Scales just fell from eyes

[1potato]

So background is my partner and I have 2 kids under 2.5 following 2 dreadful pregnancies, have moved house multiple times recently and are currently renovating. So, stress levels are high.

My partner and I constantly argue about housework. All the time. I feel I have tried everything to balance the scales but no matter what, they never balance. I am always doing the vast majority. Like he doesn't even realise how much there is to do. He's improved and getting there but just somehow doesn't seem able to do the right amount to keep us afloat. I know it isn't an unusual story but but house is ALWAYS a bomb site. I hate living like this. I am pretty sure other people don't live lile this.

Tonight he made a comment and I feel he revealed his true thoughts about our roles in the relationship. A month ago I walked him through how to change over the kids clothes into the next size up (complex when saving bags for friends, saving for littler one etc). I have obviously done this multiple times. He was pleased and ordered some name tags for drawers 'trousers', 'vests' etc. Anyway tonight he just said 'the kids drawers are only organised thanks to me.' I am absolutely flabbergasted by the arrogance and feel ready to walk away.

YABU - calm down. You will get through this.

YANBU - He is lazy and arrogant and that's not going to change.

We had 3 children under 5, two jobs (I had only 12 weeks maternity leave) and a tiny house - it was not an easy time all the time. The best thing I ever did was deciding to presume the best of dh. To remember I married him because I thought he was a decent kind guy (he was) and he probably wasn't trying to annoy me on purpose when he said something. I cut him a lot of slack. He always cut me a lot of slack.

This could be me.
Remember why you fell in love. Why you decided to get married. Why you decided to have dc together. Him not rejoicing in what seems like a vastly overcomplicated 'system' of putting clothes aside really isn't something to split up over.

[quote NewbieAlert]@AnneLovesGilbert before children he was awesome! But then we both worked full time. We left the house at 7am and returned at 6pm and it looked exactly the same.
When our first DC came along I was a SAHM and everything fell to me. I actually agreed to this because I had no idea what was to come. I appreciate with experience that was naive.
I kept on top of it with one DC. It wasn’t until our second came along that I realised I couldn’t do it all.

Tbf he isn’t lazy or incompetent. He just didn’t appreciate what being at home with DC was like, because he had never done it. Neither had I, hence why I agreed to be a SAHM [/quote]
Im confused are you the OP?

@1potato

OK just to be clear about the clothes (or maybe making myself sound more insane). I'm a big believer in passing on clothes. Some clothes have been lent to us so need to be boxed up ready to return. Some are OK to be boxed up ready for the smaller child to use in a few months. Some just need to be thrown away. It's a little complex as the kids are so close in age. And I agree that doing it this way has made things annoying but there we go.

But the issue wasn't spending 10 mins showing my partner in the hopes that he would also take some responsibility, It was his comment this evening that seemed to take credit for it all because he added name tags.

But obviously this is all illustrative of bigger issues around housework rather than a standalone issue, as I have explained.

Will come back to the many helpful comments as soon as I have a second. Thank you.

If you have systems as complicated as the clothes, it's no wonder there are issues.

Really, is there a need for both of you to know what clothes are borrowed and who they need to be returned to -surely the clothes management should be the responsibility of one. What happens if your DH decides something is two small/unwearable and puts in the wrong box/charity bag/bins it and you then notice it missing and feels he shouldn't have done whatever he did with it. Simplify the whole process.

Maybe you sometimes say to your DH that you've a good system for this or that and he now feels he's a good labelling system going now for the clothes.

Sometimes the final straw can be the most minimal thing that's happened but it's inevitably become impossible to see past.
Constant picking at somebody until they finally just snap and have had enough, might sound silly to say it's over clothes tags, but it's more than that it's over clothes tags, this time then there's a next time, and a next time it's about how long you can cope with being poked.
Sounds like you've had enough & it's completely understandable I'm sure there's so many people out there with the same scenario or at least similar who just couldn't take the 'thanks to me' comments anymore.

Honestly, you’re overreacting. Yes it was a shitty comment but unless there’s a massive backstory, honestly this is not the end of the world. It’s not clear from your posts if you are still a SAHM or going back to work after this Mat leave. Also, pick your battles! Why bother ‘walking him through sorting out clothes’?! Just do it yourself and get him to do something else that requires less explaining. Surely?

Lol on the focus on the clothes system. DP actually just asked me who made me laugh as I was reading all these messages. Love the idea that I am somehow creating these monstrously complex domestic system and baffling my DP into submission.

