me by my first name.

I think she has overheard and has has tuned in to the 'not in our family' part and taken this as you explaining they were not part of the family. (Otherwise they would know not use aunty and uncle). If that makes any sense?

Basically if your going to eavesdrop you might not like what you hear and that is the message I would be sending back, she heard half a story and jumped to the wrong conclusion.

I think you are right in thinking that she picked up on your distance and it probably fuelled her interpretation.

@godmum56 I am white British

Don't invite them again; they do sound a bit bonkers.

I wouldn't apologise either, I remember the same happening a cousin turned up when I was in my teens and my mother let him move in, it was very creepy having a strange man in his 60s hanging about.

I'd tell your parents that you are not apologising for telling your niece the truth, that she isn't even in the family so needs to butt out and stop eavesdropping on conversations that you are having with your own niece.