@GrumpyLivesInMyHouseNow yeah he’s lucky to be breathing after that quip. But for me it’s the condescending and belittling attitude behind it that would worry me. A turning point for me in my first marriage was at a wedding, the game was each person put in £5 to guess the length of all the speeches. Winner got the pot. Then husband asks me my guess, once we’d all submitted them. He openly laughs and basically says to the table what an idiotic answer. Of course l get the closest time on our table and ultimately at the wedding. But yeah lm just an idiot That was a turning point for me in hindsight

I am a bloke and my wife is just the same - "I didnt get married to housework". She cooks generally - I seem to do everything else.
Life is not fair or equal and so, I have made a pact with myself and hope it comes to pass. Wasting life is not worth it, enjoy it and do what needs to be done - your time will come.

@1potato

Lol on the focus on the clothes system. DP actually just asked me who made me laugh as I was reading all these messages. Love the idea that I am somehow creating these monstrously complex domestic system and baffling my DP into submission.

You asked for opinions and a fair few responses have explained that your system sounds unnecessarily un-user friendly and yet here you are, not wanting to hear alternative opinions.

Why did you post?

But you used the word complex, more than once, I suspect you're part of the problem.

You are a SAHP right now. You have a cleaner. So the things like sorting clothes falls to you especially if you have a particular way of doing things.

It sounds like you’re not happy and you’re trying to find things to justify it.
Is it just the stress of renovating that is causing you to argue or do you think your relationship is just not working anymore?

Why bother ‘walking him through sorting out clothes’?! Just do it yourself and get him to do something else that requires less explaining. Surely?

I think this.

@1potato, your comment

‘I also agree with counselling and have suggested it a couple of times. He isn't keen as I think he think it means we're at the end.’

This is why you both need to embark upon an overhaul of how you both communicate. You are both (& you in particular) are running empty on fumes: two heavy duty pregnancies in a very short period of times, therefore two small children, multiple moves & not yet settled due to renovations. You are both (& you in particular) are firefighting the chaos of everyday life…& oh, Covid & lockdown.

You are both (& you in particular) are reaching the end of the proverbial tether. So you are both reverting to your own preferred forms of operation & not getting to grips with what must be done to keep you all friendly & sane.

Please discuss the situation with him, suggest counselling & then book a session at Relate now before the festive rush. Never mind what you think he might think & that you think he might think the end is nigh etc.
Too much assumption about what the other thinks & both of you not getting to grips with what is going on between you. The bickering is not good for either of you or your children. Book the session, sort out the childcare so that you can both go.

Go to the first session on your own if he is reluctant, show that you mean business & that you want change. So far, words between you are going round in circles & actions speak louder than words. If he has half a grain of sense, he’ll be in the first session with you.

Labelled drawers ? He’s watching too much MarieK & StaceyS on telly.

Both of you are drifting through the chaos & what is good & lovely between you can slip away, you both need help to get a grip.

@timeisnotaline It’s hardly weird to have a box of clothes labelled boys 1-2yo summer. that’s not weird at all. I have 5 children OPs system sound unnecessarily. Bag for clothes going to charity, bag for clothes being returned to lender, bag to be passed down. Even if her dp put everything away ignoring the system it’s the work of minutes to go through them.

OP if it isn’t the clothes and the house is cleaned every other week and you presumably do it in between as you aren’t out at work, what is it?

I feel like he was pushing your buttons, seeing if you’ll react... maybe he wanted an argument.

Thank you for all your comments here. Lots and lots to take on board. To answer a few questions and points...

1. He is gentle and arrogant and stubborn and kind and patient and impatient all in imperfect measure in that wonderful mix that all humans are. Difficult to summarise on a mumsnet thread.

1. Yes I have been in abusive relationships in the past which is why I'm always fearful of being an abuser and don't have great skills on setting boundaries.

1. I think the clothes thing is not a complex as I've made it sound. But less complex will be good - duly noted. Obviously easier when they're no longer doubling in size every other month.

1. To those that said you sound exhausted. Spot on. We're the walking dead right now.

1. We have spoken this evening and on some advice received here allocated up tasks for the weeks ahead. I think knowing who is responsible for what is half the battle when firefighting. Let's see where we get to with this plan.

1. We have also spoken about counselling and he's agreed to go. We need to learn how to communicate. Especially about clothing systems. He's not keen but at least open to being wrong about it.

1. I flagged the comment he made about the clothes and explained how and why it upset me and he explained that since doing the labels he thought he'd been taking responsibility for that chore. It's more like 50/50 on that front but at least it makes a bit more sense now and we've stepped back from the brink.

Thanks again. Head much clearer now.

[quote UniversalAunt]@1potato, your comment

‘I also agree with counselling and have suggested it a couple of times. He isn't keen as I think he think it means we're at the end.’

This is why you both need to embark upon an overhaul of how you both communicate. You are both (& you in particular) are running empty on fumes: two heavy duty pregnancies in a very short period of times, therefore two small children, multiple moves & not yet settled due to renovations. You are both (& you in particular) are firefighting the chaos of everyday life…& oh, Covid & lockdown.

You are both (& you in particular) are reaching the end of the proverbial tether. So you are both reverting to your own preferred forms of operation & not getting to grips with what must be done to keep you all friendly & sane.

Please discuss the situation with him, suggest counselling & then book a session at Relate now before the festive rush. Never mind what you think he might think & that you think he might think the end is nigh etc.
Too much assumption about what the other thinks & both of you not getting to grips with what is going on between you. The bickering is not good for either of you or your children. Book the session, sort out the childcare so that you can both go.

Go to the first session on your own if he is reluctant, show that you mean business & that you want change. So far, words between you are going round in circles & actions speak louder than words. If he has half a grain of sense, he’ll be in the first session with you.

Labelled drawers ? He’s watching too much MarieK & StaceyS on telly.

Both of you are drifting through the chaos & what is good & lovely between you can slip away, you both need help to get a grip.[/quote]
Thank you for this comment in particular. This is exactly how it is right now. Extreme chaos. I will book a session.

Tried to quote the above comment add my own but it didn't work. Just wanted to say thank you so much for your insights. You're exactly right and I will book a session.

The OP is on maternity leave - that's time to physically recover from birth and to focus on the baby. It doesn't automatically follow that she should therefore be responsible for more of the domestic tasks during that time. Her children are both small - It's not comparable to a sahp whose dc are older and settled and where a conscious decision has been made for one parent to sah and take formal responsibility for the house.

I'm glad you've been able to talk and that the thread helped you. Sometimes a seemingly little issue can tip a person over the edge if they are under stress.

Glad you had a good talk. I think the thing that is most annoying about the labels is that, presumably, you don't even need them because you just know what is in each drawer because it is always you who puts the clothes away. So he has solved a problem (not knowing how to put the kids' clothes away) that would not even exist, if he been pulling his weight from the start, or even just helping a couple of times a week to get them dressed.

Well done for not reacting.
I have been in a similar situation and we are fine now - however it was rough for a while.
My best bit of advice is this - when he says something thoughtless/infuriating/rude... call him out for it right away.
I have said things like 'that sounded rude, what do you mean exactly'
or 'that is a hurtful thing to say, can you explain why you said it' and even 'you are upsetting me, please stop speaking now I need a moment and you need to find a better way of saying what you are saying'

It sounds daft looking at it now but seriously it made him think about his words and made him know what upset me. It opened conversations about expectations, boundaries and ways to work together.

I hope that this helps

Read "Fair Play" by Eve Rodsky. I think it would help you and DH.

@badg3r

Glad you had a good talk. I think the thing that is most annoying about the labels is that, presumably, you don't even need them because you just know what is in each drawer because it is always you who puts the clothes away. So he has solved a problem (not knowing how to put the kids' clothes away) that would not even exist, if he been pulling his weight from the start, or even just helping a couple of times a week to get them dressed.

This! So much this!

Don't break up now! This is THE most stressful time of your lives, with 2 little ones, it will push you both to the edge. It WILL get easier!

I recommend leaving him a written list of chores, that are his weekly responsibility (sometimes they need it in writing). Try to get a weekly cleaner if you can.

But also, try to live with the mess, try to ignore it... nobody has labels on their drawers. You will have to let some things go. He does need to pull his weight more, but pick your battles. From age 5 it is much easier.

@Aderyn21

The OP is on maternity leave - that's time to physically recover from birth and to focus on the baby. It doesn't automatically follow that she should therefore be responsible for more of the domestic tasks during that time. Her children are both small - It's not comparable to a sahp whose dc are older and settled and where a conscious decision has been made for one parent to sah and take formal responsibility for the house.

I'm glad you've been able to talk and that the thread helped you. Sometimes a seemingly little issue can tip a person over the edge if they are under stress.

Yes I think this is a big part of the problem. I've found that when I go on mat leave I slip into this weird hinterland of taking care of the house I'm between the childcare as I am there but also massively resenting doing that because it's not what I signed up to.